What the Eff.....over??

[Kriton]

Of course the folks who know me know that I would have to weigh in on

this a little...Also those of you who have met my wife know that I got

lucky, and I tell her often. My five day old daughter Elise is a

strange occurence in what was otherwise a terribly comfortable and

understanding relationship - but as I told my wife, loving my daughter

is easy, if for no other reason than because she is just an extension of my wife...

But don't be fooled - I had/have deep misgivings about relationships

(somehwat of an occupational hazard), and I have seen everything vile

that people who claim to love each other can do to one another and

their kids...it took until I was 35 to marry (after at least two failed

engagements earlier in youth), after living together for

5 years...When we met I was at the lowest point in my life, I moved

from

another state, gave up everything, was living like a rat - but I got

involved in something

I really used to enjoy doing, and met my wife who was also involved and

passionate about the same activity, and it was really over pretty

quickly...I got very

lucky - but so can you. All I can say is that I am so glad I

waited till I was ready, because I know that if I had married anyone

else there would have eventually been a war to end all wars.

Nothing is forever, and to think that

anything will last forever is to doom yourself to disappointment,

whether it is folks just growing apart or the death of a loved

one. Communication, to the point of distraction and boredom, is

the absolute key, I think.

Now lets dispel some rumors - first, Texas at least is a "community

property" state, meaning that there are a few ground rules - first, what

you had prior to marriage, what is given to you as a gift during

marriage, and any **inheritance** - is yours - and cannot be divided upon

divorce, unless you put it in a joint bank account, write joint checks

and pay joint bills (thereby making it indistinguishable from her funds

or funds you have made during the marriage). Keep it separate, it

stays separate (with a few very minor exceptions, like interest income - but

that is very specific). SO lets say you had a 58 Belaire that owned

prior to marriage, and you sell it after marriage to put a down on a

house - if you can show where it came from you would be entitled to get

that down back first - before everything is split, get it? ALSO,

at least here 50% is NOT the usual split. The courts here can

split the community estate in any manner that they deem "just and

right", meaning that they could (and often DO) give you or your spouse

more than fifty percent of the community property or value, which makes

sense in most cases - say you earn 200k and you spouse earns 20k - to

split the estate fifty-fifty doesn't take into account the disparity in

earnings between the parties. HOWEVER, every state is different!!

The reason I mention this is most of us learned about divorce from what

we have seen on Knott's Landing or Falcon Crest or "Cruel Intentions",

and most of the time it just doesn't work that way... AND it changes

every single time the individual legislatures get together and tweak

the family code (hundreds of changes to Texas family code on average

every two years) - My point is, call a good attorney in your

jurisidction before it becomes an issue, and get your facts straight -

call it a "prophylactic" meeting, and put those fears aside. Pay

them for an hour of their time to tell you what the state of things

are, and protect yourself - THEN, go get get that woman that makes

you sing, they are out there - man, if a PIA like me can find one,

friends - so can you. AND even if it doesn't last, god forbid -

the good times have still been the best moments of my life so far.

Just my insignificant 2c.

K

[Cal Blacksmith]

I debated on if I should put in my $0.02 or not then thought

what the heck.

The wife and I will have our 25^th anniversary

this year. We were both after the mid 20s when we got married so we had some

idea of who we were before we got married. We have had some medical problems

that would have broken up couples that were less committed to each other. I cant

count the number of nights I spend in the hospital tending to her needs. On one

occasion, the nurses lost the other bed in a semi-private room and moved in a

cot for me (NO EXTRA CHARGE) [] We have been through at least half a dozen brain

surgeries on my wife. She will never be free from the disease that has its

grips on her. Heck, there isnt even a name for what she has. She should have

been dead long ago. Her case was once presented at a medical convention for neurosurgeons

and one of the doctors asked how old was the patent when they died? That was

over 20 years ago and she is still kicking!

Have I ever thought of what life would be like with someone

else? Sure, but I also realize that there is no person on the face of the earth

that is perfect and I am very glad to have found someone who is willing to

deal with all my shortcomings. Our experience in the hospitals has taught us

that there is always someone who is in worse shape than your self and tough as

our situation is, I have many times said, I am glad we dont have THAT

problem!

Marriage is a 2 way street, it can not be all give and no receive,

nor can it be all receive and no give. We each know each others buttons but

choose not to push them, rather we look out for each other and try to do what

is best for them and in doing so, do the best for our self and the marriage on

the whole.

