George Roland Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 Hi, This is my first post to this forum though I have been reading it with great interest for a few days now. I would like to hear others' experiences regarding what I am proposing to do, and to be able to ask a number of specific questions. Please bear in mind that I not an engineer or an electronics pro, I'm just a music lover who'd like to tweak a pair of K-horns. Okay here goes.... I bought a pair of 1977-vintage K-horns on e-Bay last month. They are in rough shape physically but function well. I purchased Bob Crites' upgraded network designed to go with his CT-125 tweeters, installed those items and have been enjoying listening to them. Next, I am interested in trying Altec 511B horns with my K55V drivers and Bob's network and tweeters--really just swapping out the midrange horn. If I were to do this, what changes might I expect to hear in the sound? Will there be any problems with the sound with the crossovers between the mid and bass horn? Thanks, George Roland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 I suspect that you would have problems in that the Khorn bass bin crosses over at 400Hz and the 511's Fc is at 500Hz, leaving you with a gap. But I also think that some here are running a configuration like that, hopefully, they will chime in and tell you how they did it. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 As D-MAN points out, the lowest recomended crossover for the 511 is 500hz. But folks have used this horn in K-horns for quite some time with improved results over the stock k-400. Al has a graph on his site which super imposes the k-400 and 511, they look close. Sound wise, a different story. The 511 broadens the sweet spot and increase listening detail over the stock k-400. The smaller the room, the greater of an improvement you will notice. However, the stock AA type networks have a very wide slope. Greater imaging detail can be realized using an xover with steeper slopes. I'm going to send you a PM with more info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerwoodKhorns Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 I suspect that you would have problems in that the Khorn bass bin crosses over at 400Hz and the 511's Fc is at 500Hz, leaving you with a gap. But I also think that some here are running a configuration like that, hopefully, they will chime in and tell you how they did it. DM A lot of peopel here run the 511B's and say that they work great with the K Horn. I am currently selling a pair of 511b's and a pair of JBL 2470 drivers (Phemolics) if you are interested. I also have a pair of K77 clones for sale but I do not know if that will give you an improvement or not. Here is teh thread where I have them listed: http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/thread/763834.aspx Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestonTom Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 George, Congratulations on the K-Horns. I am going to be a heretic and suggest that you simply spend the next few months listening to the K-Horns before you start modifying them. You have refreshed the crossovers (in case the caps were worn out) that might be enough for the first go-around. K-Horns are pretty good speakers in their stock configuration. You can get a good deal of benefit by simply following the recommended advice about making sure they are snug in the corners, locating the listening chair at a 45deg angle to the face of the cabinet, etc. If you follow my advice, and many will contradict me, you will first get a good feel for their sound, and how they sound in your room. If you hear terrible deficits, then by all means tackle those problems and start modifying. My advice simply states that you should modify problems that you have identified, rather than modding for the sake of modding. Good Luck, -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 George, Good to see you posting on the forum. I tried to answer your emails, but always get them bounced back from your server. I am getting emails from you. Bob Crites Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 What Tom said. good advice, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Klappenberger Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 George, I have done response tests with the K55V driver mounted on an Altec 511b horn. That combination goes down to 400 Hz with no problem. DO IT! It will sound much better than the stock K400 horn! Al k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 If you don't listen very loud, I suspect you can be happy with where you're at for a long time to come. With Bob's modded Type A and new tweeter, you've taken a bit of the load off the K-400, which has lowered distortion some. Some think that horn starts beaming as it reaches the old crossover point, so you've helped things here too with the new networks. If there is a problem, it will be when you push the volume. Some people think the pinchy/harsh sound that comes forward is glorious -- I'm not one of them. If you enjoy live level listening with low distortion you're going to have to move away from the K-400. