8 watts 300B with Cornwalls/Cornscalas

[erik2A3]

single-ended 300Bs, or as Bruce mentioned, 2A3s can be an incredible match with Klipsch Heritage systems -- from the Heresy up through the Klipschorn. Of the 45, 2A3, and 300B (though there are some other less common examples), the 300B is my favorite -- and even that preference can be circuit-dependent, music-genre dependent, and most significantly, mood-dependent.

As much as I love single-ended topologies, of which I own several examples, I would be mistaken to not support some of the excellent qualities of good push-pull designs using tubes such as the 6L6, EL34, and a number of others. I would encourage you to audition some examples of both. A favorite amplifier with Klipsch Heritage as been a renovated Baldwin organ amp using PP 6L6 outputs, as well as one I recently overhauled and rebuilt -- the well-known Leak ST20.

I would say that, IME at least, much of the character of an amp is perhaps as much, or likely more, related to the circuit design as whether it happens to be single-ended or push-pull. Both have advantages. Have fun in your search!

[bracurrie]

I am going to jump in here as a user that is noise sensitive. You are probably going to use passive crossovers so your sensitivity won't be as high as mine, but I would keep in mind if you do take the active crossover leap a dead quiet amp is a must.

Your choice is a journey not a destination. In my 4 years of horn speaker experience I have enjoyed 6 different amplifiers. I am about to try two more. Didn't think it was going to work that way but it has. No regrets just fun with toys and the learning that goes with it.

Food for thought is a forum member's web site. http://ampsandsound.com/

[Guest David H]

Food for thought is a forum member's web site. http://ampsandsound.com/

Good call, Justin's meticulous build are very nice.+ Every Amps and Sound product I have tested has been dead quiet.

Dave

Edited January 18, 2014 by GotHover

[erik2A3]

For what I am using right now, my system, the loudspeakers of which consist of very high efficiency, wide-band drivers on an open baffle. These run entirely full range, without any passive components of any kind, naturally rolling off in the region of 200Hz or so. I am using reverse-phase driven La Scalas via a series inductor, allowing very mild overlap between the main drivers and bass bins.

Crossoverless Lowther drivers can be pesky as far as noise, more so even than our La Scalas and former Klipschorns. I am able to enjoy directly (AC) heated cathode/filament amplifiers with negligible interference or distortion. In other words, problems with noise can indeed be system dependent, as was indicated. With AC heated triode power tubes, unless one happens to be using DC, one can sometimes experience a certain level of 60 cycle filament hum, which can be bothersome to some listeners. My case is such that my main speakers roll-off before those particular noise artifacts become much of a problem. Even DC heated triodes may not be entirely free of filament -related hum. High voltage (aka B+) plate or anode supplies can also be poorly filtered in terms of pulsating DC.

Indirectly heated PP pentodes are inherently less prone to noise. *Note: for those who may not be certain about what I'm referring to as far as direct or in-direct heating, I am talking about the kind of current (AC or DC) used to heat the cathode of a vacuum tube. In an amp that uses single-ended triodes, one of the three elements of the tube is called the cathode, which in these particular valves also happens to be the filament (the thing that glows!). When a cathode is indirectly heated by a separate filament, and if the circuit is push-pull v.s. single-ended, the noise potential can be significantly reduced -- unless of course said amplifier happens to be plagued by other noise-causing problems, such as poor or ineffective grounding.

With all this said, MANY tube amplifiers, whether being used with active or passive crossovers, can be very satisfactorily, and of course subjectively, quiet and completely musical performers. Tubes are also just a blast, tons of fun!

Edited January 18, 2014 by erik2A3

[EmilC]

Amp and Sound Amps

Nice looking products and affordable...but why? Cant help being skeptical when something is priced so reasonably.

Must be an audiophile thing

[Guest David H]

Amp and Sound Amps Nice looking products and affordable...but why? Cant help being skeptical when something is priced so reasonably. Must be an audiophile thing

Amps and sound has little to no overhead, uses reasonably priced high quality components that keeps the prices reasonable.

