Deang Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 Erik, maybe you could write a short manual on how to build a network? You could start with a tutorial that explains how to solder -- with a list of tools, the different types of irons -- and which to use when. You could also discuss desoldering, and the correct way of doing it without damaging the part. You might include something about the different methods of connecting the wires, and why you might use one method "here", and another "there". I get a lot of email from people asking me what network they should run and why. If you would be so kind as to include a chapter showing all of the different schematics with some text explaining the sonic virtues of each circuit so the DIY'er could make an informed choice. A small chapter on passive components would be nice too -- describing their impact on the sonic signature of the speaker. You could also discuss the use of autoformers and L-pads, explaining the advantages and disadvantages of each. Lastly, please include your email address at the end of the booklet so newly encouraged DIY'ers can contact you with their questions and any problems they might encounter along the way. I have to go now, I'm teaching my 3 year old how to solder an ENIAC together. It's almost done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 Hey Craigo -- I think this one works. As a forum participant Jekyll and Hyde always plays by the rules and is consistently cordial and helpful a model netizen, until one day he comes completely uncorked and lashes out without warning. His unanticipated thunderbolts can temporarily rout even the sturdiest Warriors, and it often takes some time for his stunned opponents to mount a counter attack. Jekyll and Hydes sudden behavioral change may result from a psychotic episode, PMS, a downturn in the market, a surprise visit by the in-laws or a session of hard drinking... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codhead Posted October 14, 2005 Author Share Posted October 14, 2005 After doing these sockets on my DRD's (that's 22 AWG silver - smaller than it looks), I decided to spring for one of those ring lights with the magnifying glass in the middle. Man, what I'd give for the eyeballs of a 20-year-old! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Painful Reality Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 "While I'll never discourage someone interested in building their own stuff, I'll never encourage it either." http://www.magnequest.com/2a3_diy/Seth_2A3_s240_Manual_v1.pdf Er... Shawn, I hope you'll agree that there is a slight difference between offering a design on the web and encouraging everybody and their dog to jump in the DIY bandwagon. I sell irons for the DIYers so I sure hope there will be some DIYers! Also please note there are no "Hear Hear! DIY is soo easy even mom can do it!" anywhere in the text... Judging on what landed on my bench from time to time I just don't think DIYing is for everyone. Neither is bungee jumping, pottery, s&m, stamp collecting, home renovating, etc... Funny b*tch slap nonetheless... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 I'm not sure, but I think it's O.K. to do S&M and soldering at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Painful Reality Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 I'm not sure, but I think it's O.K. to do S&M and soldering at the same time.Deano Most will usually stop at hot wax... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Dean: "I think common sense dictates that you encourage those who have some basic skillsets already in place (like knowing how to solder, and being able to read a schematic), and you discourage those who have never done anything like a kit before from jumping in with the idea "there's nothing to it", and "it's easy!". People should definitely be enouraged, but not without giving them a good idea of what they're getting themselves into. I don't think it's right to do it in such a way that allows them to think it's like working with Elmer's glue and toothpicks." This is so very obvious. Let me ask you, Dean: Who comes into the world knowing how to solder (one of the skillsets to which you refer)? Did you? Of course not. However, that's something I have also encouraged others to try, because it's extremely easy to do. That might be something of a blow to the ego that places very simple soldering in the same ranks of heart and brain surgery, but I'm speaking the truth. It is very easy to do. The first step toward learning to make, well....anything..., is acquiring the tools needed for the job; and I consider soldering one of those tools. My god, how complex is holding the clean tip of a hot iron to a joint long enough to where touching the joint itself with the end of a piece of solder causes the solder to immediately melt and flow into the joint. There is nothing to it. Desoldering isn't any more difficult. I am encouraging people to LEARN the basic skills needed. NOBODY HAS THOSE SKILLS ALREADY IN PLACE! LOL! Dean: I learned to solder when I was five. FIVE years old! The only time I could spend with my dad when I was little, was if I sat and watched him build enormous tube radio transmitters and receivers in his workroom. It bored me to death. To keep me busy, he showed me the very, very simple steps of cleaning and tinning the tip of the iron, and in no time I was building little toy animals and imaginary creatures out pieces of tin can. My mom still has some of these that she saved all these years. So, Dean, you build old designs of crossovers with new parts -- good idea. MY MOM built a shortwave radio as a first time project. She learned to solder in a couple of hours. She could read and follow basic step-by-step instructions, and the thing worked fine. Nah, soldering isn't very hard at all. If you had that much trouble learning, I respect and admire the fortitude it took to get you where you are. If we learned, anyone can. Have a great day! Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Craig: "Yaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwn I always did hate the teachers that put me to sleep." This response really made me laugh, Craig -- Thanks for that! But..............don't you see, the comment is the same to me as if we were playing chess. If this was your first move, you have already put yourself in checkmate! No, I don't think I'm going to do it. As tempted as I am, I'm going suggest we start the game all over again, ok?![] Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Codhead: "After doing these sockets on my DRD's (that's 22 AWG silver - smaller than it looks), I decided to spring for one of those ring lights with the magnifying glass in the middle. Man, what I'd give for the eyeballs of a 20-year-old!" Very nice work on those connections! The DRD 300Bs have gotten great reviews, and I'm contemplating something along the same lines to use with a pair of 300Bs another very thoughtful forum member sent to me. Good work on wiring that socket -- super clean, very little residual flux, an excellent mechanical connection! Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Shawn: Well-placed. "there is a slight difference between offering a design on the web and encouraging everybody and their dog to jump in the DIY bandwagon. I sell irons for the DIYers so I sure hope there will be some DIYers!" Jeff: Another simple concept: People have to start somewhere, no? DIYers CAN'T get to the point of building from scratch until they learn the more simple steps first. I've encouraged others to learn soldering on this forum countless times in the past, and even that gets blasted out of the sky like an enemy missle. BTW: Why not encourage a mom to make a kit of some kind?! The ham radio operators in my family communicate very frequently with women who have not only built but designed their own rigs. It's unfortunate IMO that anyone should be excluded from this by virtue of gender or parental status (aka -- a mom). Very elitist, IMO, and does not credit the fact that a new DIYer who may happen to be a woman and/or a mother would have every chance of success at a project as would a guy. Sorry, unacceptable. If there are readers of this laborious thread who are interested in taking the first steps into the fun of audio DIYing, please do so! Yes, you may make mistakes and have failures along the way. We ALL have experienced that. Learning to solder is truly very easy to do, although a frequent first mistake is not allowing a joint between to parts to heat up enough before applying solder. I have received emails in the past couple days by people who told me they were about to try a project for themselves. Great! Keep at it, and you'll get it! Keep at it some more, and you may end up placing an order with Pantheon Audio for MagneQuest iron for your first scratch-built product. Until you get to that point, I know of many very good beginner tube preamp and amp projects that were designed, as I said before, for the beginner in mind. Electricity is extremely dangerous -- and so is driving. NONE of us was born with a soldering iron in hand, but once you try it, you'll see how easy soldering can be. Doing finer work, such as soldering leads onto RCA jacks, is a little more challenging than most point-to-point wiring between passive parts like resistors and capacitors, but it just takes practice. Proceed with caution, never hesitate to ask for help from someone who knows, and enjoy the process. It's lots of fun. Erik PS: Jeff, I agree with you -- Shawn's post hit the nail on the head, didn't it? Oh! if some of you check the link Shawn posted above, you'll see a reference to Jeff's Horus 2A3 parafeed amps. I built them myself, and they would also make for a good project if you've already done a small amount of kit building. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 You should added to the caption. "But in the end I'm depressed because my $50 digital amp sounds as good as all my hard work" But hey anyone can do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 You should added to the caption. "But in the end I'm depressed because my $50 digital amp sounds as good as all my hard work" But hey anyone can do it. at the end everything sounds like chickin.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Dean: I learned to solder when I was five. FIVE years old! The only time I could spend with my dad when I was little, was if I sat and watched him build enormous tube radio transmitters and receivers in his workroom. It bored me to death. To keep me busy, he showed me the very, very simple steps of cleaning and tinning the tip of the iron, and in no time I was building little toy animals and imaginary creatures out pieces of tin can. My mom still has some of these that she saved all these years. So, Dean, you build old designs of crossovers with new parts -- good idea. MY MOM built a shortwave radio as a first time project. She learned to solder in a couple of hours. She could read and follow basic step-by-step instructions, and the thing worked fine. Nah, soldering isn't very hard at all. If you had that much