Guest Steven1963 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Pulled the carpet out of the living room and replaced it with pergo. Looks fantastic but I've lost the sonic mojo. SOMETHING is out of whack and I can't fix it because I can't put my finger on exactly what it is that I need to fix (short of putting carpet back down and the wife isn't about to let that happen) frequency-wise. I've jiggled the EQ and and I've adjusted the sub but it just isn't the same. /cry. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnr Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Add a complimentary area rug. You will notice a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Steven1963 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I have one. 5x7 centered in front of the stereo table. Still well off from the khorns, though. I'm wondering if I should add a rug under each speaker? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) It's the floor bounce from your "collapsing polar midrange horns". You'll need at least an area rug for each loudspeaker, starting at the front face of each box and extending out toward your listening position for at least 2 feet--and 4 feet would be better, and at least the width of each loudspeaker. Having a rug that extends from your loudspeakers to halfway to your listening position would be even better--on each side. BTW if you can post a pix of your setup + floor in front, it might also help the troubleshooting. Chris Edited September 22, 2014 by Chris A 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muel Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I think Chris has a pretty good plan. Don't expect to get it to sound the same though! You have changed the room. Even different carpet sounds different. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Steven1963 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I'll try and post a pic tonight. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick J B Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Put a pad under the area rugs and they work even better. Nicer to walk on too. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnr Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) Also use a felt rug pad under your area rugs, which come in various thickness, preferably 3/8" or 1/2". Naturally you don't want to cover too much of your pergo floors, but perhaps you could get a larger area rug and still see and enjoy a large portion of your pergo. We have hickory hardwood floors and a 8' x 10.5 foot rug between two L shaped couches, but there is plenty of hickory still visible. The right balance is a personal preference. Haven't done the percentages, but I think the rug is only covering about 30-40%. Then again, I am not using Khorns in this room, but using the 7.1 reference HT setup. I guess Rick and I were posting the same time. Edited September 22, 2014 by tnr 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Do you have any type of room correction software? If so, have you rerun it? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max2 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I came from an all wood floor media room and I now have a fully carpeted media room. I definitely hear more details with the carpet flooring. However, I despise carpet. Its just a filthy catch all that can never truly be cleaned, but I sure like the sound deadness and it also helps keep things quiet when Wifey is asleep. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philly0116 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) Rugs and furnishings. Maybe some decorative wall mount sound deadening panels? Edited September 22, 2014 by philly0116 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) Rugs and furnishings. Maybe some decorative wall mount sound deadener panels? Wrong direction - the midrange horn emits most of its spilled polar energy in the vertical direction, i.e., toward the floor and ceiling, due to the short dimension of the horn's mouth in that direction. There's also a good reason the horn's short axis is oriented in the vertical direction. Chris Edited September 22, 2014 by Chris A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Steven1963 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Do you have any type of room correction software? If so, have you rerun it? The DBX 14/10 EQ/analyzer does this. But it's a 30 years old piece of equipment and I question the results - seems heavily weighted to the upper range while recommending negative-to-flat decibel bass settings. Making the room sound thin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max2 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Rugs and furnishings. Maybe some decorative wall mount sound deadener panels? Wrong direction - the midrange horn emits most of its spilled polar energy in the vertical direction, i.e., toward the floor and ceiling, due to the short dimension of the horn's mouth in that direction. There's also a good reason the horn's short axis is oriented in the vertical direction. Chris So ceiling acoustic panels would be more important than wall panels? I have dove tail walls that slope at a angle from the ceiling about half way down the wall, then they turn straight down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) Rugs and furnishings. Maybe some decorative wall mount sound deadener panels? Wrong direction - the midrange horn emits most of its spilled polar energy in the vertical direction, i.e., toward the floor