TT

[sputnik]

Amazing. Take a lap around the Isle of Man with Guy Martin. I wish I understood English.

[djk]

Look at the lean angles!

[Islander]

That couldn't have shown all the lap, since it's 37-3/4 miles and it takes closer to 20 minutes. It seems to have been edited to 10 minutes for Youtube limits. Also, he was on a modified 600 street bike, as he mentions a few times. It also seemed odd that he said the fastest part was through that town near the start. I always thought the fastest part (over 200mph on a Superbike) was later, when descending the Mountain.

The main challenge of the TT is remembering all those turns. Most tracks have 8-15 turns, but the Isle of Man TT course has over 200. The lean angles may look extreme, but the riders are not riding at their max, like you'd see on a short track. That's because it's a public road, with variable pavement and painted lines, plus having no run-off area means that a crash results in either a trip to intensive care or a trip to the morgue. There's always a MedEvac helicopter on standby.

Here's the real thing, the immortal Joey Dunlop (RIP) riding a factory Honda V-four Superbike. The bike is so fast that he doesn't have to keep the engine at top revs all the time. He just keeps it in tall gears and maintains momentum wherever possible. In this video, he's also handicapped by having the bulky old video cam strapped to the gas tank.

This is from the '80s, so the lean angles with those old tires aren't like you see today, but Joey is carrying a lot of speed on all the straight sections, including through the towns.

V-Four Victory part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6VAoNY2bjY

V-Four Victory part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zT0xN5Ew5g8&feature=related

The first time I saw this video was on a rear projector display at a bike show and there was a group of race fans standing in front of the display, unconsciously leaning left and right in time with Joey.

Here's Guy Martin on a 1000 Superbike in 2007 on the quickest lap ever recorded, in spite of running into some rain on the Mountain. It's a bit more intense than the 600. I think he mentions hitting 207mph. BTW, when he refers to "flat" turns, he's not talking about the camber of the road. He means the turn is taken flat out, at full throttle. When Steve McQueen was racing, he referred to the fast guys like that as "those guys who carry their balls in bushel baskets".

Guy Martin TT on Honda 1000 2007 - part 1:

Guy Martin TT on Honda 1000 2007 - part 2:

[Groomlakearea51]

Islander: The good ole days!!! back in 81 or 82 (forget now...) I went into the big Honda dealer in Tampa and on the showroom floor was THE V4 VF-1000R, all gear drive, etc. Came with the rear wheel "rocker" stand, etc. They had been trying to sell it (only 1110 made for export to US) for a year but the insurance for anybody under 35 was prohibitive.... Needless to say I went into debt, sold my "Katana" (the original with the orange seats, etc.), etc. and kept that VF for years. Rode it every Sunday morning at sunrise out to Sebring Raceway, ate breakfast with the "cafe" gang, etc. Finally sold it (still in minty condition) to a local M/C rider in 92-93 who promptly crashed it and totalled it....

If only.... coulda', should'a....

[Islander]

Well, Groomie, you treated it right, that's all you could do. My grandfather lived in Ireland and I wish I'd been able to get his Ariel 350 Red Hunter and his Sunbeam S2 after he stopped riding, at age 68, but he gave them to a friend who later threw them into a ditch.

Granda felt terrible when he spotted them there while he was out on a Sunday drive much later. He retrieved the nameplate from one bike. It was all he could do.

[tigerwoodKhorns]

I have been thinking about getting a road bike and found a Honda CBR1000RR for sale for a godo price. never heard of it so I googles it and found this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmVX5eG6N2Y

There are a ton of these on youtube. Exciting to watch but these guys are crazy and endangering everyone around them. If they kill someone besides theirselves I think that "wonton disregard for teh safety of others applies."

I didn't buy the CBR and will avoid anything with CBR on it. Too much for me. I'm thinking about a Suzuki SV650 or SV1000.

[BusaDude]

Here's the actual Isle of Man TT website... and links to the current lap and race records. The 2010 TT races have been showing on HD Theater with multiple replays during the week.

