How are amps rated?

[jake08]

I have a 1983 denon POA 1500 amp.Thirty years of U hauls,kids, and K horns have worn the old girl out.Now she has to go to the electronics doctor regularly to have something soldered or fixed.So I decided to go amp shopping for the first time since 1983.During my travels I found a reciever that was rated at 200 w/channel at 7 channels or a total of 1400 watts.This reciever wieghs about 25 lbs.My denon wieghs in at about 60 lbs.When I asked a younger audio junkie about the difference he said the new reciever was digital and I would be better of judging amps by wieght rather than by what numbers were on the box.He explained that there was no way that the little transformers in that reciever could handle the current necessary to drive the horns.Since we were a couple of glasses (bottles) of wine past sober I didn't ask for an explaination.Then two days ago an A/V consultant came to my house to give me a quote on an entirely new 5.1 surrond and a new amp for the horns and he said the same thing.I am very confused.

[sebrof]

Hey Jake08, welcome to the forum.

I'll start off by saying I doubt I'm going to clear anything up for you.

My understanding is that digital amps (Class D?) weigh a lot less and are generally smaller (or can be smaller) than class A or AB amps. The reason for this is because they run cooler, and therefore do not need the heat sinks that more traditional amplifiers need. It could also be that the power transformer can be smaller as well. So, comparing class A or AB amps vs. digital amps based on weight does not make sense to me. Digital amp will always weigh much less.

From my point of view - I have my KHorns fed by a 4-watt amplifier, so even if the new receiver is severely over rated as far as output I can't imagine that it wouldn't have enough to drive your KHorns. To me the question is not "Does this 1400-watt receiver have enough juice?" but "If the first watt is lousy why would you want 1399 more?" []

[CECAA850]

The younger audio junkie sounds clueless. He's probably never looked at the sensitivity rating of a speaker or know what it means.

[tube fanatic]

K-horns will give you a 100db sound pressure level (3000 cu. ft. room) with only 1 watt/channel. So, unless you want to rattle your foundation and put cracks in the sheetrock, you certainly don't need astronomical power! I have rarely been asked to design and build an amp of greater than 5 watts/channel for users of K-horns/LaScalas/Belle Klipsch/Cornwalls, and most of the folks I've done this for only wanted/needed 2-3 watts/channel. I would judge a replacement amp or receiver strictly by its sound quality with the horns, and don't even ask for or look at the power output.

[willland]

Jake,

Welcome to the forum.

Besides the fact that it is old and has been used regularly for 27+ years and visits the doctor often these days, how do you like the POA-1500/K-Horn sound? I have a PRA-1500/POA-1500 combo powering my Forte's and love the sound. I just picked up a Denon PMA-1080R integrated(105w/ch) and love it with my Forte's also. My point is if you do like the vintage Denon/Klipsch sound, just look for another Denon amp. There are plenty in the used market and can be had for reasonable $$$.

Where are you located?

Bill

[dtel]

Then two days ago an A/V consultant came to my house to give me a quote on an entirely new 5.1 surrond and a new amp for the horns and he said the same thing.I am very confused

Before you do anything with him post what you would get and the price, you will get some answers as to if your going to get a good deal. I don't know who your talking about but it never hurts to get other opinions before you put down any money. I say this this because there is nothing you cant buy for your system on your own without possibly paying another person for there advice.

I can guarantee you there is more experience on this forum than what any one person has, just a thought.

[Cornman]

"but "If the first watt is lousy why would you want 1399 more?" Exactly my thought also. Most all of us have been on the Amp Merrygoround at some point, & the wise men will tell you listen & listen some more-- to as many differnt amps as possible with Khorns before you part with your money Your ears will lead you in the right direction. What state are you in? I am sure you can hookup with other Klipscher's for auditions. have you considered Tubes?

Cornman

[Dennie]

Then two days ago an A/V consultant came to my house to give me a quote on an entirely new 5.1 surrond and a new amp for the horns and he said the same thing.I am very confused

Before you do anything with him post what you would get and the price, you will get some answers as to if your going to get a good deal. I don't know who your talking about but it never hurts to get other opinions before you put down any money. I say this this because there is nothing you cant buy for your system on your own without possibly paying another person for there advice.

I can guarantee you there is more experience on this forum than what any one person has, just a thought.

That is a very good point. Don't pay a lot of money for knowledge that won't equal the knowledge that you can get here!

Lots of very smart and experienced people here.

So.....if you've got questions........we've got answers and all we require is a cold beer or soda, when we come over to listen to your great set up!!

We believe that there is no such thing as a stupid question, just stupid people that don't ask questions!!!

Welcome Jake!

Dennie

[wuzzzer]

If you want an inexpensive way to see how only a few watts can make an extremely sensitive speaker like a Klipschorn sound amazing look into a Sonic Impact T-amp. They can be purchased for around $50-150 depending on the model. They are AA battery or AC adapter powered and put out about 8 watts of clean power per channel. The amp will fit in one of your hands. You won't believe your ears.

[Colin]

1. Nelson Pass had a article on why traditional solid state amps should bejudged by their weight.

2. Chip amps, like the Sonic can sound very good on big ole horns:

Yet, on cone loudspeakers of average efficiency, the TA-10 is
not nearly loud or dynamic enough to be emotionally satisfying. Playing music
and movies was almost always with the volume knob at the noon position. There is
some icing missing from its otherwise delicious cake. The feast of music is not
complete.

Not so with big ole horns. On my classic Klipsch corner horns,
the petite TA-10 revved and rumbled as loudly as a Vette. Like most
pre-amplifiers, except the delightful Juicy
Music Merlin, the problem for normal listening was finding the spot
between 7 and 8 on the dial where the music was neither inaudible, nor too loud.
Twelve o'clock on the big ole horns was way too loud for most of my smooth jazz
listening.

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0707/trends_audio_ta101.htm

But I would seriously investigate an integrated tube amp with your horns. The combination of ultra high efficiency and second order harmonic distortion makes music.

[artto]

When I asked a younger audio junkie about the difference he said the new reciever was digital and I would be better of judging amps by wieght rather than by what numbers were on the box

He explained that there was no way that the little transformers in that reciever could handle the current necessary to drive the horns.Since we were a couple of glasses (bottles) of wine past sober I didn't ask for an explaination.

Then two days ago an A/V consultant came to my house to give me a quote on an entirely new 5.1 surrond and a new amp for the horns and he said the same thing.

The younger audio junkie doesn't know what he's talking about. It takes very little to drive the horns and they are a relatively easy load on any well designed audio amplifier ~ even main stream mid-fi stuff.

25-35 watts per speaker with Khorns in a 5000 cubic foot room will neatly part your hair.

[gnatnoop]

Inconsistently.