This post might sting a little to those who have not had the

same experience as my wife and I have had and I am truly sorry for your

situation. Amy was right with the know thy self comment. The other truth is

that no matter who you are with, changing partners will not make things better;

you will only change problems, as there are no perfect people in the world.

If you both realize this and truly seek to make things better between your

selves, you can make a good life together. If one person in the relationship

fails to realize this, the road gets much rougher. No other person can make you

happy, only you can do that yourself. (I am referring to NORMAL

people here, not people who beat up or abuse someone in any way!)

The people who are the most attractive to the opposite sex

are those who are ease with themselves; confident in whom they are and do NOT

project insecurity or need. Think about it, dont the alarm bells go off in

your head when you meet someone who seems a little clingy or needy? Yet if

you meet someone is at ease inside themselves and projects a self-confidence

that says I am happy with who I am are you not drawn to them? In every

relationship, there comes a time at the beginning where the other person will

test you in this. There will be a fight or disagreement and they will threaten

to leave or will leave, you must let them go. Do not go begging after them for

if you do, you will surely poison the relationship and it will not work out.

The other person needs to know that they are free to go and are not trapped.

They may come back or they may not but if you grovel to get them back, you have

lost. Is this clear as mud? This is an ironic part of human nature, that in

order to give ourselves to someone else, we must know that they dont need us. Weird

huh?

[igor2]

On November 8 2000 I came home and found my wife gone. She left me with twenty dollars cash and minus 900.00 in the bank. On Sept 10 2001 I bought a house and had a houseful of new stuff. For five years I was a hermit with just music and movies for company. On June 21 2005 I logged on to match.com. On June 25 I met the love of my life. She moved into my house in October but alas my Forte II's and my 4 KG 5.5's moved into the closet. With all of her stuff in my house I only had room for a pair of KSB 3.1's. But I told her that she meant more to me then big speakers and she did bring a 55" tv. However all is not lost. Today I sold my house for a profit of $40,000.00. This weekend we will be moving into her house. Since her house is 50% bigger then mine all of my speakers will be comming out of the closets again. I belive that November 8 2000 was the second best my of my life and that June 25 2005 was the best day of my life. I am now with the person I should be with. Sometimes what appears to be an ending is really a new beginning.

[jt1stcav]

Great story, igor2...you're one of the lucky ones who's life has been turned around for the best!

OT...like your sig...[O]

[cwop]

Sadly, you've just stated a fundamental truth--------try this one..

http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/Columnists/Byfield_Ted/2006/06/24/1651662.html

[m00n]

Relationships are hard, I don't think anyone will argue that.

My only philosophy to throw into this mix: no relationship is going to work if you don't have a good relationship with yourself. Learn how to be on your own, and happy on your own, and the rest will follow. There's nothing more attractive to a person seeking a partner than someone confident and secure in their own world. It only makes them want to be a part of it.

Bingo! And not just with someone seeking an partner, but in an existing relationship as well. My wife has told me many times that confidence is very attractive. My wife and I almost divorced a year ago. In fact it was July/4th last year. There were fireworks going off outside and fireworks going off in our bedroom at the same time, and I don't mean the good kind of fireworks in the bedroom. A very serious, ominous gut wrenching talk between us. We decided to stay together and try to work things out. While we still have some issues, our marriage is better now.

Recently I was talking with my 28 year old female cousin, she was talking to me about her boyfriend. She really loves the guy but one of her problems with him is that he is too much of a people pleaser and never stands up for himself and what he wants. Women don't like this as much as we may think they do, they really want a guy to be and act like a man. Take charge. She was explaining to me that he is very sexually intraverted, that if he is told no, he does not speak out or make an issue about it, that he's not very sexually stimulating. I told her to leave some porn up on the computer screen, do something to bring him out of his shell. She did one better, she went out to an adult store and made some purchases. She called me and was very excided about the results. Looks like my little bit of advice has started to turn that relationship around.

One situation that's been a hard thing for me at times is that my wife tends to be a situational control freak if you will. On the outside she gives off the impression that she wants me to bow down to her and let everything be her way, but at the same time, she wants me to be a man and put her in her place.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, be a good man to your woman, treat her well, but do NOT let her run your life, stand up to her and be firm - be a man. If you don't she won't repsect you and if she does not respect you, the love she had for you will fade and you will end up sepparating.

