mikebse2a3

Hey my friend 🙂 That’s not what I’m reading ….. Yes the UMIK and Soundcard calibration files are used for correction but they don’t provide level calibration. For Level calibration you have to set the meter accuracy against a know accurate SPL Meter or SPL Meter Calibrator…. Also note if any input level changes are made in soundcard preferences you have to recalibrate again. miketn

This might also be a good option…. 99% mineral oil and lemon scented.

I use to use Formby Lemon Oil on my Walnut Klipschorns for many years with great results but it is no longer available. This looks to be similar and it or something similar might be worth your trying….

While the internet is full of DIY Tube Traps I’ve yet to see any that come remotely close to the real “ASC Tube Traps” … Here is a simulation picture from ASC showing an example of construction details of the “ASC Tube Trap” and also some quoted comments from Art Noxon describing the construction. BELOW: Is quoted from Art Noxon from discussion on another forum where DIY was mentioned” ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ I see no reason a person couldn’t build regular style DIY absorption panels with some kind of stand to avoid having to hang them on the walls and for placement flexibility but of course you wouldn’t have the diffusion ability of the “ASC Tube Trap”. I would strongly suggest whatever absorption panel design you choose that a reflective type membrane functioning similar to the ASC be implemented especially if it is for a 2-ch stereo system/setup. miketn🙂

Don’t forget to calibrate the REW SPL Meter for accurate readings…. 🙂

The Jubilee and room are beautiful together….. 👍🙂 miketn

This REW link has information that helps to understand the differences in SPL meter settings. https://www.roomeqwizard.com/help/help_en-GB/html/splmeter.html C weighting covers a wider frequency spectrum than A weighting Slow weighting gives a more average reading versus Fast weighting. NOTE: If anyone is using REW you must calibrate the meter for accurate readings miketn Here are a couple of screen shots from the link

For the purpose of this thread I believe your settings and method are very reasonable and repeatable for others interested in this threads comparison goal. It might be interesting to see people report C-weighted / in both Fast and Slow mode for comparison as well. miketn

Just for clarity when reporting the sound levels people are listening at what are the applied weightings (ie: dB(A), dB(C), dB(Z) and response time (ie: Fast or Slow) of the SPL Meters being used by everyone..? Other variables that should be considered: (1) The orientation of the Microphone (ie: are you pointing toward the loudspeaker sources or the ceiling for example). (2) Placement of the Microphone/Meter (ie: at eye level and arms length or lower and closer to the body or placed on an object like table or ottoman for examples). All the above can lead to considerable variations in the reported levels listeners are reporting if not consistently applied by everyone. miketn

This ^^^^ miketn 🙂

Keep in mind that the Polars of the Jubilee are much more consistent across the frequency spectrum versus the Klipschorn and this creates a more consistent interaction with the room boundary reflections versus the Klipschorn when placed in the same location. miketn

I believe what you experienced at 30’ was speaker/room interaction and not loudspeaker driver integration since you are in the extreme far field in your room at that distance. Even at 10’ distance the speaker/room interaction is still very strong and can influence a persons perception of sound quality. I would suggest if a person wants to listen for when the loudspeaker’s drivers integrations occurs that they may want to listen in an open outside space so that it isn’t masked by a room’s boundary interactions and reflections with the loudspeaker/listening positions. miketn

Just keep in mind @MMurg has experience also with these in the larger Klipsch Lab Listening Room and is we’ll aware of how they can reproduce sound in a much larger room. @MMurg So I’m curious can you describe the sense of imaging and soundstage scale in your room 🆚 the imaging and soundstage scale as experienced in the Klipsch Lab Listening Room..? miketn🙂

I appreciate that you have an opinion but I can offer you real world experience since the picture you posted is of my “Underground Jubilee” in my first room which was about 12ft x 17ft and the only room I had available when I bought them and I had Klipschorns in the room previously as well as Heresy in this room. My experience was that the Heresy was clearly outperformed by the Klipschorn and the “Underground Jubilee” outperformed them both in this room. I will say they all have the ability to perform even better (especially as it pertains to imaging and soundstage) in a larger room if the larger room has good acoustics. When I bought the “Underground Jubilee” it was always my plan to eventually place them into a larger room but until I had that larger room I had the best performing Klipsch Loudspeaker which gave me the best sound this room would ever be capable of. miketn🙂 Picture taken when I first moved them to the current listening room.

