mark1101 Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 Rudy, Can I ask how you time aligned? Did you use REW? Can you explain briefly how that app achieves time alignment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 21, 2013 Author Share Posted February 21, 2013 If any of this is incorrect, somebody please let me know....but here is how I have done it.....and it sounds very good to me. Since I use an active crossover, I can selectively mute each driver individually. I start with the RSW-15 and send a sweep to that driver only. REW will tell me the system dealy time in milliseconds. The sub has always been the longest in delay. My room is 27' deep and each RSW-15 measured 48.7ms. Next, I mute the sub and Oris and unmute the DBB. The sweep on that reveals a delay of 29.5ms. The Oris result is 11.9ms. I then use the active crossover to delay the DBB and Oris so that they all equal 48.7 at the listening position. I do know that if I mess that up, Audyssey Pro will tell me something is not right with a speaker when I run it. It happened once when I neglected to save a change to the crossover. I have always done it this way after the guys schooled me on active crossovers etc. This should 'electronically' align each driver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 21, 2013 Author Share Posted February 21, 2013 BTW, Audyssey does the same thing for each speaker in the home theater setup to time align the individual speakers and subs for the listening position. In my room this is a challange since I use dual SPUD subs as well as the mains, DIY center and the Klipsch Cinema speakers.....but it does a great job. Movies are just phenomenal in this room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted February 21, 2013 Share Posted February 21, 2013 Thanks for the info. So you are doing measurements and aligning for arrival at your listening position. Interesting. This is your thread to be proud of but I have to tell you something. On Saturday I will have a pair of DBBs brought home, purchased from a forum member. I have a spare pair of K402s that will go on top (no drivers yet). It's just uncanny that you have these Oris horns on DBBs and I have been doing something similar. Not too many DBBs out there. I have an active crossover and amps waiting..............but I also have a pair of ALK ESNs built a few years ago for dual K-33s that are 2-way and cross at 500hz. They have all matched Auricaps and these have been on my shelf for a few years awaiting a project that had dual 15" woofers (like MWMs). I don't think DBBs even existed when they were built. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 21, 2013 Author Share Posted February 21, 2013 Mark1101, sounds like you have your work cut out for you as well. Over the years I decided that my taste for LF lies in direct radiators vs. folded horns. I tried every Heritage speaker, stock and modified and eventually built the DBBs and never looked back. I just love the sound of the Cornwall bass and that led me to build JCs design. I think you will have a very nice combination with the DBB and the K402. Good luck with the project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 21, 2013 Author Share Posted February 21, 2013 I was able to do all the tweaking and run 13 test points on Audyssey Pro. Worked like a champ and did not run into any problems. I'm finally sitting in the sweet spot for some musical enjoyment. Interestingly, Audyssey 'read' the HF section a little weaker than I had found in my frequency sweeps earlier, so it boosted some of the HF more than I like. I am guessing the difference may be in the different calibrated mics in use with REW vs. Audyssey. I went back into the Audyssey manual and noted that they recommend the "#2 rolloff " profile for a room my size. This sounds much more balanced and 'normal' to me. I am very happy with the initial results even though the Tang Band driver/horn combination is substantially less efficient. Not a big deal since my amps have power to spare. Tomorrow I'll run a few Blu Ray movies through the system and see how it all integrated for 7.1 HD sound. If lip-sync and the sound effects are normal, my work is done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Rudy, What are the Oris horns made of? Are they injection molded plastic like a K402........or something else? About how heavy is one of those without the driver? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 I am going to guess that the horn is some sort of injected molding material. When raw, it feels like a PVC type plastic. I would guess it weighs in the neighborhood of 4 or 5 pounds with the back chamber included....no driver of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZombieWoof Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Rudy, the horns look fabulous ! would the shipping be the same if one ordered 4 vs 2 ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Should have made a few plaster casts before you had them painted[6][]. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Here is a pair. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sousahorn-160Hz-Horn-pair-for-Full-Range-Fullrange-Lowther-Fostex-Tangband-/290866713395?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item43b901d333 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 Rudy, the horns look fabulous ! would the shipping be the same if one ordered 4 vs 2 ? You will have to ask Bert, but I doubt it. My crate was full with the horn assembly. It would likely take two shipments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 Here is a pair. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sousahorn-160Hz-Horn-pair-for-Full-Range-Fullrange-Lowther-Fostex-Tangband-/290866713395?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item43b901d333 Here is the story on the horns on that ad. They were originally built by Martin of Azurahorn. The originals were his first attempt at making a 160Hz horn and were hand made. The sale is for a copy of that original. I know this because I had ordered a pair from that seller and had extensive discussions with Martin on the subject. I subsequently cancelled my order and just pulled the trigger on the Oris 150, The gentleman selling the Sousahorn is very nice and an honest person. That horn is designed with the Le Cleach curve in mind. Before you order those horns, PM me for more information!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 A fellow on the Oris forum asked about my in room readings and put a question in my mind about the true capability of the horn running at full range. That led me to take one of the horns down and set it up outside for a semi-anechoic measurement...I just couldn't stand it. I had to know. This is very un-scientific, but the best I can do with my limited means. The mic is a calibrated Behringer, no EQ, amp direct to driver, sweep run from 50Hz to 20kHz. Mic was roughly 3 feet from the driver. Overall, pretty impressive performance from the horn and driver just by themselves. This reading confirms the capability of the horn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 This is the waterfall on that reading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 Spectrogram. Looks like Audyssey did a nice job of picking up the less than optimum HF capability of the driver when I ran Audyssey Pro yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 Here is the outside measurement superimposed on the reading I took in the room yesterday once I had the basic system set up. Again, no EQ, no Audyssey in the loop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 And finally, here are some off axis measurements for Dave. Feel free to throw the [bs] flags etc. I'm no expert or scientist...just goofing off with some gear. It is nice to 'see' the capability of a piece of gear on a basic level. I would love to test that thing out in a true anechoic chamber with good gear, run by someone with knowledge. ....talk amongst yourselves....back to listening..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 Here is a pair. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sousahorn-160Hz-Horn-pair-for-Full-Range-Fullrange-Lowther-Fostex-Tangband-/290866713395?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item43b901d333 Here is the story on the horns on that ad. They were originally built by Martin of Azurahorn. The originals were his first attempt at making a 160Hz horn and were hand made. The sale is for a copy of that original. I know this because I had ordered a pair from that seller and had extensive discussions with Martin on the subject. I subsequently cancelled my order and just pulled the trigger on the Oris 150, The gentleman selling the Sousahorn is very nice and an honest person. That horn is designed with the Le Cleach curve in mind. Before you order those horns, PM me for more information!!!!! Glad you got a pair of Martin's Azurahorns. He is very cool. I like what he calls the push pull horns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 Seti, I did not get a pair of the Azurahorns. I wanted to get a set, but the shipping from down under was outrageous! I originally ordered a set of those you noted on eBay....but there were enough issues and the cost with shipping was getting high enough to make me think twice. I finally relented and just ordered the horns I have always wanted...the Oris 150 from the Netherlands. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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