This is no different JMA and several others.

Doesn't have to be expensive to sound really good.

Dave

[erik2A3]

"Doesn't have to be expensive to sound really good."

Agreed, absolutely. Thank you!

....and yet, so may expensive sound really good.

[Guest David H]

.and yet, so may expensive sound really good.

Yes, there is a lot of that too.

Dave

[justinsweber]

Hey everyone... ampsandsound is a hobby/ startup for me. I work a full time job and a part time job.

That said, there is very little exotic about what I build with. I use to punch my chassis, but I was prone to small mistakes. Additionally punching and drilling is labor intensive, and produces a great sounding amp that looks like it might have been built in a garage… My amps are built in my garage, but are made with parts leveraged but other people’s strengths. CNC top-plates are pretty, repeatable and allow for optimized placement. The circuit is well proven. My passive parts come from mouser for a few reasons, repeatable/ dependable purchasing, high tolerance parts and nothing super exotic. The wonderful thing is that 1% and 2% resister are super common, and significant capacitance is can be sourced. I believe in big caps, tight tolerances on resistors and big iron… None of this breaks the bank, but is also not free. When you add parts cost plus build time my prices are reasonable. I don’t build the very best you can own… I can’t afford to, but I build quite tube amps that of modest power that are very very reliable. Modern manufacturing makes this possible. If someone purchases an amp from ampsandsound and is not happy within 1^st 2 weeks we will accept it back. I rather a happy customer than a sale… I do believe most vender no matter what they produce feel the same.

As an aside, I don’t comment on other companies’ products. I’ve owned and been proud of amps I’ve had from various sources. Ive owned home built kits and custom p2p units, and more than a few McIntosh units bought new. My McIntosh amps (MA2275 was $7500 and my MC275 was $4200, had I not used my tax refund to buy them and planed years in advance it wouldn’t have happened. I remember listening to my brand new MC275 on my Magnepans and then my La Scala’s and comparing it to my home built Dynaco MKIII I built from a kit and did a WTF… Now that was a learning experience. The MC275 provide the better more stable amp, but for a $3200 premium? The MKIII were dam close.

That said, most companies price their products with significantly higher profit margin then we do. We chose parts first, not profit.

Edited January 19, 2014 by justinsweber

[bracurrie]

This hobby is full of sexy products that are priced based on satisfaction not tied to how they sound. I actually talked to someone who admitted he was willing to pay a very large premium for a show piece that stoked his ego. This person even went so far as to say that he believed tube equipment didn't sound as good as solid state but because they looked better he was willing to shell out stupid amounts of money. All in all he was quick to say he had over $50,000 in his setup. Behind his back the wife just shook her head. I don't go there much anymore.

Edited January 19, 2014 by bracurrie

[EmilC]

Im sure you guys are all dying to know. I purchased a pair of 300B Quicksilver monoblocks off of Audiogon. Should have then at about the same time my Cornscalas arrive.

Fun times ahead

Appreciate everyone's help

[CECAA850]

Justin, you need to put a link to your site in your sig!

[justinsweber]

Will do!. Thanks for the input.

[minermark]

Thanksk guys for your input.

The consensus here is that 8 watts should be enough. What are your thoughts on the 300B tube if I may ask?

You cannot go wrong with any tube amp, you seem to have acquired the taste of them already, bird dog Ebay for a few weeks, there is nothing wrong with the imported amps. iv been running KT88s for the last 10+ years with NO problems.

Besides if you think about it, you can always get your money back on a tube amp, not so much for solidstate.

[EmilC]

No experience with Cayin, but I have tried several 300B tubes.

EH-300B's were good overall, but my lease favorite in the line up.

JJ big bottle is a nice sounding tube overall and inpressive to look at, I prefered it slightly to over the Valve Art 300B

The Sophia princess Carbon plates excellent but $$$$ and speaker seemed speaker dependent. Great highs.

