Ceptorman Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Aaron, first off I must say those speakers are stunning, nice room. Secondly, they sound great on my $1.29 speakers on my Apple laptop Sorry, I'm no help here, just wanted to start the day off with a smile! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricktate Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Aarron.....Don't the new K-horns have movable top hats as in they just sit on top of the bass bin? Instead of moving the whole speaker and loosing the wall extension of the bass bin. I don't think tubes will fix your problem although I'm sure they would help the basic sound. I'm trying to sell an amp so I can try out a tube amp. I think you need to play your Ks awhile longer to make sure everything is broke in....even though most don't believe in it. Some of the problem could be the room also as some have said you could try a few things and see if it helps. That's a lot cheaper than new amps. But it does not look like your afraid to spend the cash,,,,lol. I would like to try that Dennis Had tube amp out but out of my budget with out letting something else go. I guess I could sell and organ but the docs just put a used one in me...lol I could not get your video to work....dang it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derrickdj1 Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 39 minutes ago, wdecho said: I have found the exact same thing myself. When I first tried my new FW F6 amplifier in my setup it was much too bright for my taste. Knowing that the F6 is an outstanding revealing amplifier I knew I had problems with my setup. After making changes over a period of weeks to my setup the F6 became one of my favorites with the added bonus of all my other amps sounding better as well. My opinion is that your new K-horns are revealing shortcomings in the setup you have. The reason studios once favored horn systems is they immediately made anyone that was off key apparent. My understanding is now they favor studio monitors in near field listening setups probably more because of size restraints than being better than good horns. All things being equal Class A is still superior not that other classes can be made to sound very good as well. The appeal of SET tube amps is all SET's are Class A. The reason you do not see mainstream manufacturers selling class A SS amps is it takes time to bias and set up a Class A amplifier and it is a small heater as well with expensive hardware. I have one Class A push pull tube amplifier that sounds fantastic with my horns. Most push pull tube amplifiers are run in class A/B for higher watts. Numbers sell. I have one B & O Icepower board which is Class D that has a very tube like sound. I could live with it. I also have a few A/B amps I could live with as well. A lot of the new designed push-pull amp will run Class A for low wattage and AB for higher watt needs. Some of these are as close to the best of both worlds and will match up to a larger variety speaker sensitivity well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronB123 Posted January 4, 2017 Author Share Posted January 4, 2017 8 hours ago, JMON said: I think there is some truth to this comment. I have experienced a very wide-range of performance with Kiipschorns just by using different upstream components. I've also experienced different levels of performance with the same equipment being in different rooms (but I have to admit that is based on memory over longer periods of time as different rooms meant different houses). I think you are getting good advice here. If the La Scalas are sounding better than the Klipschorns, then there is something wrong somewhere else. Your Klipschorns look like they might be relatively new -- if so, then it probably isn't them. Your electronics are they same, so that shouldn't be the issue either (not to say you can't get improvements with better matched electronics). Chris seems to be offering some good ideas regarding your room. Based on your video, the ceiling appears to be very low (less than 8 feet?). Ya I'd say roughly without measuring it's 7-7 and a half at most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronB123 Posted January 4, 2017 Author Share Posted January 4, 2017 9 hours ago, JMON said: I prefer tube amplification but there are some very good solid state amps that can get you close. Classé Audio is one of my favorite solid state brands and are very smooth. The great thing about Classé is that they are relatively inexpensive for being high-end stereo equipment (think Mark Levinson, Threshold, Krell, etc.) and their lower-powered amps are very affordable on the used market. With Klipsch heritage, you don't need the high power amps. 70 Watts or so will be plenty. I have in my possession a Classé amp and was listening to it with a tube preamp recently and the sound was wonderful. Jeff Rowland is another great solid state amp that rivals tube amps in smoothness, but they tend to be on the more expensive side, even used. For value, it is tough to beat Classé in my experience. If you need multi-channel for HT, here is a great