adam2434 Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 Listening on my PC with $10 thrift store Bose 141 (don't laugh...ok, laugh ), the RF-7 II sound brighter and more open in the highs, and the Forte III have a more prominent midrange, but sound a little more boxy on these cheap Bose. I need to watch the video using my RF-7 II. Youthman, do your RF-7 II crossovers just have upgraded parts, or were any values changed? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted December 4, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 4, 2017 38 minutes ago, adam2434 said: Youthman, do your RF-7 II crossovers just have upgraded parts, or were any values changed? Upgraded Mills resistors, values remained the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam2434 Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 10 minutes ago, Youthman said: Upgraded Mills resistors, values remained the same OK, caps remained stock and only resistors were upgraded to Mills. Got it. Mills resistors are great quality, and I have used them in the past crossover refresh work. Do you believe the sound is much better/different with the Mills? I have never replaced them in a single variable context (always combined with capacitor replacements), so I have not been able to assess an improvement independently. Also, I listened to the demo with ATH-M50x headphones and have similar impressions to what I posted above. The additional thing I noticed with headphones is that bass transients seemed more pronounced (and maybe more detailed) with the Forte III. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted December 6, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 6, 2017 On 12/4/2017 at 4:33 PM, adam2434 said: Do you believe the sound is much better/different with the Mills? There was definitely a difference in the sound. The main thing I noticed is the top end was trimmed off a bit so they aren't quite as bright as they are with stock crossovers, yet still remain very detailed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted December 6, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 6, 2017 On 12/3/2017 at 12:45 AM, wvu80 said: I would really have to listen to more content and live! before I think I could say which one I liked better. For now it is splitting hairs between two fantastic speakers and personal preference will rule the day. I completely agree. On 12/3/2017 at 10:01 AM, Tarheel said: Very good video Yute. Thanks! On 12/3/2017 at 11:09 AM, Schu said: what you have to ask yourself is, are you a reference person or a heritage person. What if you are both? I have LaScalas and RF-7 II. Things that make you go hmmmm.....LOL On 12/3/2017 at 12:28 PM, YK Thom said: You have a real knack for these videos. The indicator arrows are a great touch Thank you sir. On 12/3/2017 at 12:43 PM, derrickdj1 said: I think all of us may like one over the other based on our personal taste and the type of music we like. Some of us like the sparkling highs and others like the mid-range more.The 7's are a tighter speaker IMHO and the Forte is a bit more relaxed. Both speakers are great and I would not mind owning both. Spot on with how I feel On 12/3/2017 at 7:04 PM, YK Thom said: Your room looks great on a 60” TV by the way. Thank you for the kind words. On 12/3/2017 at 7:04 PM, YK Thom said: Funny enough my wife’s take away from the video is that she would like to get a similar carpet lol. Sounds like what my wife would say. She could care less about speakers. On 12/3/2017 at 7:04 PM, YK Thom said: I lean slightly towards the RF7s in that room (and my own). That's exactly what I shared in my latest Video. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isotopesope Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 it would be interesting for you to swap locations of where the Forte's and RF-7's are sitting and re-do the comparison. I do agree with you that the Forte could use a bit more bass, but where you have them placed is not doing them any favors. the manual suggests 2-10" away from the back wall for the best bass performance... i have had a big increase in the bass response of my Forte III's by bringing them closer to the back wall. A lot closer than seemed "normal", compared to my rear ported RF250F's that the Forte's replaced, but it made a significant difference. I first had them about 18" away, where my RF-250F's were, but then moved them to about 12". after R'ing TFM, they keep creeping closer and closer, and i keep hearing a difference. Now, they're about 6" away, at their closest edge. Instead of raising my Forte's, i have raked mine back to bring the sound "up" toward my big dumb head in my main listening position. YMMV Also, aren't you running aftermarket crossovers in the RF-7's as well? do they affect the bass response of the RF-7's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted December 12, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 12, 2017 Thanks for the feedback iso. I could definitely swap the speakers and see how that effects the sound. I know even a few inches can make a big difference how a speaker images, as well as changes in bass response. My crossovers have been modified but only the resistors for the tweeter were upgraded. Dean used the same values as what Klipsch used, only replacing what he considers as inferior components with Mills Resistors which by nature apparently smooths out the top end by default. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkevind Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 I was thinking you could stagger them (Left to Right: Forte III, RF-7II, Forte III, RF-7II) Though in a recent comparison session I had with my RF-7II and Forte II, I wound up with a similar configuration to yours, just for expediency sake. It worked well enough for my purposes. Thanks for putting together the comparison / review, I know that's a lot of work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parlophone1 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Youthman, how far from the wall are your RF7II? Are they really that close as they appear on the picture in your first post? Apart for me leaning more towards the heritage sound, my limited living space does permit placing the speakers on the rear wall or max. foot from that wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr clean Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 I would love to hear the video again with the F3s raised up about a foot to hear the tweeters about the same height. Thats what I love about the 280s. and the 7s. The mid/highs are right in your face when seated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr clean Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 I guess I should have watched the vid before saying this. I still wish you would and see nothing wrong with putting