and ceiling, due to the short dimension of the horn's mouth in that direction. There's also a good reason the horn's short axis is oriented in the vertical direction. Chris So ceiling acoustic panels would be more important than wall panels? I have dove tail walls that slope at a angle from the ceiling about half way down the wall, then they turn straight down. Floor covering is much more important than the other directions, then side and front-wall directions, all within the first 2-4 feet of the front of the loudspeakers. It's a near-field issue with early reflections that create the imaging issues and timbre shifts. The ceiling is usually at least 4 feet away for Klipsch Heritage loudspeakers. If your ceiling is less than 9 feet high then the diffusers on the ceiling might also be effective for Khorns. Certainly, placing absorbent material across the top of the Khorn top hats, and even on the front top-hat baffle of the Khorns just outside the midrange horn boundary--if you don't have stapled grill fabric across the front of the top hat--will also be extremely effective in controlling the issue, in a fashion not unlike the Peavey QT horn shown in the link above. Notice the absorbent material across the front of the Jub bass bins and on the side/front walls next the the Jubs (to absorb midrange reflections originating from the K-402 HF horn and the upper frequencies of the Jub bass bins), and also on the top and sides of the Belle. The tiled floor in front of both Jubs is now covered with strip area rugs, as well as the wooden mantle, which is now covered with soft material. Chris Edited September 22, 2014 by Chris A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ69 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Carpet the ceiling? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derrickdj1 Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 Pulled the carpet out of the living room and replaced it with pergo. Looks fantastic but I've lost the sonic mojo. SOMETHING is out of whack and I can't fix it because I can't put my finger on exactly what it is that I need to fix (short of putting carpet back down and the wife isn't about to let that happen) frequency-wise. I've jiggled the EQ and and I've adjusted the sub but it just isn't the same. /cry. I had this happen around 1 1/2 years ago. All wood floors and lots of window and a large room. It sounded awful. Then I move to the basement and lost all the bass. The basement is fully carpeted and a concrete bunkers. I had to get more subs, lol. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japosey Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 You need something to absorb all the midrange and higher frequencies. Wall treatments, rug, window treatments, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick J B Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 The pergo has made the room brighter or more reflective. Its not what you're used to so it seems odd. I dunno, you might give it time and see if you acclimate to it in a positive fashion. Or, tell the wife to look for some nice persian rugs with thick pads under them. Also, I always thought if I felt the need to treat a ceiling I'd do what some interior decorators do and drape heavy material in a wave like fashion across it. Each wave would droop down roughly 12" and be spaced about 24" or so apart. Just an idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max2 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Rugs and furnishings. Maybe some decorative wall mount sound deadener panels? Wrong direction - the midrange horn emits most of its spilled polar energy in the vertical direction, i.e., toward the floor and ceiling, due to the short dimension of the horn's mouth in that direction. There's also a good reason the horn's short axis is oriented in the vertical direction. Chris So ceiling acoustic panels would be more important than wall panels? I have dove tail walls that slope at a angle from the ceiling about half way down the wall, then they turn straight down. Floor covering is much more important than the other directions, then side and front-wall directions, all within the first 2-4 feet of the front of the loudspeakers. It's a near-field issue with early reflections that create the imaging issues and timbre shifts. The ceiling is usually at least 4 feet away for Klipsch Heritage loudspeakers. If your ceiling is less than 9 feet high then the diffusers on the ceiling might also be effective for Khorns. Certainly, placing absorbent material across the top of the Khorn top hats, and even on the front top-hat baffle of the Khorns just outside the midrange horn boundary--if you don't have stapled grill fabric across the front of the top hat--will also be extremely effective in controlling the issue, in a fashion not unlike the Peavey QT horn shown in the link above. Notice the absorbent material across the front of the Jub bass bins and on the side/front walls next the the Jubs (to absorb midrange reflections originating from the K-402 HF horn and the upper frequencies of the Jub bass bins), and also on the top and sides of the Belle. The tiled floor in front of both Jubs is now covered with strip area rugs, as well as the wooden mantle, which is now covered with soft material. Chris What kind of chairs are those in the Center? I like those and they look comfy. Do they block a lot of the rear channel content? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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