Fascinating: No synonym for "Music"

[Mallette]

Whilst thinking on the recent "CD vs Record" thread, I got to thinking about the difference between equipment freaks and music lovers. Before going on, I want to make it clear I see no value judgment between either affliction nor of those stuck in between. As I made clear in that thread, and the many others on the same theme we've cussed and discussed over the years, I've no interest in any media but only in that which it preserves.

So, after all these years I found myself looking for something to coin a word for a lover of recorded music. "Audiophile" simply means a lover of sound. It's quite general and could be equally applied to one who relishes the sound of water flowing and birds singing in the sunrise as actually experienced in the wild. I'd fit that definition as well. However, the public usually visualizes one who has a stack of bizarre and expensive equipment with a sign on it saying somthing like "Achtung! Das audioequipmentung is nich for gerfingerpoken und mittengrabben. Ist poppen der springwerk mit spitzensparken un smokenfahre. Das rubbernecken dumbkophen keepen der hands in das pockets, relaxen und watching das blinkenlights!" or something like that.

But what of the lover of music who cares not about anything but the MUSIC? Those of us who will listen to a performance of "Rhapsody in Blue" with Gershwin at the piano and the Whiteman band being played from an 80 year old disc that looks like someone took rough sandpaper to it and do so in complete rapture? When I do this, I do not hear anything except MUSIC, even though the noise may be almost as apparent and the signal at times.

In my musing, I ran music for synonyms. There are none. Related words, yes. Synonyms, none. We're left with things that do not fall trippingly off the tongue like "transcriptophile" or "phonophile," neither of which are even close.

Closest I could come, though still a near miss, might be "euphonophile." At least euphony implies pleasing sounds and harmony.

OK, it's Saturday and I've time for such mental masturbation. Anyone else find this in anyway interesting?

Dave

[billybob]

Yes, it is interesting. It also calls for some reflection on my part.

Thanks

[sputnik]

Words like melody, tune, air, song, and harmony are close but "music" is an interesting word in all that means. Never thought of that before. Lots of antonyms.

[LarryC]

I know it's two words, but "music aficionado"? Or music lover? Except for a new word like "Musicophile," I'm not sure you can do it in one word. I can't think of another word for music that can be compounded into a "-phile." The m-word encompasses too many different ideas, aspects, qualities, etc.

[Mallette]

Crikey...what a weird brick wall! Very counter-intuitive. The Wikipedia entry for music is mind blowing. Here we have the most common expression of art between human beings for God knows how much of our existence, and there is only one word for it.

Yes, there are words in other languages, but it's amazing how no more "direct" they are than ours, which simply comes to latin from the greek for "of the muses"...which also describes almost any art.

Here's the idea:

The languages of many cultures do not include a word for or that would be translated as music. Inuit and most North American Indian languages do not have a general term for music. Among the Aztecs, the ancient Mexican theory of rhetorics, poetry, dance, and instrumental music, used the Nahuatl term In xochitl-in kwikatl to refer a complex mix of music and other poetic verbal and non-verbal elements, and reserve the word Kwikakayotl (or cuicacayotl) only for the sung expressions (Leon-Portilla 2007, 11). In Africa there is no term for music in Tiv, Yoruba, Igbo, Efik, Birom, Hausa, Idoma, Eggon or Jarawa. Many other languages have terms which only partly cover what Europeans mean by the term music (Schafer). The Mapuche of Argentina do not have a word for music, but they do have words for instrumental versus improvised forms (kantun), European and non-Mapuche music (kantun winka), ceremonial songs (öl), and tayil (Robertson 1976, 39).

Some languages in West Africa have no term for music but the speakers do have the concept (Nettl 1989,^{[page needed]}). Musiqi is the Persian word for the science and art of music, muzik being the sound and performance of music (Sakata 1983,^{[page needed]}), though some things European influenced listeners would include, such as Quran chanting, are excluded.

I've disable the links to avoid moderation. Look up "music" in Wiki if you are interested.

Dave

[Islander]

Languages can have puzzling gaps. For example, the French invented photography in 1830, but French has no word for camera. The term used is "appareil photographique", or "photographic apparatus/device". A colloquial expression for camera is "Kodak", as in "As-tu pris ton Kodak?", meaning "Did you take your Kodak?" I've often heard the term, but never seen it written, so I don't know whether "Kodak" is normally capitalized in French or not.

The Irish language, believe it or not, has no words for "yes" or "no". To agree or disagree with a question, it's necessary to repeat the question in the suitable form: "Will you buy these La Scalas?" The appropriate answer is either "I will buy them.", or "I will not buy them."

Irish also has no swear words, so most angry Irish speakers switch to English when some proper foul language is called for.

On the other hand, Irish has "crack", usually spelled "craic", a word that has no English equivalent, but "fun" gives a very rough idea of its meaning. A person arriving at a party or pub might ask "How's the crack?" and hear the reply "It's great! You'll be glad you made it tonight."

