matt giddy fruit Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 Technics 1200Mkii with Origin Live Silver Tonerarm, Origin Live power supply upgrade etc Blueberry Extreme Preamp VRD Monoblocks K horns Budget around $1000-$1250 I'm thinking Grado Master 1 at this stage, partly because I also have a pair of Grado PS1000 headphones and RA1 Headphone Amp and I'm thinking it might sound sweet all together...also heard good things about the warm bass which is a bit of a fetish of mine. Or am I wasting my money spending this kind of money on a cart with this deck set up and should I be saving my money and investing in a better turntable? Only problem is I'm kind of halfway down that track already with the upgrades....and at the end of my budget for now after this..... Cheers fellas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhoak Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 The wood bodied Grados are very nice. I've had a few but I topped out at the Sonata series. I've never heard one of the Master 1s but it can only be an improvement on the Sonata. One small caveat about Grado cartridges. They're not shielded like other cartridges. They can pick up some "hum" on some tables. Especially as you get closer to the inner grooves (I.E. the motor). I had trouble with the hum on a Music Hall MMF 5, less so on a MMF 7, and not at all on a Clearaudio Emotion. I never did try one of the Grados on my SL1200 so I can't say wheather or not it will give you fits. I will tell you that if it does hum even though very minor it will annoy the #$% out of you. At least it did me. There's a "Grado hum database" over at audiokarma.org. For the most part it shows SL-1200s showing good results (no hum) but none of them have reported on a Master 1. I guess the best thing is make sure you have a return privledge with whoever you buy it from in case it does hum on you. Good luck! Have LOTS of fun and never forget that in the end it's really about the music that comes out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted August 28, 2011 Share Posted August 28, 2011 Have you thought about the Ortofon MM Black? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 or the Shure M-97Xe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garymd Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 My 2 cents... Just go with the $50 Shure M97 as Groom suggested and save your money for a better table. I had a Technics DD table for many years and you can do much better. Like I said, just my 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 considered a denon dl-103? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 If you went with the Shure M97xE, you'd have really clear sound with low surface noise, plus you'd have enough money left over to buy a KAB wood base for your turntable. It improves the looks and slightly improves the sound, making it a bit more sweet. Info at the bottom of this page: http://www.kabusa.com/frameset.htm?/ttables.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tromprof Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 I have a Technics 1200Mkii as well, a great sounding table in my opinion, and built to last the decades. I picked up a Clearaudio Aurum Beta Mk.2 on Audiogon a couple of years back, and have really enjoyed it, esp. since I moved to a tube preamp. I also have the Shure M97xE, and it is a very good value, but the Technics is a good enough table for a high end cart as well. I recently moved my good system to the basement where I set up a dedicated listening area, and I forgot just how heavy the Technics is until I picked it up. What a beast! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Technics 1200Mkii with Origin Live Silver Tonerarm, Origin Live power supply upgrade etc How are you liking the sound of your modded 1200, and did you also hear it without the mods? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshnich Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 The origin live is a very solid performer and would match best with a low compliant cart. I do not know if you have the cream option on the bbx or separate step up transformers as that would make a difference of what cart you should choose. The denon 103 that has been mentioned is a perfect match in regards to compliance but would require step up. To giive other reccos it would be good to know if you have the cream option as the low compliant carts that I am aware of are low output. Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt giddy fruit Posted August 30, 2011 Author Share Posted August 30, 2011 Hi Islander The SILVER TONEARM was/is a revelation! I was doing a quite a few upgrades to the system as a whole at the time and the biggest improvement in sound was from the Silver tonearms. Massive difference in separation and vibrancy from the old 1200 sound I'd been living with for about 15 years! I haven't noticed any discernable difference yet with the (external) DC motor upgrade, but hopefully I will when I get a killer cart!!! Cheers Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt giddy fruit Posted August 30, 2011 Author Share Posted August 30, 2011 Hi Josh No cream option on the BBX - bought it second hand and felt lucky to get one at all! Would've been nice considering I listen to 90% vinyl these days... When you say 'set up' for the Denon 103 what do you mean exactly? VTA etc? Cheers Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt giddy fruit Posted August 30, 2011 Author Share Posted August 30, 2011 Thanks for all your suggestions guys. I think I'm going to plump for the Denon DL103R. Sounds like a good match for the OL Silver, also a couple of lines in an Audiogon review won me over: "Midrange is very Koetsu-like in its magic. Realism is stunning. Overall, top-to-bottom, this cartridge performs like you would expect from a $1k - $2k cart. And that is not an exaggeration. It is that good" Got to be worth a try at the price right? Thanks as always guys. Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryC Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Got to be worth a try at the price right? Don't forget Josh's comment: "The denon 103 that has been mentioned is a perfect match in regards to compliance but would require step up." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 +3 on remembering the Step Up requirement. I should have mentioned that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gagelle Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 This would bust your budget, but I can't say enough good things about the Sutherland PH3D. http://tinyurl.com/3ztps2a [Open in new window] I made a mistake buying a high output moving coil. (Dynavector 20X2H.) I just wasn't getting the output I wanted. But when I hooked up the Sutherland --Wow! I would even use it for a MM cartridge. I wasted some money going around in circles. But the whole setup still sounds great. In reviews, the Sutherland was compared to $5,000 phono preamps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt giddy fruit Posted August 31, 2011 Author Share Posted August 31, 2011 Erm yes...things have gone a little bit wrong since my earlier post....[^o)] Firstly you're right of course - the Denon DL103R needs a step up as my BBX doesn't have the cream option. Showing my ignorance here I'm afraid. When it was pointed out to me in the shop that I needed the step-up up I thought it was all starting to get a bit fiddly, and fell for the sales pitch on the Ortofon 2M Black. The "world's best moving magnet" cart seemed like a good compromise... Anyway I took the deck along to the shop to get the 2M fitted by one of the 'experts' there. Now I'm in a world of hurt. The cart sounds average at best - a bit rough at worst. When I first got it back it was clearly weighted far too heavily onto the cartridge. The plastic housing was virtually scraping the vinyl. The needle was pushing down so hard I could hear weird rough 'music' in between the album tracks! So I lightened the weight and the problem improved, but there's still a roughness/crackle on the attack of notes and the overall performance is generally underwhelming. I've got it running alongside an identically modded 1200 which has an Audio Technica ATDS3 dj cart that cost me $80. The Audio Technica has the edge over the 2M Black at the moment. So what could be the problem? 1. Has the 2M just been fitted badly to the Silver tonearm? 2. Is the Audio Technica actually a better match for the OL Silver - ie I already had a great solution but didn't realise it? Surely not! 3. Does the 2M need a lot of running in to improve? OR should I just take the thing back to the shop and get the Denon and the step up? Do shops generally accept back a cart / stylus that's been played, albeit briefly? Not sure on the protocol here.... Bit of a mess really! Cheers Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garymd Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 Do you have a scale to check the tracking weight? I'm guessing around 1.75g is about right (check the cart specs). It sounds like they set it up improperly and you absolutely need (and have every right) to take it back. In the meantime, don't play your good records. If they can't get it right, get your money back and start over. Find someone who can do it right or learn to do it yourself with help from your forum friends. It's not that difficult. The Denon/step up would be a good next step IMO. I have one on my Thorens and it sounds terrific. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 That sounds like a really bad setup job. Could the turntable have got bumped or something on the way home? I wonder if the cartridge was actually damaged by being over-weighted like that? The 2M Black always gets good reviews, but it might need some breaking in. I found that the M97xE sounds much better after it's been played on 30 LP sides or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshnich Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 The Ortofon 2M is a reasonable match for the origin live arm. It would be considered in the medium range of compliance. I think they did screwed up job of mounting - or has been suggested the arm got bumped. I would recomend takingit back and having them double check the set up. Gary is close on the tracking weight with 1.75 being the top of the range and 1.5 being the recco starting point. He is also correct in that mounting isnt that difficult to do on your own. Of course folks can go over the top on mounting tools and scales but a simple shure scale and a mounting template downloaded from any number of sites and your good to go. It seems like a very delicate job but it really isnt. Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.