thefluffy

I was doing my usual ebay search when I came across this: http://cgi.ebay.com/Klipsch-Jubilee-CLONES_W0QQitemZ290340680071QQcmdZViewItemQQptZSpeakers_Subwoofers?hash=item4399a73187&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 These look to be SSCTROJAN's Klipsch Jubilee Clones. Now, this listing claims to be taking orders for manufacturing these. I can appreciate the desire to make these and listen to these. But, I take some issue with production and selling of these. I am pretty sure there are some legal issues here as well. Someone do correct me if I am wrong. Perhaps SSCTROJAN can confirm this is his ebay listing. I do not want this post to cause any arguing, etc. I just think people should see this. Daniel

Thanks for the input guys! I appreciate the comparison gigbyt. That is exactly what I was looking for. I am curious, what Tube Preamp did you use? I am contemplating using a Tubebuffer with a dac before a preamp. But, it is a pretty cheap chinese made tube buffer. So, my expectations are pretty low and it is mostly just for experimentation purposes. Gigbyt, what do u think about the CR-2020 versus the hk930 and hk730. That is a comparison I have really wanted to make. Thanks, Daniel

I'm very glad that a couple of you guys stood out to defend the vintage stuff. Honestly, I was starting to wonder if I was crazy. Especially when I read statements like: "Even the newer low priced consumer electronics sound better." Before the CR-1020 I had a brand new $200 Sony Stereo Reciever (i don't remember the model nor do I care to remember it) that I owned for about 4 days before I decided it wasn't even worth the $200 I spent on it and an 5 year old AIWA Stereo Reciever that I borrowed from my brother until I convinced my Dad to let me use his CR-1020. Neither one of these even touched the CR-1020. I mean, it was night and day. I noticed the differences between the AIWA and the Yamaha instantly without initially doing an A/B test with the two. It was that bad. Sadly, the AIWA even sounded better than the Sony. Granted, it wasn't near the difference between the Yammy and the AIWA. "The old gear from the 70-80s does not sound all that good (unless it was one of the few good high-end products. think thousands of dollars)." So, the definition of high end back in the late 70's (keep in mind I wasn't around then) was in the thousands of dollars? My dad paid somewhere around 600-700 dolloars for this CR-1020 back in 77 or 78 I believe. That was as much if not a little bit more than what he paid for his pair of Cornwalls that he bought with it. Keep in mind, he compared the 1020 to the Mcintosh seperates that Custom Audio had at the time that cost about 2x the price for the Pre and Power amps (I don't know which models these were). For the price, he heard no reason to buy the Mcintoshes over the Yamaha and he never regretted it. How much would that 600-700 $$ transform into these days for brand new audio equipment? I would have to guess around 2 - 3k? Please correct me if I am wrong. Russ, please don't hate me for contratadicting you. It is just that my findings heavily contrast the findings you have had. Maybe I just haven't heard the right "newer low priced consumer electronics." Now it sounds like me and Appleskinner might get along! I like that u compared the 1020 to the marantz, sansui, and Hks amps. That is a comparison that I have really wanted to make. I just haven't had the local opportunity. I am curious as to your thoughts on the Mcintosh stuff versus those Yamaha seperates. Granted, the Mcintosh stuff is definitely out of my price range. Thanks, Daniel

On a quick seperate note, the THD Figures on the Emotive are pretty high. Any thoughts on this? Daniel

Thanks for the input so far guys. One of the primary reasons I am looking at the vintage stuff is price. I simply don't have the finances to afford some of the newer seperate poweramps. Though, the Emotiva looks to be potentially affordable down the road. I don't particularly care about the 12v trigger on and off. I am ok with turning the power amps on seperately. I want the seperate power amps because I feel that most of the integrated AVRs that I have heard are lacking in the amplifier sections. This includes a couple of higher end yamaha's that I listened to at Custom Audio as well as the AVR 3803 and the 3808. I like the idea of being able to slowly piece it together to. It would be more affordable and easier for me to start with buying 1 power amp then buying another one until I have all the ones I need. Lastly, I really hope someone could answer my question. How do the Yamaha seperates such as the M-60/M-65 compare to the older CR-1020 and its brothers. I hope that doesn't rude. I really do appreciate the input so far especially Islander's input on the newer Yamahas compared to the Cr-1020. Thanks, Daniel

Bill, Thanks for the link. However for that price, I could get 2xM-60s. I'm trying to plan for a Home Theater set up down the road. I intend to eventually use seperate power amps for all my channels in that setup. I actually considered using multiple CR-1020s or possibly 2020s or 2040s for power amps. I'm just unsure I want to pay that much money per a power amp for my setup. Not to mention that it is impossible to find a replacement pot for the volume nobs. I am really curious if anyone has compared the sound and perforamnce of the M-60 and M-65 seperates to the late 70s era Yamaha integrated amps. Daniel