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnysal Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 Tom has given you good advise. Listen for a good long time to the k-horns and get an idea of what they lack before starting to mod. Once the crossovers are refreshed, other upstream equipment is optimized and the room itself is optimized then I think you can begin to consider mods. I have no argument with those who have swapped out mids and tweeters. I dothink that if one is going to swap horns they shoudl consider taking the opportunity to upgrade drivers as well. the stock drivers are certainly adequate but there exist higher quality, higher performance drivers out there. Look to Altec, JBL, TAD, etc. for upgrade options. Best regards, Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEC Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 Please note that not everyone who tries another horn prefers the other horn to the K-400. Just seems that those who do prefer another horn are louder than those who don't. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 I don't think it's because we're louder, I think it's because we outnumber them by a pretty good margin. As far as this forum goes, the only three I know about all live in Arkansas. Honestly, it seems odd that with as much that goes on around here, we've never had a single person start a thread that says -- "I've tried 'em all, and I'm stay'in with the K-400." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Roland Posted July 18, 2006 Author Share Posted July 18, 2006 Tom, Thanks, Tom! There is wisdom in what you say. I did the pipe-insulation foam tweak to get the bass bins tight in the corners which tightened things up a lot. I play acoustic guitar ( another hobby that's a sinkhole for money and a source of potential wifely disapproval). The last couple of guitars I bought, I played alternately for about six months before I was truly able to decide on one over another, to fully apprecaite their individual strengths and how they fit me. There's much to be gained from simply living with them for awhile. Best, George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seadog Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 I went to the 511b over a year ago, and I will not go back to stock. Also, I like to cover as wide of a frequency range as possible with that mid horn, so I personally would be reluctant in dropping the crossover point from 6000 to 4500 hz using the 511b (IMO of course). Compared to the stock mid horn, I think that the 511b offers a cleaner sound which improves imaging. It also creates a much larger sweet spot in my room. (BTW, my Khorns have AK-3 crossovers). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Roland Posted July 18, 2006 Author Share Posted July 18, 2006 Bob, Thanks! I am truly enjoying your network and tweeters--a definite improvement! If you have time to resend your e-mails, I'd love to read them. seems to be working for most correspondents. My college keeps changing our e-mail addresses and the latest one has been a disaster. Best, George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestonTom Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Tom, Thanks, Tom! There is wisdom in what you say. I did the pipe-insulation foam tweak to get the bass bins tight in the corners which tightened things up a lot. I play acoustic guitar ( another hobby that's a sinkhole for money and a source of potential wifely disapproval). The last couple of guitars I bought, I played alternately for about six months before I was truly able to decide on one over another, to fully apprecaite their individual strengths and how they fit me. There's much to be gained from simply living with them for awhile. Best, George George, I am glad the pipe foam tweak worked out for you. It really can make a difference and at that price it is a no-brainer. Enjoy the K-Horns, they really are something special. -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Klappenberger Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 George, I am not sure, but you name rings a bell. I think you emailed me and I responded but I got one email delivery error notice after another. Did you email me and not receive and answer? Was that you? AL K. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Roland Posted July 19, 2006 Author Share Posted July 19, 2006 Al, Yes it was. My college IT_NET people keep changing my e-mail address, and it has played hob with bouncing e-Mails. I am very interested in what you have to say in response to my inquiries. If you want to try and resend your replies, try That seems to work, or, perhaps cut and paste the text to me here on the Klipsch forum. I looked at your Belle Klipsch mods. Nice work! George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Might I also suggest tackling room acoustics before playing with new drivers/horns. You're talking +-3dB in the differences between horns when the room is +-20dB. http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html And for the sake of stating it, I'm not an altec fan [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cut-Throat Posted July 20, 2006 Share Posted July 20, 2006 Al, Yes it was. My college IT_NET people keep changing my e-mail address, and it has played hob with bouncing e-Mails. I am very interested in what you have to say in response to my inquiries. If you want to try and resend your replies, try That seems to work, or, perhaps cut and paste the text to me here on the Klipsch forum. I looked at your Belle Klipsch mods. Nice work! George I also tried to re-send my e-mail response to you 4 times. It just does not work! - Your server keeps rejecting them! BTW - I'm in the camp that is a firm believer in modifying the Mid-range of the Khorn. I use Altec 288-16K drivers with an Altec 1005b Horn. Also use Bob Crites tweeters. @allegheny.edu> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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