trouble learning, I respect and admire the fortitude it took to get you where you are. If we learned, anyone can. Have a great day! Erik Erik, Painting things with a very broad stroke there. I had the very same experience growing up as you. I too thought the soldering and electronics tinkering was a bore but still enjoyed the quality time with my father and will still do to this today. THIS LIFE EXPEREINCE at a young age is what makes all this stuff seem simple to guy/gals like us. There are many people that are absolutely not electrically inclined just like some people are not mechanically inclined. I have two brothers that grew up right along side me that can barely change a tire on there automobiles but I've built race engines for my old quarter mile bruiser. Your very wrong not everyone could or should start messing with electronics. People are born and raised with different skill sets. Some people excel at math other english (I'm math all the way[]). I'm sure not every one of your students gets straight A's !! If people can learn anything then explain why this is? I guess your a absolute failure by this train of thought. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 I'm still waiting to hear if I should be using Gorilla Glue instead of Elmers.... I learned how to solder on my own, in self defense, since my brother was a late grade school ham radio DIY person. He kept slipping with the iron and poking me in the hand while I was holding a part for him. I pretty much agree with Erik on this, but I like the disclaimer that Shannon Parks has in his tube amp manuals: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Dean, "but I've never done an amp or preamp kit. " You should try it sometime. Or rebuild an operating vintage component. You would find it is no different then what you do on the crossovers. Just that there are more components to swap out. You don't have to understand the circuit to replace old capacitors and resistors. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Jeff, "I hope you'll agree that there is a slight difference between offering a design on the web and encouraging everybody and their dog to jump in the DIY bandwagon. I sell irons for the DIYers so I sure hope there will be some DIYers!" Just as there is a difference between offering a design on the web and selling iron to DIYers then there is saying one never encourages DIY. That is all I was pointing out. "judging on what landed on my bench from time to time I just don't think DIYing is for everyone. Neither is bungee jumping, pottery, s&m, stamp collecting, home renovating, etc..." I have no doubt about that. But for some desoldering a resistor or capacitor (or even just clipping it out to start on a hardwired circuit) and soldering in a replacement one part at a time would be no big deal. Taken one component at a time would help keep someone from getting 'lost' in what they are doing. If they were inexperienced soldering a $10 multi-meter would verify if they have a good solder joint or not until they learn to trust their soldering and to spot a bad joint by eye. It is just amusing that some who are discouraging people from learning how to swap out resistors and capacitors are those making money swapping out resistors and capacitors. Funny how that works. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Dean, "but I've never done an amp or preamp kit. " You should try it sometime. Or rebuild an operating vintage component. You would find it is no different then what you do on the crossovers. Just that there are more components to swap out. You don't have to understand the circuit to replace old capacitors and resistors. Shawn Another over simplified description of the task. Are there twins in here? Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 But for some desoldering a resistor or capacitor (or even just clipping it out to start on a hardwired circuit) and soldering in a replacement one part at a time would be no big deal. Taken one component at a time would help keep someone from getting 'lost' in what they are doing. If they were inexperienced soldering a $10 multi-meter would verify if they have a good solder joint or not until they learn to trust their soldering and to spot a bad joint by eye. It is just amusing that some who are discouraging people from learning how to swap out resistors and capacitors are those making money swapping out resistors and capacitors. Funny how that works. Shawn Ummm that is bad information. A multi meter is not a absolute way to determine if a solder joint is indeed good. Once a circuit is fired up and put under load and full voltage many poorly done solder joints that measure perfect with a meter can create some serious noise and problems in the circuit. First off none of us are truly discouraging people from trying this........ were simply saying that not everyone has the natural ability to do it properly. Spend a few days in the hot seat working on the gazzilion kit amps from the 60's and you'll get this opinion really fast........... This isn't a guess or a opinion this is a time proven fact. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 "Another over simplified description of the task." No, it isn't. Rebuilding a piece of gear to the stock circuit is nothing more them swapping out parts. An OHM meter will catch bad solder connections in most cases. Besides, once someone learns to solder it becomes very obvious when there is a cold solder joint. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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