I have been enjoying my my Cornwalls and LaScalas through a CR-1020 Yamaha Integrated. I really enjoy the sound of it. Sadly, it is not mine to keep indefinitely. In planning for a future all heritage Home Theater set up, I have began considering some of the Yamaha seperates from the mid 80s. I've especially been look at the M-60 and M-65 power amps from Yamaha. Reviews on them are excellent and they seem to hold a great value for approx. $150 to 200 an amp. The auto class A on these also intrigues me. So, here are a couple questions. How does the sound of these amps compare to the CR-1020 I am currently using? Has anyone had an opportunity to compare these? I must say I really enjoy the sound of the CR-1020. To me, it sounds superior than the sound that is produced from my Dad's Denon AVR 3803 that replaced it in his set up. Additionally, how difficult would it be to use say 3 of these M-60 or possibly M-65 power amps with an Outlaw Audio Decoder/Preamp like the 990 or possibly a Denon AVR 3808. Any input would be greatly appreciated. I'm trying to figure all this out while I have the time to research. I'm currently deployed as a member of the USAF and have some free time to research this while I save the extra money I make while deployed. Thanks, Daniel

Hmmm, and here I am trying to gain weight! Daniel

Agreed. I seriously doubt its the driver. Probably the xover. Daniel

You are correct, the k-55-ms are made by EV. The k-55-vs are made by Atlas. If memory serves me correctly, the k-55-m does not have the nasty "come back" after they naturally roll of that the k-55-vs have. The older klipsch networks (AA or A for example) do not filter the the top end of the mid range. They are allowed to naturally rolled off. So, the k-55-vs naturally roll but come back in and sort of clash with the tweeters. That is one benefit of ALK's networks and the newer ak-4 network from Klipsch.They put a low-pass filter on the mid range. Having said that... I had an opportunity to compare k-55-vs to k-55-ms in lascalas in the same room. Honestly, I noticed basically no difference. The both sound extremely similar. I noticed a much larger difference between the AA networks versuses the AL networks. The only other info I can think of comparing the two is that I believe that EV no longer makes diaphrams for the k-55-ms where you can still purchase new k-55-vs (Atlas p-5d? that bob crites sells) as well as new diaphrams. Thought, I think Bob came up with a way to make the diaphrams from the k-55-v work on the k-55-ms. Daniel

I intend to see Tranformers at a Harkins Theater located here in OKC, OK. They have Klipsch sound systems that never fail to please me. I tried another theather locally that is newer. I don't remember the name, but I was disatisfied with the sound system. The theater locator is a handy tool for any Movie enthusiast and especially Klipsch enthusiasts. Daniel

Hmmm, Looks like you tried to look at it from a government computer. I get that crap all the time at work for completely legitimate stuff. Daniel

The Fortes are probably the best bet. However..... IF you are VERY patient, you may find some Cornwall's in mediocre shape for that price. I paid $450 for mine. But, they did need to be reveneered pretty badly. I only paid $400 for my lascalas. But once again, they had problems. One woofer was blown, they needed to be repainted, and the xover networks had some loose connections that needed to be repaired. Keep in mind, to get these, I had to watch Craigslist and Ebay on a daily basis about 3 times a day within a 500 mile radius of my house. It did take a fair amount of work to find them. That is why I say go for the Fortes instead. Daniel

Hmmm.... You guys are making me want a nice Sansui amp again..... [*-)] I suppose my Vintage Yammy will have to due for now. Daniel

I've read this thread a couple time through over the last couple days. Everytime I see the title... it really bugs me. I have heard statements similar to "Never pair Klipsch with a Yamaha." I use a Yamaha CR-1020 amplifier to power my LaScalas and my Cornwalls. I absolutely love the sound. I just don't think it is a valid blanket statement. Of course, my experience with the newer Yamahas is very limited. Sorry to interrupt the discussion and rant.... now back to business. []

Looks like the set up will be a blast! I'm jealous I can't make it now. The JBL CD Horn is very interesting. I'd love to hear that on the k-69 like you have it set up. Daniel

Sadly, I cannot attend now. Obligations of my job, Active Duty USAF, demand that I may or may not be in the US come time for the get together. Either way, I'm being told I cannot leave the local area at that time. [] What a bummer, I was really looking forward to it. I was especially looking forward to hearing the set up on Saturday. I haven't heard any of the large Klipsch systems. Have fun guys! Daniel

I recommend the towel method. Stuff a towel in the mid horn. I think it is the most effective way. Daniel

That is an awesome horn! Its great to see a drop in replacement for the K-400. I am curious, why a 500 Hz horn instead of 400 Hz? Is physical site the reason? Danel

Interesting comments about the hiss. I have a CR-1020 that my father purchased brand new in... '77ish. If I have a good input, I have next to no hiss with my Lascalas for Cornwalls. I believe the prior version you had was probably the 2020. Also, head over to Audiokarma for questions on the old yammies. There is atleast one person over there who knows just about all to know about them. I can't remember his name though.... Daniel

Those are beautiful speakers! Interesting about the tweeters. I thought the T-35 was Klipsch's replacement to the university tweeter. Since it is an early T-35, I would expect the Frequency response to be similar to the University. This is all if my memory serves me well.

That is a pretty bold statement. If this is really doing that much for bass extension, than you definitely have my attention. Can we get any numbers to back up the subjective observations? Daniel

Thanks for the bump! This is a great read! Daniel consider this a re-bump []

Hmmmm, I am very interested in reading this when it is posted! Daniel

Indeed, but it looks like the woofers are approaching their xmax at only 5 to 10 watt spikes. It just makes me wonder about the power rating of the Cornwall. Daniel