BEC Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 "how do you reconcile your earlier assertion that Klipsch went to low ESR caps in the 70s with the fact that even now, Klipsch is still using relatively high ESR Mylars" I of course don't have a lot of experience with the newer Heritage crossovers. I did, just for fun, test some of the caps in an AK-4 a few years back. I saw pretty good ESR reading on all of them. Somewhere around 0.05 ohms ESR for the large value ones and around 0.1 for the smaller ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 http://diyaudioprojects.com/mirror/members.aol.com/sbench102/caps.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 Those are good numbers. I was thinking before bed last night that the Mylars they use now would have to be of better quality than those old blue and yellow ones. The part count is pretty high on the newer designs and they wouldn't be able to incur much in the way of loss and still sound good. I don't have all the answers, don't even have a good half dozen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnA Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 I have used the Solen caps and have been pleased with the results. I tend to prefer film and foil caps, though, as much for their construction as for their sound. Look up AudioCaps on PE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik2A3 Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Dean: Surely whether Solens mask detail and Sonicaps make speakers overly bright is nothing more than an opinion (?) if that's yours, it's all that matters...for you. In building amplifiers, I have friends who wouldn't touch a Jensen PIO with a ten or even eleven foot pole. I've used them in interstage coupling positions and like them ok, but ultimately preferred the ubiquitous, not to mention far less expensive Orange Drop -- and I could afford to buy whatever capacitor I wanted at the time. Whatever the argument, ESR or other elements, it comes down to individual systems where only a single pair of ears matter. And that's the simple answer. we see others here, including me, who have used Solen capacitors, as well as high voltage types in both filtering and coupling stages in amps with good results....no excellent results. What matters, I think, is whether someone has the ability to hear differences so that they can make their own informed decisions based on their (rather than someone else's) preference. My favorites for the Heritage networks were the GE motor run types. Moreover, I know of specific cases where both Jensen PIO and Solen poly film varieties failed rather miserably under load, but we are talking high anode voltages here, where what crossovers see in the way of electrical energy is pretty small. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axz Hout Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik2A3 Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Chris: good for you, if you have something that sounds better, enjoy listening to music! Far more interesting than listening to capacitors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axz Hout Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik2A3 Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Totally agree with that! I admit that being an audio hobbiest at heart and one who builds many of my own amplifiers, I have been...and at times continue to be...drawn into fine circuit modifications and details to get the very last bit of performance (at least as far as my ears are concerned) I can. How nice it is when I can find the quiet moments to sit and just enjoy some music..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 A 12uF or 14uF is less than 10% within the target value (13uF) -- more than acceptable in a first order filter. Using a quality/ better sounding capacitor had more to do with the improvement in sound than using the "correct" values. There's my opinion as well as that of a customer base which has been supplying me feedback for a decade. I can certainly understand why a PIO capacitor wouldn't be a good choice for most stages within an amplifier, any more than powerlytics would be my first choice for a crossover build. Like I said, some people care about this stuff and some don't. I'm certainly not concerned with those who don't or those who can't hear the difference between components or even in some cases -- loudspeakers. Someone here couldn't hear the difference between a Heresy II and a Heresy III. That type of person isn't likely to hear what I and others consider to be not so subtle differences between other things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axz Hout Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axz Hout Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Chris, you're still driving a '76! What car is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axz Hout Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 @Chris, so basically 30 cycles near the crossover point. Agreed, I think that might be audible. Touché' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axz Hout Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 k     Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark1101 Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 I always spec'd matched pairs of caps when I built passive networks to remove the tolerance factor altogether. It wasn't unitl I got into active crossovers and RTA measurements that I found out about the "acoustic crossover"........what you actually get "out-the speaker"............and these crossover points are quite different crossover values than the ones everyone is shooting for on paper. But at least with matching parts you get 2 speakers doing the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Chris, nice ride! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axz Hout Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik2A3 Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 Great! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.