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Waters vs Gilmour


Heritage_Head
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For me its Waters.... But as large as Waters was in the success of Pink Floyd. I don't think he becomes an all time great without David.

 

Also as great as David became I wonder if anyone would even know who he was today without his time with Waters. And I know its hard to imagine any world where David isn't a famous guitar player, with what we know of him (it cant be unheard). But being good/great/best player isn't always enough. Waters was the writer, and composer of the bulk of what made Pink Floyd Pink Floyd. 

 

As a amateur guitar player for 30 years. The guitar is my favorite part of the majority of music I listen to (its what I hear most. Cant avoid it as someone who's played so long). And talking with others on this topic Ive noticed that the guitar players tend to be bigger fans of David (for obvious reasons).

 

But for me knowing the true total bulk of what Waters is in that music is impossible to ignore. Ive said before imo Pink Floyd transcended music. But imo Waters absolutely is why they did. 

 

Im curious what others on this forum think of this debate........

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It's Gilmore for me...hands down. Look at how David changed that band after Sid left. If you look at the credits, Gilmore wrote a lot of their music. Gilmore has a lot of great solo stuff also.  To me, he just seems like a nicer guy than Roger. Some of the stories surrounding Roger almost sound like he was a very unkind man, pushing Wright out of the band, then paying him a session musician's wage when he brought him back. There's a reason David, Richard, and Nick left Roger to start their own version of PF. I do like Roger's overall vision for most of their albums....I think The Wall is the best album ever made. 

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23 minutes ago, Ceptorman said:

It's Gilmore for me...hands down. Look at how David changed that band after Sid left. If you look at the credits, Gilmore wrote a lot of their music. Gilmore has a lot of great solo stuff also.  To me, he just seems like a nicer guy than Roger. Some of the stories surrounding Roger almost sound like he was a very unkind man, pushing Wright out of the band, then paying him a session musician's wage when he brought him back. There's a reason David, Richard, and Nick left Roger to start their own version of PF. I do like Roger's overall vision for most of their albums....I think The Wall is the best album ever made. 

I agree Waters was a total a hole and ive never even met him. David wrote solos but not very many riffs/songs of the bulk of the bands great music. And he didn't imo do that much after sid left (as far as good song writing). They didn't become great tell dsotm and thats the album that Waters took over most of the bands direction/music/concepts/lyrics. I have 19 PF albums. The stuff David wrote after sid imo is amateur at best (pre dsotm). Most of it I played/listen one time and wouldn't put myself though it again.

 

The thing with Richard was horrible! But they didn't leave Waters. Waters left them. 

 

I also agree The Wall is the best album ever made.   

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Waters was done fighting with David on changes to songs that he wrote. Waters has said that "Im the only one writing anything (David and the others have confirmed what he said was true in interviews. That he said it and it was true) If you guys/David aren't going to help write any music then stay out of my way".

 

David would change or ad a small riff/tweek and boom he gets part credit in the song. Waters even hints at this on the dvd The wall in the commentary during the movie. He says during run like hell "Hold on.... heres Davids riff". Saying it like heres his one riff don't miss it!

 

Im not backing up his behavior (pfff no way). Just pointing out how dominant Waters really was in everything your hearing on dsotm- final cut.  

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3 minutes ago, seti said:

I'm more of a Syd Barrett fan. Short trip buit ahhhhhhh what a trip.

 

 

Your not alone. Ive read pages of forum posts that support the sid era.

 

I personally think the guy was impossible to take serious. And pretty much hate every song they ever did with him.  But I also hate sushi so..........

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Just now, Heritage_Head said:

Your not alone. Ive read pages of forum posts that support the sid era.

 

I personally think the guy was impossible to take serious. And pretty much hate every song they ever did with him.  But I also hate sushi so..........

 

We should split pink floyd records 8-) I can't listen to them without him.... I sometimes feel they should have changed their names a few times.

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6 minutes ago, BigStewMan said:

up until the past several years, i was 100% in Rogers camp; but, not anymore. 

Roger is a talented writer, particularly lyricist; but, David did play a huge role on the music to many of those Pink Floyd songs. I accept the fact that some are more drawn to lyrics; but, David does have a way of drawing emotion from that guitar.  Listening to the opening riff from Coming Back to Life and you’ll feel it. After hearing stuff like The Division Bell and David’s solo stuff -- that changed my mind. Plus, David’s wife Polly writes his lyrics and she’s proven herself to be quite good at it (she was already a novelist). 

David has his views of course; but, with him you don’t have that A-hole in your face stuff that Roger still does. 

So, now I’m fully in the Gilmour camp -- although i have seen Roger solo twice. 

I some how agree with all of that... but still completely disagree with your answer.....Ha!  👍

 

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4 minutes ago, BigStewMan said:

well, i certainly don’t speak for either Roger or David; but, i have heard David say that he contributed a lot of music. Not sure how the Floyd did it; but, in other bands, as Freddie Mercury said, the writer is the boss -- the song is going to be the way he wants it. With Queen, it was the person that brought the skeleton of the song and the lyrics that got the writing credit. Sure, someone can contribute; but, if the writer doesn’t like it, it isn’t included. 

Martin Barre from Jethro Tull said that he didn’t have long for a guitar solo or it would become a flute solo. 

concept albums are more challenging i believe ... it’s rare that completely different people have the same vision.  Take Queen II ... there was a White Side and Black Side. I believe Freddie wrote most, if not all of the black side, and Brian most of the White side. They’re totally different writers with totally different styles (as are John Deacon and Roger Taylor), so different it’s rare for a song where the band gets the writing credit.  If you’re not going to break the album in halves, like Queen II, i think a concept album should be predominantly one writer ... for consistency ... it will flow better. 

 

They fought all the time. They got into a fist fight (pulled off each other) over who would sing two words in comfortably numb. And I have become "comfortably numb".

 

Song writing depends on the band. Some bands stand around together and jam and find something they like and build on it (these bands normally don't have many riffs in a song). Some bands everyone writes songs. And some bands one or two people do and some its one guy. and so on. 

 

The newest The wall cd has a 3rd disc and its the recordings of loads of different versions of whats on the album. Waters writes the music and composes all the music. He brings the music to the band (what he brings to them is the songs played as a full band, and he himself is playing all of it. keys, guitar, bass, vocals, drums, effects, all of it). And then the rest of the band starts learning there parts. 

 

He doesn't just bring them a basic riff idea and lyrics. He comes with everything......

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5 minutes ago, BigStewMan said:

but you still owe me a beer for writing it.  

as a musician, i have this argument with a  friend. is the greater talent writing music or performing?  he’s 100% that it is performing (because he is a performer), he says things go wrong in gigs and he must be able to improvise on the spot to save the show. Performing is rock bottom on my list of things that i want to do. Seriously.  I’m 100% that writing is the greater skill.  A lot of playing is muscle memory -- not a huge skill there. 

I’ll use Bohemian Rhapsody as an example:  that solo was written by Brian May. I can play it and there is probably a million teenagers that can play it. No way i’m willing to put all of us on equal levels. He created it -- that’s a different plane than learning to play it. 

Like you said of my answer above ... my buddy (bass player) will agree with me all the up to the conclusion, then he takes the opposite side.

I’ve played over 100 small shows (the don’t get paid kind).

writing is way harder than performing. I can play songs I write in my sleep from all the time it takes playing stuff over and over during the writing process, and all the practicing of the songs with everyone learning them. 

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