option: https://www.audiogon.com/listings/multi-ch-classe-cav-75-multichannel-amp-6x75w-channels-bridgeable-to-3x150w-2017-01-02-amplifiers-94110-san-francisco-ca Here is a very nice stereo amp that I have owned in the past. This one is scratched up so you might be able to get it for $350 or so. http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649300514-classe-70-amplifier/images/1327603/ You think that multi channel would be better than the Emotiva I already have? That's one thing that's got me confused here though. When I made a thread about wanting a seperate amp the majority of people here recommended the Emotiva now it seems like they don't really think Emotiva is that good. Also since someone mentioned it Mark Levinson, I didn't even realize they made home audio. Before seeing them in my brother's car I had never even heard of them. My brother just recently bought a Lexus with Mark Levinson audio and it is hands down the best I have ever heard in a car. Better than the 3000 dollar custom system I had in my old car (which was a hyundai sonata) so car acoustics could have played a huge roll which I am sure was the case. Is Mark Levinson known to play well with heritage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 For home theater, I'd say you probably would want a bit more than 5W/channel if mono-amping Khorns in order to have some reserve margin for reproducing "reference level transients". PWK didn't own a 5.1 home theater, so the kind of transients that are typical for movies were basically never required for two-channel reproduction (unless he was playing personally recorded Stan Kenton tapes, which would be on par with HT reference level). 9 minutes ago, AaronB123 said: You think that multi channel would be better than the Emotiva I already have? That's one thing that's got me confused here though. When I made a thread about wanting a separate amp the majority of people here recommended the Emotiva now it seems like they don't really think Emotiva is that good. No - in fact, something like separate rack-mount Crown D-75As or Emotiva are a lot less likely to have EMI issues. An AVP is your friend in this case. Multi-channel amplifiers are simply more compact--putting all the amplifier modules into one box. The reason why I mentioned the ICEpower modules is because you build up your own multichannel amplifier really easily if you can drill holes in aluminum or steel amplifier cases. For a LOT less money. New. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronB123 Posted January 4, 2017 Author Share Posted January 4, 2017 Just now, wdecho said: Mark Levinson is a legend in sound reproduction. High end very pricey. Ya, the only problem that I can see though is they don't make anything but 2 channel processors. That's all I can find on their website anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronB123 Posted January 4, 2017 Author Share Posted January 4, 2017 If you guys could choose any preamp/processor and amp to run my system with money not being an issue what would you guys choose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricktate Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 OK got video to work... sounds good.....looks like that dresser on the right side would cause some trouble....could not see left side. Whats on floor? I say let them sing for a few months before doing anything. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 26 minutes ago, AaronB123 said: If you guys could choose any preamp/processor and amp to run my system with money not being an issue what would you guys choose? I'd choose any of the top-of-the-line AVPs--pick your brand--and choose amplifiers that seem to sound "life-like" and "crisp" to go with the AVP. I'd use XLR balanced connections to an active digital crossover and amplifiers to reduce line noise. I wouldn't use Audyssey, YPAO, ARC, MCACC, or any other canned room correction software. I'd instead use REW and a calibration microphone to EQ everything flat using a high quality digital crossover (24/96). Really. Chris 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 For active digital crossover for home theater, I'd personally recommend a Xilica XP-8080 based on sound quality/transparency, ease of programming using USB control, the large number of I/O ports available, and the large number of EQ filters available per channel (8 input, 8 output filters per channel). The more I/O ports and EQ filters per channel, the more flexibility you have. The relative costs per loudspeaker decrease dramatically if using one crossover unit with a lot of ports, and it saves a bunch on rack space. If using 2-way loudspeakers, you can bi-amp your front three and still have two surround channels available (as my setup is configured). If using three-way fronts, you can tri-amp the left and right channels, and bi-amp a center, etc. using one 8x8 crossover, like the XP-8080. If you wanted to tri-amp all five surrounding channels and do subwoofer EQ management, two crossover units would do it for you. You can mix and match amplifiers of any brand/model using the above, especially using horizontal