cornscala vs klipschorn

[pandaboy]

In a battle of clarity, bass depth, sensitivity, and what ever else. What do you think would win between the frankenstein and the king of klipsch?

I ask because I am either going to get a klipschorn or make a cornscala.

[Groomlakearea51]

The "Emperor" will win that contest. C'scala's are good... but just not quite that good. (IMHO)

[GWSmith]

Hi Groom.... And I have to agree with you. K'Horns make the most of 8 FEET don't you think ???? []

.....Gary

[Guest David H]

The KHorn will reign supreme in the proper environment, however Corscala's works well just about anywhere.

Dave.

[greg928gts]

The KHorn will reign supreme in the proper environment, however Corscala's works well just about anywhere.

Dave.

I agree, the Cornscala will give you flexibility. But the Khorn bass is far superior IMO.

Greg

[CIGARBUM]

They are both great speakers, one is not better than the other, they are just different.

cb

[artto]

They are both great speakers, one is not better than the other, they are just different.

cb

Quite wrong Sir. Yes, they are both great speakers. Yes they are both different. And, It does, depend on what you consider "better", however it is a fact that the Khorn has much lower distortion in the bass range (thats nearly half of the audible musical frequency range). Its the nature of the beast.

[GWSmith]

Hello there Artto... Is your avatar YOUR ROOM??? If so, WOW, would you send that photo so I could get a closer look? Has to be the most luxurious space a pair of K'Horns could ever want []

I'll send mine over, a bit smaller but dedicated to that vintage gear only..

..........Gary

[bhendrix]

Quite wrong Sir. Yes, they are both great speakers. Yes they are both different. And, It does, depend on what you consider "better", however it is a fact that the Khorn has much lower distortion in the bass range (thats nearly half of the audible musical frequency range). Its the nature of the beast.

Artto is quite right. The K-Horn has much lower distortion. That said, I will submit that the Klipschhorn Jubilee is now the king of the Klipsch. The Jubilee has approximately 1/10th the distortion (if memory serves correctly) of the original K-Horn.

I humbly offer this opinion based on my experience with ownership of multiple pairs of K-Horns, Cornwalls, etc. and now Jubilees, spanning the years beginning in 1970 with my first pair of decorator Cornwalls. Nothing comes close to the Jubilee, including the K-Horn.

[artto]

Hello there Artto... Is your avatar YOUR ROOM???

..........Gary

Yes Gary, that's my room. Here's the link for more info:

http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/t/19799.aspx

[artto]

Quite wrong Sir. Yes, they are both great speakers. Yes they are both different. And, It does, depend on what you consider "better", however it is a fact that the Khorn has much lower distortion in the bass range (thats nearly half of the audible musical frequency range). Its the nature of the beast.

Artto is quite right. The K-Horn has much lower distortion. That said, I will submit that the Klipschhorn Jubilee is now the king of the Klipsch. The Jubilee has approximately 1/10th the distortion (if memory serves correctly) of the original K-Horn.

I humbly offer this opinion based on my experience with ownership of multiple pairs of K-Horns, Cornwalls, etc. and now Jubilees, spanning the years beginning in 1970 with my first pair of decorator Cornwalls. Nothing comes close to the Jubilee, including the K-Horn.

Umm....not quite Bill. Not 1/10 the distortion. In fact, at some frequencies, like 250Hz -400Hz the Jubilee actually has higher second and third harmonic distortion than a Klipschorn. At other frequencies the Jubilee is slightly lower. There's an AES white paper by Roy floating around here somewhere that explains it all.

BTW, I finally had a chance to audition some domesticated Jubilees (2-way version) at fyrpower (Steve)'s place here in the Chicago area. I honestly didn't find the bass to be any better (although surprisingly good considering the room/conditions - sorry Steve, most of you guys know where I'm coming from) which tells me that the room is still a substantial influence on performance. The 402 on the other hand ~ definitely an improvement, mainly more coherent IMO. I'm looking into integrating the 402 with my Khorns.

[Coytee]

Rigma did that with his Khorns (K402 on top). As I recall, I think he said it sounded quite nice. Looked a bit weird but hey... who am I to judge asthetics? []

[Coytee]

Found it. I thought I had this pic at work. It's actually at home.

This is Rigma's experiment

[GWSmith]

Thanks Artto ! Checked out those photos. Its seems the K'Horns were changed out at some point? Ok then, here is a shot of mine with the rebuilt Dynaco MKlll's featured on their own stands. I feel that vintage 'jewlery' should be out in the open, and the glow of the Gold Lions after dark.........well, you get the idea []

Here you go..............

..........Gary

[winchester21]

I have heard both- driven through VRDs - IMHO the K horn wins hands down. K horns are hard to beat until you get reallly crazy with Jubs and other concoctions. Just my 2 cents worth on a highly subjective subject.

[khorn#1]

Artto,

I will admit that you have as much knowledge and understanding of Klipschorns and how to set up the room they are to perform in than anybody I have come across on this forum but, I can give you, I think, some great sound advice on the upper horns.

I have 2004 khorns, bought them brand new from a dealer, should have bought used ones because I have upgraded every component except the bass driver ( k33 ). It was nice to get brand new in the box and help keep the Heritage line going, anyway, I have Alk es crossovers, completely inclosed the backs, reinforced the corners they are in, went from the k-401 horn to Alk Trachorns which was an improvement with the k55 mid driver used with the trachorns also. Went with Bob Crites tweeters which was also an improvement. Sound treatments throughout the room which also was an improvement

In saying all of the above, I will say this, the best sound improvement I made to my khorn setup was buying and installing Greg Roberts vtrac horn with the BMS 4592 mid driver. Alk es networks are a close second on my upgrade list but, I have heard vtrac's with alk universals and it sound very good also. The es networks offer more control at higher volumns but I could live with the universal networks.