This is the (2) conductor zip cord that was very commonly used by Klipsch as used in this Klipsch Belle top section I have. The wire is at most 18ga tin-coated stranded wire. miketn

Having experienced the Heritage Jubilee in Hope at the “Last Jubfest” I fully understand his reactions and the realism of their musical reproduction was something I’m still wrapping my mind around..!!! 😄 miketn

@babadono Here you can see how I’m using the Studio Traps at First Reflection points and they give me the ability to choose between absorption or diffusion as well as the ability to disperse/redirect the reflections. This is a powerful feature that allows me to easily experiment and adjust the room acoustics for the sense of liveness I find desirable and engaging. Note: due to the loudspeakers placements and the fact they are horns with controlled directivity I am able to choose a much more HF reflective return into the room versus the standard direction that you usually see ASC recommend which is often depicted with wide dispersion direct radiator systems. I have also removed (seen stacked on the floor) some of the flat wall panel Sound Planks to adjust the overall HF absorption for a better balance of the liveness sensation. miketn

I wouldn’t consider myself as a purist especially considering the almost total lack of standardized practices in recording and playback as evident in the real world we live and listen in. In my experience reverb is experienced much differently than what I consider liveness and room spaciousness that can happen in a room designed for good 2ch reproduction. Some 2ch to Multi-Channel Playback conversion effects programs might bring some liveness and spaciousness simulation back to acoustically dead listening rooms and this is why multi-channel home theater rooms are often found to be treated with much more absorption because the liveness/spaciousness are in the surround channels programming. Not based on my experiences. The strength and timing of the first reflection points and the channel’s they are associated with are factors to be considered along with the polar response of the loudspeakers and what works best could be better left untreated, redirected, or diffused instead of absorbed in some situations. I mentioned the Polar Response of the loudspeaker as a variable because when you so often see Room Treatments as suggested by many companies they are most often using wide-dispersion loudspeakers and that often wouldn’t be the appropriate treatment methods for dipole loudspeakers or controlled directivity horn loudspeakers in my experiences. miketn

If this is going to be used as a 2-channel stereo system then I would caution the over use of absorption because it’s easy to unnaturally alter the decay of sound especially in the upper midrange and high frequencies and basically it begins to sound like an anechoic chamber (a very unpleasant place for music when you experience it.) in the upper midrange and high frequencies. This can be very fatiguing and some frequencies can almost become piercing. Diffusion can be a mixed bag as well depending on the type of diffusers you choose. Overall I have come to prefer poly type diffusers versus ones like the RPG QRD Type or RPG Skyline primitive root diffusers because all can work well when used properly but the RPG Type if not placed optimally can sometimes create some audible effects that can lead to a fatigue effect revealed over extended listening. The Poly Diffusers seem to be the most forgiving of placement and rarely cause undesirable audible effects in my experience. In my current listening room the only places I ultimately found beneficial and acceptable for the Skyline diffusers was on the front wall and as a ceiling cloud above the listening position. In a smaller room the Skyline worked well on the side wall first reflection points but only after I slightly offset their positions so that left and right didn’t send symmetrical reflective signals to the center listening position. Visually the Skyline diffusers might seem impressive to some when on the front wall I actually prefer a less dramatic and more visually neutral and relaxing front wall where it becomes easier to visually imagine the imaging in recordings and ultimately listening in a dimly lit or dark room best of all. I consider the ASC Tube Trap design to offer the least negative and most positive and easiest to place and one of the most important features of all is their adjustability for absorption/versus diffusion above approximately 400Hz which I find extremely valuable achieving the proper liveness and decay of the upper midrange and high frequencies. All ASC products have upper frequency absorption control to prevent unnatural over absorption unless ordered/specified differently. Whatever you choose for absorption I strongly suggest it feature some form of upper frequency absorption control/limitation if possible to prevent the unnatural anechoic effect in the mid/high frequencies. Have you identified the best balanced/smoothest locations for your loudspeakers for the frequency range below 200Hz..? This is step one IMHO and the foundation to begin the acoustical design of the listening room/loudspeaker integration. miketn 2 Examples of Skyline Diffusers positions that worked for me but again ultimately I chose them in the Cloud Position which also allowed me to shift the floor to ceiling room mode at the listening position to a more favorable frequency.

The Roy you see in the museum video you posted is the Roy I have always known from the first time we met which is a down to earth person who loves to laugh, tinker, share knowledge, easy going, designs speakers that sound OK and loves bass fishing. His love and respect for PWK is obvious when you talk with him. Oh by the way he really is the “Chief Bonehead” 😜 miketn

Place the Jubs side by side would get you very close… miketn

I would say NO based on the fact that we never seem to see reports of cone/coil rubbing even on 40 year old units. miketn

You know baby will just find something else to be upset about…. 😄

GOOD GRIEF…!!!! 🤪 Talk about sucking the life out of these forums…. Just keep it up guys.. !!! Maybe it would help if people stepped away from their keyboard and instead turned their attention to things that really mattered in life. If the forum isn’t fun or informative for you then maybe ask youself what are you bringing to the place…? miketn

They state not to use in other manufactures equipment just for their units if someone wants to experiment with their preamps as optional solid state units. Might be an interesting experience for open minded users. miketn