[Islander]

Thanks for the links, gpbusa! I did think it a bit odd that the overall record was still standing after three years, so I'm glad to stand corrected. That's old Youtube clips for you.

I was also surprised to see the Honda domination. No Yamahas, Kawasakis or big Suzukis? What's up with that?

[Islander]

There are a ton of these on youtube. Exciting to watch but these guys are crazy and endangering everyone around them.

You're right about that. Top speed run on the freeway at night? Not a great idea. I think that posting clips like that just encourages others to try to top them. Check out some of the "Ghost Rider" clips from Europe to see more craziness.

At the risk of sounding like an old fogey, I think the whole "car surfing" craze (riding on the top of a moving car or truck, with or without a driver) only got so big because of Youtube. On the other hand, maybe if enough clips of pilotless trucks hitting lampposts causing the guy on the roof to fly off and get seriously injured will cause some teens to think twice before trying to be the next Johnny Knoxville.

[BusaDude]

Yeah, Ian Hutchinson won everything this year on a Honda... The other brands are represented in the overall standings, but I think it runs in cycles every few years depending on the team. Relentless Suzuki has done well in the past and so has Kawasaki, but the Honda teams (Padgetts and HM Plant) seem to have the best rider / bike combinations right now. It may be something as simple as Honda offering more support in the UK versus Suzuki, Kawasaki, etc.

I just pointed out the records because they seem to change on an almost daily basis the past two years and are hard to track... and I knew the IOMTT site would have all the current stats.

[jacksonbart]

How far is the Isle of Women from there?

[BusaDude]

I have been thinking about getting a road bike and found a Honda CBR1000RR for sale for a godo price... I didn't buy the CBR and will avoid anything with CBR on it. Too much for me. I'm thinking about a Suzuki SV650 or SV1000.

The literbikes are not something you start out on (150 rear wheel horsepower), particularly if you've had little to no experience riding. The 600's these days can even be a handful if you don't pay attention. Like most things though, you can work your way up to and really enjoy them, once you have some experience.

[CECAA850]

How far is the Isle of Women from there?

It's right HERE.

[Tom Adams]

At the risk of this conversation de-evolving.........

There's no factual evidence that a liter bike will hurt you any greater or quicker than will a 600 or 350 or whatever. The insurance companies tried to prove it in order to justify crazy rates back in the 90's and couldn't. I've seen folks grab a load of throttle on a 70cc bike and promptly crash and break an arm. Like anything else, if one approaches said mo'sickle with caution and respect and get the right training, I see no reason one shouldn't be able to buy a FJR1300 or K1300GT or Concours 1300 and ride happily ever after. Do I think starting off on a smaller bike to learn things like sliding and throttle control is a good thing? Absolutely! One can never learn enough skills. But it ain't a requirement and I can point to a whole bunch of high mileage guys who never started on a small bike.

Tom

[Islander]

In the case of mature riders who'll observe the speed limits, you may be right, but that's a very small minority of beginner riders. How many beginners under thirty years of age buy big sport tourers? Most beginners are young, and riding (or drinking or dating or you name it) with caution and respect does not describe a typical teenager or young adult. Those same ones mostly want sport bikes and want to ride them the way they were made to be ridden. The problem is that those bikes are made for experts, not beginners.

Modern big bikes have a higher power-to-weight ratio than a Dodge Viper or a V-12 Ferrari, and we've all seen Youtube videos of inexperienced drivers putting those kind of cars into ditches and solid objects. It takes time to learn to control powerful vehicles. There's no way around that.

Here are a few examples of what can happen at walking speed with a clumsy throttle hand:

accident near dealer:

Brand new Gixxer crashed:

Maybe a 100cc bike would have been better for this guy to start on:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HbFEChsrsQ&feature=related

Sure, it's easy to fall off any kind of motorcycle, or even bicycle for that matter, but the injuries tend to be far worse if you're travelling at 130mph when you crash than if you're travelling at 60mph. There's plenty of factual evidence of that.