I could not live without the vtrac BMS setup. To me its that good and others on this forum will agree that have them or have tried Greg's vtrac demo in their home. I have never heard the 402 so I cant make any comments on that setup but, according to others on this forum, they perform wonderfully.

I think Greg is still offering the in home vtrac demo, I think it would be worth your time to hear these. Just my two cents.

Regards,

Randy

[twistedcrankcammer]

Quite wrong Sir. Yes, they are both great speakers. Yes they are both different. And, It does, depend on what you consider "better", however it is a fact that the Khorn has much lower distortion in the bass range (thats nearly half of the audible musical frequency range). Its the nature of the beast.

Artto is quite right. The K-Horn has much lower distortion. That said, I will submit that the Klipschhorn Jubilee is now the king of the Klipsch. The Jubilee has approximately 1/10th the distortion (if memory serves correctly) of the original K-Horn.

I humbly offer this opinion based on my experience with ownership of multiple pairs of K-Horns, Cornwalls, etc. and now Jubilees, spanning the years beginning in 1970 with my first pair of decorator Cornwalls. Nothing comes close to the Jubilee, including the K-Horn.

Umm....not quite Bill. Not 1/10 the distortion. In fact, at some frequencies, like 250Hz -400Hz the Jubilee actually has higher second and third harmonic distortion than a Klipschorn. At other frequencies the Jubilee is slightly lower. There's an AES white paper by Roy floating around here somewhere that explains it all.

BTW, I finally had a chance to audition some domesticated Jubilees (2-way version) at fyrpower (Steve)'s place here in the Chicago area. I honestly didn't find the bass to be any better (although surprisingly good considering the room/conditions - sorry Steve, most of you guys know where I'm coming from) which tells me that the room is still a substantial influence on performance. The 402 on the other hand ~ definitely an improvement, mainly more coherent IMO. I'm looking into integrating the 402 with my Khorns.

Artto,

I agree with you to an extent. People can and will put K-Horns where ever they need too, but if one hasn't ever heard them at least 20 feet apart, in a propper room, they have never really experienced what they are capable. My brother in laws are 24 feet frm corner to corner and the room is over 30 foot long. You get back about 15 feet from the front wall, dead center and it is a whole new ball game from a small room. From your avitar, it is self evident that you know exactly what I mean. Knowing this, it would be uterly stupid to think that any speaker is not going to be greatly affected by such things. I love the crispness of the 402, yet especially like how non fatiquing it is to listen to at high spl over long periods of time. An hour or two at max dB levels with the Corner Horn is alot more fatigueing then the 402, but the Jubilee Bass bin in the propper acoustics has trump all over the Klipsc Horn or the TSCMs, and TSCMs have more Bass then the Corner Horn does.

Roger

[artto]

Roger, what’s
your definition of “more bass”?

When I look at
the one-eight space free field frequency response curves of the Jubilee vs.
Khorn (JAES Oct 2000) I see about 5dB more output from the Khorn at 20Hz. At
30Hz the Khorn is still ahead by 3dB. At 40Hz the Khorn is still +3dB better.
50Hz-120Hz the Jubilee has about 3dB more output. Approaching 200Hz they both
get a little rough. At 250Hz the Jubilee has a huge drop and is down about 10dB
compared to the Khorn. 300Hz they are the same. At 400Hz the Khorn is about 5dB
up on the Jub although a little rough, could be argued the same. And now we’re
at crossover frequency.

What I do see
that I like better is the Jubilee response is smoother, especially at higher frequencies (much of this above
the 450Hz to 500Hz crossover region). At the very lowest frequencies the Jub has
lower second and third harmonic distortion although the Khorn has lower third
harmonic distortion at the higher frequencies (third harmonic distortion more irritable
IMO). How much any of this is audible under realistic, or even ideal listening
conditions is, for me, arguable, because so far, in the one Jubilee system I’ve
heard, I haven’t heard any improvement as to the bass response, not even with
my own recording (which is a known value since I was present at the concert,
recorded and mastered it, and played on my system many times (this particular recording has plenty of low-end which
includes tympani and pipe organ). What I did hear was a more coherent and
seamless sound from the 402’s. Does that mean that what I heard from the
two-way Jubilee sounds better than what I hear from my own system? Absolutely
not! It simply means that, for me, I
think my system, might benefit from
going to the 402’s. After conversations with Roy about this it was clear to me that one of
the main reasons PWK wanted the back to be included in the Jub LF is the same
reason I went thru all the trouble I did for a proper seal and rigidity with
the Khorns. And let’s not forget that in my system the Khorns are also mass
loaded to the earth itself, literally lag bolted to the house foundation. If at
some point I find that the Jubilee bass unit will provide better audible performance,
then by all means, I’ll make the change. For now, first things first, one at a
time, so I know what produced what.

[Coytee]

in my system the Khorns are also mass loaded to the earth itself, literally lag bolted to the house foundation

Now that is delightfully insane!!! I love it

[Y]

[artto]

in my system the Khorns are also mass loaded to the earth itself, literally lag bolted to the house foundation

Now that is delightfully insane!!! I love it

[] I love it too. But my neighbor doesn't. They can't hear it per se'. But they apparently can feel it. Things on the tables and in cabinets vibrate. Needless to say we don't get along all that well. [8o|]