[oldtimer]

Craic head!

[garyrc]

I wonder if the word "music" is related to the word "muse."

Beethoven: "Music is a higher revelation than all wisdom and philosophy."

[Boxx]

Languages can have puzzling gaps. For example, the French invented photography in 1830, but French has no word for camera. The term used is "appareil photographique", or "photographic apparatus/device". A colloquial expression for camera is "Kodak", as in "As-tu pris ton Kodak?", meaning "Did you take your Kodak?" I've often heard the term, but never seen it written, so I don't know whether "Kodak" is normally capitalized in French or not.

Also French has no suitable translation for the English word "cookie." Biscuit is as close as it gets....

[Mallette]

I wonder if the word "music" is related to the word "muse."

See my original post below (or above, depending on how you sort). That's the whole point of my fascination. "Music" comes from the greek via latin and simply means "of the muses." The muses were virtually anything not strictly required to live, such as sculpture, painting, playing instruments, poetry, stage, etc.

There appears to be no root word having anything to do SPECIFICALLY with what we regard music. Wish I knew someone with real academic knowledge of ancient languages. I'd like to know the word for "music," assuming there is one, in chaldean, sumerian, egyptian, etc to see if there are any that didn't come from something else like ours.

I am not an expert in such matters even in the slightest, but I have a gut feeling prototype humans were beating on drums or making "music" somehow even before we developed language. You'd think there'd be a word for it specifically so ancient as to be untraceable.

This all started when I searched for, then decided, since I couldn't find one, to attempt to coin a word for someone specifically interested in music, not mediums, hi fidelity, equipment, or such (accept as required to get to the music).

Best I've been able to come up with is "euphonophile," Close, but no cigar. Problem is, like winning the cigar at the sideshow, I think the game is rigged.

Dave

[Islander]

I am not an expert in such matters even in the slightest, but I have a gut feeling prototype humans were beating on drums or making "music" somehow even before we developed language. You'd think there'd be a word for it specifically so ancient as to be untraceable.

Being able to match rhythms is one thing that separates us from the apes. Chimps can learn to beat on drums, but can't keep to a rhythm or match someone else's rhythm, at least so I'd always heard. I was looking for a cite for that statement, and learned something new.

If you Google for this: Spontaneous synchronized tapping to an auditory rhythm observed ... and go to the phys.org page, you can read about the chimp who does have some sense of rhythm.

BTW, is there now a restriction on posting links? In the past, a post would be moderated if it had more than three or four links, but I have the impression now that any links will hold up a posting. What's the current rule?

EDIT: okay, that link works. It will take you directly to the page I referred to.

[Mallette]

That quote had 10 or more links, largely irrelevant, and I don't really know if anything has changed. Just being prudent...

Dave

[Islander]

Craic head!

On occasion, that's true. The craic is especially good when listening to good music with good friends. [][Y][]

[Mallette]

I was looking for a cite for that statement, and learned something new.

Fascinating, indeed, and also underscores just how ancient "music" is in humanity. Makes it even more strange that our word for it is an approximation and that so many languages don't even have that.

Dave

[garyrc]

I am not an expert in such matters even in the slightest, but I have a gut feeling prototype humans were beating on drums or making "music" somehow even before we developed language. You'd think there'd be a word for it specifically so ancient as to be untraceable.

I'll bet that some kind of organized vocalization came first, with people utilizing ("composing") the sounds of joy, fear, passion, etc., as well as imitating the sounds of animals. Percussion using leg and chest slapping, logs, etc. was probably very early. Some of the oldest stories in several cultures involved a character called "flute player," or something equivalent.

[Mallette]

Percussion using leg and chest slapping, logs, etc. was probably very early.

To an extent worth considering, Islanders link suggests we might have passed time individually beating out rythms or creating sound patterns some other way and then communicated with others by their either joining us or our joining their "music."

Dave

[Islander]

Way back in the beginning, I wonder if dancing inspired music, or music inspired dancing.

[Boxx]

IN THE BEGINNING GOD created man and then man created music...

[Mallette]

Way back in the beginning, I wonder if dancing inspired music, or music inspired dancing.

I'd be willing to hazard a guess: Yes[]

Dave

[Mallette]

IN THE BEGINNING GOD created man and then man created music...

I can say this: For decades "Jesu, Joy of Man's Desiring" has been my hands down pick for the most sublime piece of music ever composed. To me, it sounds like infinity itself, always playing. If I look up at the stars, I hear a bit of it and all time and space is moving along with it.

When I "start" a copy, it isn't really starting anything but simply allowing this poor temporally-bound human to join the symphony of the Cosmos for a few minutes. It doesn't end, I am just forced to leave it and it plays on and my illusions of reality return. Yep, trash is overflowing and the dog needs a bath.

Dave