I'm not down on motorcycles. I rode a number of them for nearly thirty years and had lots of really good experiences, from daily commuting to touring to racing. During that time, I saw lots of people, including myself, hit the ground, on the street, the track and on the dirt. In nearly every case, the faster and heavier the bike, the more serious the injuries were.

Back in the Sixties, "doing the ton" (hitting 100mph) was a big deal, but modern big sport bikes can do 100mph in second gear, and do it casually. They should not be anyone's first bike. For the majority of riders, riding a 400 or 500cc machine at first will let them learn to control the bike safely, even if they outgrow it within a year.

The cultural problem is that everyone wants to be instantly cool, with pre-faded jeans and distressed leather jackets, as if you've already passed your nooby stage while no-one noticed. Who wants to be seen as a wuss on a 400 or even a 600? I could go on, but I'll just say that graduated licences limiting new riders to smaller bikes can save lives.

[tigerwoodKhorns]

Islander,

I agree with your post. My "beginner bike" which I still have is a Yamaha YZ450F dirt bike. I bought it when I was 38 and have a ton of RESPECT for the throttle (45 HP and 220 lbs). On this bike, the power has actually helped me in tough hill climbs to get out of trouble, but then again, it is a light bike and does nto blow out the rear tiel that easily.

My earlier post was about getting a Suzuki SV650 or SV1000, both V twins and more torque motors, not superbikes (70 and 100 hp respectively). Each can get you in plenty of trouble, but I am in my 40's and know my limits. I would never get a crazy fast bike that can spin the rear tire that easily. I am actually leaning toward an enduro because the drivers around here are crazy. I feel safer on the trails.

[Gilbert]

How far is the Isle of Women from there?

Amazonia, land of the 6ft red head.

[Islander]

My earlier post was about getting a Suzuki SV650 or SV1000, both V twins and more torque motors, not superbikes (70 and 100 hp respectively).

Both of those bikes are pretty popular, although the early SV1000s had some handling issues, which may well be totally sorted by now. The SV650 had a single-model racing series in Canada that attracted a good number of competitors.

One of my friends who used to ride a GSX-R1100 very quickly in the Nineties bought a KTM 990 "adventure tourer" a few years ago and is having a lot of fun with it, even doing some long distance touring with some buddies with similar bikes.

Another friend has a Yamaha FZ1 and rides it more often than his R1, because you can actually feel when you're travelling quickly, unlike on the R1. The R1 and the other big sport bikes are so effective that they make very high speeds a casual experience, which is where the trouble starts for many riders.

[sputnik]

My earlier post was about getting a Suzuki SV650 or SV1000, both V twins and more torque motors, not superbikes (70 and 100 hp respectively). Each can get you in plenty of trouble, but I am in my 40's and know my limits. I would never get a crazy fast bike that can spin the rear tire that easily. I am actually leaning toward an enduro because the drivers around here are crazy. I feel safer on the trails.

You should consider the Suzuki 650 V-Strom - I think it's the same motor plant as the SV but set up for more torque. It's not really a trail bike but it's just fine on rough dirt roads and still very nice on pavement. From FHE, it can comfortably cruise at 90 mph which is way faster than you'll ever need but it's nice to know.

I'm back on two wheels again. Just picked up a '79 CBX. 1047 cc, six cylinder goodness, six carbs, and 24 valves. An FJR would out perform it now but, in 1979, it was the coolest production superbike and I always wanted one. 103 hp, 0-60 in about 4 sec and 1/4 mile in about 11 sec at 117 mph topping out around 140 mph - not that I'll be testing those numbers.

Hey Pat, thanks for posting those other TT vids.

[tigerwoodKhorns]

Funny you mentioned KTM. I have been looking at their 690 enduro and 690 scm. The SCM has road tires and may be too geared toward pavement. Each is around 305 to 320 lbs which will make trails easier to handle. Just need to decide if they are worth the extra cash over a honda or yamaha. Soem 2008's have had stalling issues with their fuel injection too.