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Jube/1802 - The Ultimate 2.1


AHall

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12 hours ago, dtel said:

OK I was asking Roy about this and he said the spec's are for cinema measured in 1/2 space and not for a room of a house, it is going to go lower than 20hz. You are using it in quarter space which will lower it right off the back, into the teens. 

 

I would say, me saying this not him, test it and see what your getting as it is first. What Roy said was yes you can plug a vent do go deeper you will just lose some sensitivity, it's a trade off.

 

But I would guess with the output, losing a little sensitivity wouldn't be a big deal depending on how you like to play it. I know the 1502 which is 2.5-3 Db lower output than the 1802 is still alot inside a house (in our room). I love this thing, I have never heard bass this clean before.

 

 

I thought test it as is first to see what your getting and go from there, you may be happy as is, or you can experiment and plug a vent with soft foam and test again ? I would roll up some soft foam and slide it in a tube where it fits kind of tight, wouldn't want it to blow into the front space where you would have to remove the complete vent to get it out, that would be a pain. Were leaving in the morning so I may not be back here for over a week, if I don't answer back I'm not ignoring you. Going to talk with him more about this later.

 

Once you get everything done and dialed in it's going to be amazing and look cool with everything you did the room.

 

 

Thank you for looking into this. That is great news that the idea wasn’t condemned. I better hold off on trimming the front wall out while I experiment. I’m excited to see what we can do with this. 

 

All the sudden my right xlr on the anthem avm60 is staticky at times. So it’ll be getting sent off and traded for a new one. 

 

In other news I rescued these forte 2s for $200. 

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You might also ask Roy if you can simply replace the vents/tubes with another 18" woofer wired in series, which should give you deeper extension and more output (2.7 dB?) down low for movies, if the T/S parameters of that woofer show it to be a medium/low Qts and low Fs woofer. 

 

I don't have the T/S parameters of the K-473 woofer, so I can't say.  It would be nice to have those values in the T/S database.  You can measure those in your 1802 assembly using a woofer tester from Parts Express, and simply look for another woofer from someplace like Parts Express of about the same T/S parameters (if you don't wish to buy from Klipsch at their higher resell prices).

 

I'm not sure how Roy set up the ports/tubes, but it looks like a simple vent to the other side of the horn throat (i.e., not an additional port close to the horn mouth as it is in tapped horns of Danley's subwoofers).  If this is true, then adding another woofer would be a great mod for home theater duty where deeper bass is desired and the cost of an additional woofer isn't such a design factor as it is for professional cinema installs.

 

EDIT:  note that below the port tune frequency, the output of a tuned port box cuts off rather dramatically, as you indicated going from vented to closed box, above.  If you replace the vents in the dual-ported throat with just another woofer, you get more output below the original port frequency, and more output overall due to the increase in effective driver area at the throat. 

 

YMMV.

 

Chris

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4 hours ago, Chris A said:

You might also ask Roy if you can simply replace the vents/tubes with another 18" woofer wired in series, which should give you deeper extension and more output (2.7 dB?) down low for movies, if the T/S parameters of that woofer show it to be a medium/low Qts and low Fs woofer. 

 

I don't have the T/S parameters of the K-473 woofer, so I can't say.  It would be nice to have those values in the T/S database.  You can measure those in your 1802 assembly using a woofer tester from Parts Express, and simply look for another woofer from someplace like Parts Express of about the same T/S parameters (if you don't wish to buy from Klipsch at their higher resell prices).

 

I'm not sure how Roy set up the ports/tubes, but it looks like a simple vent to the other side of the horn throat (i.e., not an additional port close to the horn mouth as it is in tapped horns of Danley's subwoofers).  If this is true, then adding another woofer would be a great mod for home theater duty where deeper bass is desired and the cost of an additional woofer isn't such a design factor as it is for professional cinema installs.

 

EDIT:  note that below the port tune frequency, the output of a tuned port box cuts off rather dramatically, as you indicated going from vented to closed box, above.  If you replace the vents in the dual-ported throat with just another woofer, you get more output below the original port frequency, and more output overall due to the increase in effective driver area at the throat. 

 

YMMV.

 

Chris

Very interesting info. I’d be curious as to why exactly Roy ended on using the ports instead of 2 drivers. Maybe it added total output? I think it’d be cool if we could get closer to 15hz with the two sealed 18’s or the single driver with the port tuned lower.  