bi-amping or tri-amping, such as tubes on the top end and SS on the bottom end. You can also change your mind and do something else later (like new amplifiers, drivers/horns, or complete loudspeakers) without having to buy any new crossovers, etc. Just recalibrate and go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceptorman Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 hour ago, AaronB123 said: You think that multi channel would be better than the Emotiva I already have? That's one thing that's got me confused here though. When I made a thread about wanting a seperate amp the majority of people here recommended the Emotiva now it seems like they don't really think Emotiva is that good. Also since someone mentioned it Mark Levinson, I didn't even realize they made home audio. Before seeing them in my brother's car I had never even heard of them. My brother just recently bought a Lexus with Mark Levinson audio and it is hands down the best I have ever heard in a car. Better than the 3000 dollar custom system I had in my old car (which was a hyundai sonata) so car acoustics could have played a huge roll which I am sure was the case. Is Mark Levinson known to play well with heritage? Asking for opinions on amps is like asking which motor oil is the best, you'll get numerous opinions. You're chasing something that only your ears can be the judge of. I doubt anyone that recommended Emotiva is backing off that recommendation. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawson's Ridge Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 hour ago, AaronB123 said: If you guys could choose any preamp/processor and amp to run my system with money not being an issue what would you guys choose? McIntosh and start enjoying the music. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimjimbo Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 11 minutes ago, Dawson's Ridge said: McIntosh and start enjoying the music. Couldn't have said it better myself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronB123 Posted January 4, 2017 Author Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 hour ago, Dawson's Ridge said: McIntosh and start enjoying the music. Ya, I've thought of McIntosh myself but again they don't make any multi channel stuff, it's all 2 channel from what I can see. If they made a 5-7.1 AVR I'd buy it in a second! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronB123 Posted January 4, 2017 Author Share Posted January 4, 2017 2 hours ago, ricktate said: OK got video to work... sounds good.....looks like that dresser on the right side would cause some trouble....could not see left side. Whats on floor? I say let them sing for a few months before doing anything. It's a tile floor with a are arug in the center but the speakers themselves are just on the tile. I have to say though it does sound much better in real life over the video. Even when I play the video back on the speaker's I see a huge difference. Soundstage is much deeper and theres much more detail when listening in real life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawson's Ridge Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 hour ago, AaronB123 said: Ya, I've thought of McIntosh myself but again they don't make any multi channel stuff, it's all 2 channel from what I can see. If they made a 5-7.1 AVR I'd buy it in a second! The seconds are ticking away. However, only serious money apply. http://www.mcintoshlabs.com/us/Products/pages/ProductListingHorizontal.aspx?CatId=amplifiers http://www.mcintoshlabs.com/us/Products/pages/ProductListingHorizontal.aspx?CatId=hometheaterprocessors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris A Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 18 minutes ago, AaronB123 said: It's a tile floor with an area rug in the center but the speakers themselves are just on the tile. I have to say though it does sound much better in real life over the video. Even when I play the video back on the speaker's I see a huge difference. Soundstage is much deeper and there's much more detail when listening in real life. When you upload to YouTube, it converts the audio to stereo AAC (on even multichannel audio), which is a lossy format, i.e., it doesn't retain the original lossless format. That's what you're hearing in terms of the loss of depth of soundstage, detail, etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornukopia Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 19 minutes ago, AaronB123 said: Ya, I've thought of McIntosh myself but again they don't make any multi channel stuff, it's all 2 channel from what I can see. If they made a 5-7.1 AVR I'd buy it in a second! How about these McIntosh home theater processors? http://www.mcintoshlabs.com/us/Products/pages/ProductListingVertical.aspx?CatId=hometheaterprocessors 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybob Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Thought MacIntosh made a processor and a 5 channel amp. No doubt I am wrong... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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