My overall favorite is the Sophia Electric 300B mesh plate globes, same as the TJ 300B tube I believe.

All of these tubes were quite good.

Dave

Hi Dave

Have you had any experience with Svetlana 300Bs?

[Lemon string]

Im sure you guys are all dying to know. I purchased a pair of 300B Quicksilver monoblocks off of Audiogon. Should have then at about the same time my Cornscalas arrive.

Fun times ahead

Appreciate everyone's help

yeah let us know how you like them and the improvement they make or not..... but I don't see that happening! I think I saw the quicksilvers you bought I was considering them myself. I ended buying a Audion sterling plus kt88 hard wired. I had just bought an older el34 12w sterling from audion so when I came across this demo model I went for it. The new one is living at my studio for afterwork jam sessions. Can't wait to hear how you like them with the cornscalas. keep us posted.

[EmilC]

My 300B Quicksilver amps arrived yesterday. I was planning on having a first listen over the weekend but you know how it goes. Closest we get to that Christmas morning excitement as adults.

Hard to give a direct comparison with the Cornwalls because I did not have the
Quicksilvers driving them and I no longer have the McCiormack DNA 225.

My biggest concern was whether an 8 watt SET has enough juice to push them at levels I'd be happy with. Short answer is YES. With that out of the way I began to listen. First thing I listened for was for that " magical midrange" 300Bs provide. Oh it was there alright. I think Paul Klipsch coined the phrase that in the midrange is where the music lives. Highs were no slouch either. Pristine sounding. Most surprising was the bass. Granted it was no solid state kind of bass but it was there. Guess you cant have it all.
Any Cornscala owners here feel that they improved with more play time?

During some bass heavy passages, I was hearing a buzzing sound. Upon expection it was coming from one of the Cornscala cabinet. I unscrewd the back panel to take a look inside. Kind of spartan in there. No padding of any kind. Anyway, everything inside properly affixed. No screws loose so I replaced the panel. Buzzing still there. Cant hear it from my listening seat but still.

I was thinking about spiking them. Think that would drain the vibrations away from the box?

[Schu]

Are the cross overs solid mounted or is there something between them and the walls?

[mike stehr]

My 300B Quicksilver amps arrived yesterday. I was planning on having a first listen over the weekend but you know how it goes. Closest we get to that Christmas morning excitement as adults.

Hard to give a direct comparison with the Cornwalls because I did not have the

Quicksilvers driving them and I no longer have the McCiormack DNA 225.

My biggest concern was whether an 8 watt SET has enough juice to push them at levels I'd be happy with. Short answer is YES. With that out of the way I began to listen. First thing I listened for was for that " magical midrange" 300Bs provide. Oh it was there alright. I think Paul Klipsch coined the phrase that in the midrange is where the music lives. Highs were no slouch either. Pristine sounding. Most surprising was the bass. Granted it was no solid state kind of bass but it was there. Guess you cant have it all.

Any Cornscala owners here feel that they improved with more play time?

During some bass heavy passages, I was hearing a buzzing sound. Upon expection it was coming from one of the Cornscala cabinet. I unscrewd the back panel to take a look inside. Kind of spartan in there. No padding of any kind. Anyway, everything inside properly affixed. No screws loose so I replaced the panel. Buzzing still there. Cant hear it from my listening seat but still.

I was thinking about spiking them. Think that would drain the vibrations away from the box?

What you might be hearing is filament hum from a 5 volt 300B tube. Do you know if the amplifiers have DC heating for the 300B filaments, or AC? It's rather difficult to get a 5 volt AC heated filament minimally quiet, so I would guess the amplifiers have DC heating for the 300B filaments.

Do the amplifiers have hum pots for the 300B tubes? If so, maybe try adjusting the hum pot of the amp with the most noise.

Or swap the 300B tubes from each amp, and see if the noise goes to the other speaker. That would show if the tube is the noise problem.

[EmilC]

Mike Stehr

No, the amps are fine. Its a buzz from the speaker cabinets when deep bass notes are played