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On 6/26/2018 at 12:04 AM, AHall said:

Joined the museum support group and obtained the HF for my center channel build.

Darn ... guess that's why they no longer have a "pair." :( 

BTW; awesome set-up ... pretty jealous :D 

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On 7/31/2018 at 12:24 PM, Chris A said:

You might also ask Roy if you can simply replace the vents/tubes with another 18" woofer wired in series, which should give you deeper extension and more output (2.7 dB?) down low for movies, if the T/S parameters of that woofer show it to be a medium/low Qts and low Fs woofer. 

That was the original idea but it was not nearly as good, part of how the vented idea came about which improved it greatly.  

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On 7/31/2018 at 4:27 PM, AHall said:

I think it’d be cool if we could get closer to 15hz with the two sealed 18’s or the single driver with the port tuned lower.  

When you get the room done see how low it goes first and plug one port and check again is what I would do. 

 

We did talk about it more, and since the spec's are for half space you will probably be 2-3 lower than that as is, plugging one port should get you even lower, all depending on the room. He said there is no problem plugging a port since they are designed for really high output in a very large space and that kind of output is not really needed in your living room.

I would guess 130db continuous would not be healthy in a living room from a sub so a loss in overall output would not be a problem to go a little deeper for HT. imo  

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6 hours ago, dtel said:

When you get the room done see how low it goes first and plug one port and check again is what I would do. 

 

We did talk about it more, and since the spec's are for half space you will probably be 2-3 lower than that as is, plugging one port should get you even lower, all depending on the room. He said there is no problem plugging a port since they are designed for really high output in a very large space and that kind of output is not really needed in your living room.

I would guess 130db continuous would not be healthy in a living room from a sub so a loss in overall output would not be a problem to go a little deeper for HT. imo  

 

That is the plan. It’s not that I’m not fantastically impressed and satisfied. I just like to tinker. And if there is a “fine tune” that optimizes this setup for home use I’m all for it. 

 

On another note the front treatment has brought tremendous improvement in imaging and sound stage. Mesmerizing 

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Glad to hear that, there's always a little adjustment especially in a new room, the speakers are good, now to just get them dialed in for your room. 

 

Great deal on the Forte 2's also, for that price even if you don't need them it would be tough to pass up, you could easily sell later for a gain. At least they would be with someone who will appreciate them instead of being neglected.. 

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On 8/14/2018 at 9:18 PM, dtel said:

Glad to hear that, there's always a little adjustment especially in a new room, the speakers are good, now to just get them dialed in for your room. 

 

Great deal on the Forte 2's also, for that price even if you don't need them it would be tough to pass up, you could easily sell later for a gain. At least they would be with someone who will appreciate them instead of being neglected.. 

 

Id like to put them in my bedroom while I’m refinishing and customizing my khorns. I most likely won’t let them go unless I have someone close to me in need of these beauties. 

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I don't blame you but at that price you almost had to buy them. I never did say anything but even never seeing or meeting her I like your wife. :D Some panic at regular speakers and your house is way past panic for the average wife.  🏆

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On 8/31/2018 at 11:11 AM, dtel said:

After looking at the pictures again, what about pulling out the sub and unscrewing the rubber feet and replacing them with casters to make it easy to roll out easily ?

 

Definitely an option. I just wasn’t planning on pulling it out very often. 

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15 minutes ago, Khornukopia said:

How do your new compression drivers sound?

 

They sound amazing. They already sounded great. I’m enjoying the extra detail that they bring. It was costly, but I’m in this deep already so what the hell. I’ll really be excited when I upgrade the diaphragms to beryllium. I don’t like to be left wondering what else there is left on the table. 

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I guess I am due for a room update though. I’m slowly learning this complicated(for a newby like me) system. I’ve got more acoustic treatment finished up. I’ll probably stop here til I get a custom skylight cover and clouds. It’ll be nice to get to know the system better and learn to know their sound. At this point the sound is new enough and changes take place often enough that it’s hard to tell the changes that I make at times. 

 

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Cornwalls are inset and trim is in the process. I’m mostly done and when I am I’ll post an update. In my mind it has made a nice improvement in aesthetics. 

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