[Mighty Favog]

There's nothing more attractive to a person seeking a partner than someone confident and secure in their own world. It only makes them want to be a part of it."

As long as it doesn't cross over into that someone being "cocky". I've seen that plenty of times

[formica]

Tom, I hope everything is going good for you... haven't seen you on

here in a while (or did I miss it?). Just thought I'd through in

a couple of my 2¢ as well...

However, at the risk of getting really deep

here, the bottom line is that the human male and female species have a

very real desire and natural instinct to be in a one-on-one

relationship. And there's plenty of studies to prove this.

I don't know if you saw the same documentary as I did... but I loved

the quote from one specialist who said we are "evolutionarily

programmed to forming pair bonds, but at the same time programmed to

being unfaithful to them".

These problems have been around for centuries... but are a little more

apparent now because both partners are independent enough to have

choices. That, and the fact that we are more comfortable talking

about it.

Bruce's situation is a bit different with the

tragic death of a loved one (they were still very much in love right up

to the end), but even after his loss, he's gradually moved on and is

still getting out and enjoying life today (I'm sure his wife would have

wanted it that way).

I'm sure she did.

With my dad's passing in March... I look at my mom, doing her best,

getting out there... being with her friends looking for new ways to

appreciate life. She didn't always feel like it... but I'm sure

my dad would have wanted her to, and things are beginning to pick up.

She really loves the guy but one of her problems

with him is that he is too much of a people pleaser and never stands up

for himself and what he wants. Women don't like this as much as we may

think they do, they really want a guy to be and act like a man.

Comes back a little to what Tom said about nice guys finishing last...

doesn't it? I do know what you are getting at... it's all a balancing act where both people's wants get

catered. In this short time, I find myself feeling very confident

and self assured... obviously I can't test to see if I've improved my

personal "wants" because right now it's all about me without

compromise. Yet, I've got a good feeling about that to...

All that to say... even though everything may look all "doom and gloom"

following a separation, life is too short not to make the most of

it. Logic and experience tells me that everything works out in

the long run (one way or the other)... so it's just a question feeling IT to.

I think I've succeed well there to... hope Tom's been having my luck with his situation...

ROb

[efzauner]

My wife and I are in our 40s, happily maried 14 years and have 3 kids. I see so many couples with kids getting divorced. My wife tells me the woman's side, which I presume is somewhat biased, so I will only comment on what I observed from the male side of disfunctional familes near me that have divorced or are on the verge:

1: Dad works weekends (That is not his fault, he does work hard), Is off on monday and tuesday and plays golf. I never see him playing with his kids. The kids are at our house more often than at home and I play with them more than he does. He spends more time with his golf and drinking budies than with his kids....

2: Dad plays golf all the time. Spends 20K on golf membership. His kids need clothes and his boy has ADD. Where is dad when his kids need him? They divorced years ago.

3: 2 of my 3 kids are soccer age. I work all day, and then take them to soccer to give my wife a break. Where are the rest of the dads? Surely you can make a 7:15 game once a month?

4: Met a dad at a birthday party. The week after at soccer I asked the mom where dad was... She said they where separated. Um excuse me, Separated from you maybe, but did he divorce the kids too? Where the hell is he?

I see far to many men not taking the responsability to be a father or a husband.

Yet I know of a couple with 4 kids who are not that well off. Both work very hard and he held down 2 jobs while going to school to change carreers, then moved the family to where the job was. I take my hat of at this guy. Conclusion: Men can be real men if they want to, but some think that they are still in college.

[Marvel]

Bruce's situation is a bit different with the tragic death of a loved one (they were still very much in love right up to the end), but even after his loss, he's gradually moved on and is still getting out and enjoying life today (I'm sure his wife would have wanted it that way). I have a world of respect for this man, and I think many others here on this forum are exactly the same way. It's not easy, but it can be done.

Gradually moving on and sometimes being successful at it. Some days are certainly better than others. A good friend of mine told me that now, the will must really come into play. Force the routine, otherwise much of what you do becomes rather unimportant, or at least seems that way. (why do dishes? why eat? so what if laundry stays in the dryer?)

A good indicator for me is that I am paying more attention to others around me. How they feel and what they are going through. Just like having a physical wound, where you can't do anything until it heals enough that you can move and not hurt.

Not a day goes by that I don't feel the hurt and pain, but there is also laughter every day. Sometimes a lot of laughter.

Bruce