them higher if they sound better. No different than changing resistors in the crossovers to make them sound better. Sorry I could not resist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted December 12, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 12, 2017 7 minutes ago, mr clean said: I still wish you would and see nothing wrong with putting them higher if they sound better. No different than changing caps in the crossovers to make them sound better. Sure there is. You don't see crossovers. LOL 8 hours ago, parlophone1 said: how far from the wall are your RF7II? Are they really that close as they appear on the picture in your first post? I can check when I get home tonight. I'm guessing 10" or so? 8 hours ago, parlophone1 said: my limited living space does permit placing the speakers on the rear wall or max. foot from that wall. Yeah, I don't think the wife would like mine sitting a foot from the wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wstrickland1 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 so are the F3's for sale? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted December 12, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 12, 2017 Yes, as much as I like them, I have decided to sell them as I prefer the sound of the RF-7 II for the type of music that I listen to. I have them listed locally. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 54 minutes ago, Youthman said: Yes, as much as I like them, I have decided to sell them as I prefer the sound of the RF-7 II for the type of music that I listen to. I have them listed locally. I bet your son was looking forward to getting those RF-7 II's. Now he just have to suffer with those old RF-7's in his bedroom. +++ I have a feeling if all you had was the Forte III's you would love them. They only pale slightly due to the highly dialed in RF-7 II setup in your living room and triple La Scala's in your dedicated home theater room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted December 12, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 12, 2017 15 minutes ago, wvu80 said: I bet your son was looking forward to getting those RF-7 II's. Now he just have to suffer with those old RF-7's in his bedroom. He definitely was! But he agreed with me, the RF-7 II is a better fit for the music that we listen to. 16 minutes ago, wvu80 said: I have a feeling if all you had was the Forte III's you would love them. Absolutely no doubt in my mind. 16 minutes ago, wvu80 said: They only pale slightly due to the highly dialed in RF-7 II setup in your living room and triple La Scala's in your dedicated home theater room. The LaScalas really don't have any bearing on how the Forte III sound as I haven't done any comparison between the two (probably would not be a fair fight). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr clean Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 I know the lascalas don't go as deep bass wise and I see you have the bottom end covered well but sound wise do the lascalas sound bigger than the fortes and 7IIs? Just wondering what you think seeing you have all 3. Posting some today because I'm sick and kind of bored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted December 12, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 12, 2017 20 minutes ago, mr clean said: I know the lascalas don't go as deep bass wise and I see you have the bottom end covered well but sound wise do the lascalas sound bigger than the fortes and 7IIs? Although I have not done an A/B comparison between the LaScalas and RF-7 II or the LaScalas and Forte III, when I A/B between LaScala and RF-83, the soundstage, midrange, vocals, clarity....pretty much everything except the bottom end, the LaScala easily won over the RF-83. I would expect a similar result if I were to A/B them against the RF-7 II or the Forte III. Remember, the Forte is several notches down the Heritage chain than the LaScalas so it definitely would not be a fair fight there. I believe the RF-7 II would do better but my guess is would not perform as well as the LaScalas as long as they have a sub or subs paired with them. Unfortunately at 120lbs each, and they aren't easy to disconnect the speaker wire, it would be a pain in the butt to try and move a pair into the living room to see. Wouldn't do me any good to know because I will never be able to have LaScalas in the living room so no need to get my hopes up. LOL 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Youthman Posted December 12, 2017 Author Moderators Share Posted December 12, 2017 24 minutes ago, mr clean said: Posting some today because I'm sick and kind of bored Sorry to hear you are sick. Can't do anything about that. The bored part we can help you with. Hope you get to feeling better soon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkevind Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 I'd have to say, if it was between my Forte II or my RF-7II in the room where the RF-7II live, I'd choose the RF's also. This is with Bob Crites crossovers and titanium tweeter in the Forte II. I know this is not relevant to your comparison of the RF-7II vs Forte III, I just thought I'd share since I was somewhat inspired to do my own listening comparison from your video. For me, Forte II vs RF-7II: The bass with the RF-7II was very good, energized while being more controlled, tighter. The RF-7II was a bit brighter, with a bit more detail to be heard. The Forte II had good bass in the room, but not as controlled and therefore a tad bit bloated by comparison. The Forte II had more information coming at me, which is good or not so good depending on the volume level and the type of music being played (and the quality of the recording). The imaging with the Forte II is almost supernaturally wide which is pretty cool. This is so much about placement and where you're sitting. My listening session was quite loud, and from 15' back. I wasn't trying to achieve maximum SPL, rather wanted the speakers a chance to really sing in a large room, and show me their dynamic qualities. With that kind of listening, the RF-7II was definitely in my happy place. The Forte II were quite good as well, but in the end I prefer them at a lower volume, and with sweeter kind of music, jazz and other types of more chill listening as I do in the office where the Forte normally live anyway. To really rock out at stupid volumes, the RF-7II takes the cake. That said, my preference for the RFs is something like 55/45 in favor. If all I had was the Forte II, I'd be quite happy with them, and I am. My placement was like yours, Fortes on the outside (which could explain the imaging being wider ). I had them equally pulled out from the wall about 3 feet. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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