Advice on adding a 510 horn to my La scala

[Heritage_Head]

*** please no mention of any unaffiliated Klipsch companies in this thread***

So I have a line on a pair of 510s with DE75 drivers, and I would need crossovers to make it all work….suggestions please (passive only)

 

Note: please pm me info if your not sure if it should be posted here (or text/email me 651-470-4284  greenbayes@hotmail.com)

 

Thanks

Ryan.

[Coytee]

How much is it worth to you for me not to mention...... (               )  

 

 

[Heritage_Head]

5 minutes ago, Coytee said:

How much is it worth to you for me not to mention...... (               )  

 

 

😏

[Coytee]

Here's another one that I found.

 

The thing is....  only a handful of drivers have actually been voiced to the 510, especially on top of a LaScala or other bass bin.  There are a hundred 2" drivers I suppose but in the realm of actually tried, tested, I'd venture to guess less than 4-6 (but I honestly have no clue)

 

This is where an active will help you as you can adjust things more on the fly, in your room to taylor the sound without having to take the passive apart, buy different parts....try it....  take it apart, try different parts....try it....take it apart....

 

With an active, you just keep dialing things in.

 

Just for kicks, if I were you, I'd look on Ebay for used EV DX-38's if you don't intend on every adding a sub to the system.  The EV will do 2-in and 4 out or a pair of stereo speakers and no other.  More precisely, it will do two 2-way speakers.  If you would want to add a sub later on, then getting a 4-in 8 out would give you better options.  This is why I pulled the EV out of my system and replaced it with a Xilica.

 

Let me rephrase that....this is why I pulled BOTH Ev's out of the system,. so I could replace them BOTH with a single unit that covered everything.

 

 

JUB 510 69.pdf

[Coytee]

I thought I had some "other" designs for a passive.... can't find yet.  Then again, they might kill the thread.  If I DO find them, I'll PM you but, don't get hopes up.  I have a folder I keep things like that and nothing is in there.  I'll keep looking.

[Heritage_Head]

21 minutes ago, Coytee said:

Here's another one that I found.

 

The thing is....  only a handful of drivers have actually been voiced to the 510, especially on top of a LaScala or other bass bin.  There are a hundred 2" drivers I suppose but in the realm of actually tried, tested, I'd venture to guess less than 4-6 (but I honestly have no clue)

 

This is where an active will help you as you can adjust things more on the fly, in your room to taylor the sound without having to take the passive apart, buy different parts....try it....  take it apart, try different parts....try it....take it apart....

 

With an active, you just keep dialing things in.

 

Just for kicks, if I were you, I'd look on Ebay for used EV DX-38's if you don't intend on every adding a sub to the system.  The EV will do 2-in and 4 out or a pair of stereo speakers and no other.  More precisely, it will do two 2-way speakers.  If you would want to add a sub later on, then getting a 4-in 8 out would give you better options.  This is why I pulled the EV out of my system and replaced it with a Xilica.

 

Let me rephrase that....this is why I pulled BOTH Ev's out of the system,. so I could replace them BOTH with a single unit that covered everything.

 

 

JUB 510 69.pdf 14.08 kB · 1 download

The DE75 is what was used on the 904s I had. It was the stock driver then. No clue what it might be now. But I bought them brand new 6-7 years ago. Of course I do realize that the transition from 904 bass bin might be a completely different animal to a la scala? 

[Heritage_Head]

I’m sure others will chime in, and tell me I'm crazy 😜 lol…. it might be interesting to just try and run the regular crossover I have now (take the two connectors that connect the K 55, and the K 77…. Then just run both of them right into the 510 (stand way back 🙄) and see what happens? 

[Heritage_Head]

1 minute ago, Heritage_Head said:

I’m sure others will chime in, and tell me I'm crazy 😜 lol…. it might be interesting to just try and run the regular crossover I have now (take the two connectors that connect the K 55, and the K 77…. Then just run both of them right into the 510 (stand way back 🙄) and see what happens? 

If anyone on here has tried this please chime in and tell me what happened.

[jjptkd]

4 minutes ago, Heritage_Head said:

The DE75 is what was used on the 904s I had. It was the stock driver then. No clue what it might be now. Of course I do realize that the transition from 904 bass bin might be a completely different animal to a la scala? 

 

The newer k-691 is a DE75 with a "hardened?" diaphragm IIRC. The two bass bins should have similar sensitivity though the 904's should have a much broader usable frequency band, 45hz-800? vs the 55hz-400?? The older crossovers didn't have a high freq cut on the mid horn as the driver had a natural roll off but the k510/k75 needs some EQ to get the high end from what I understand. If you do hook up the the horn to your 4500 crossover I'd just plug it into the mid out only don't combine the tweeter output with it. 

[Heritage_Head]

1 minute ago, jjptkd said:

 

The newer k-691 is a DE75 with a "hardened?" diaphragm IIRC. The two bass bins should have similar sensitivity though the 904's should have a much broader usable frequency band, 45hz-800? vs the 55hz-400?? The older crossovers didn't have a high freq cut on the mid horn as the driver had a natural roll off but the k510/k75 needs some EQ to get the high end from what I understand. If you do hook up the the horn to your 4500 crossover I'd just plug it into the mid out only don't combine the tweeter output with it. 

Would you suggest leaving the tweeter (k77) hooked up as well then? 

[jjptkd]

Just now, Heritage_Head said:

Would you suggest leaving the tweeter (k77) hooked up as well then? 

 

 You could try it with and without, I'd try it without first just to hear what the 510 combo will do on its own. One thing to consider the 4500 crossover is designed for a mid driver with a 16ohm (12ohm) driver so the actual crossover point will be a bit different, should OK and safe as long as you don't blast it.

[Heritage_Head]

14 minutes ago, jjptkd said:

 

 You could try it with and without, I'd try it without first just to hear what the 510 combo will do on its own. One thing to consider the 4500 crossover is designed for a mid driver with a 16ohm (12ohm) driver so the actual crossover point will be a bit different, should OK and safe as long as you don't blast it.

Please feel free to correct me on this, but isn’t the woofer the biggest issue when it comes to resistance?

[Heritage_Head]

I always thought that speakers (i’m talking full speaker not just a driver) impedance was kind of measured based on the bass section more than anything else?

[billybob]

38 minutes ago, Heritage_Head said:

I’m sure others will chime in, and tell me I'm crazy 😜 lol…. it might be interesting to just try and run the regular crossover I have now (take the two connectors that connect the K 55, and the K 77…. Then just run both of them right into the 510 (stand way back 🙄) and see what happens? 

You would want to run the passives anyway, at least at first out of curiosity.

[geoff.]

2 hours ago, Heritage_Head said:

I’m sure others will chime in, and tell me I'm crazy 😜 lol…. it might be interesting to just try and run the regular crossover I have now (take the two connectors that connect the K 55, and the K 77…. Then just run both of them right into the 510 (stand way back 🙄) and see what happens? 

 

Noooooo!

For the love of all that is sacred, please don't do this.

 

I think that would be a recipe for a "cascading series of failures".

 

I have wondered about putting an 8 ohm resistor in place of the tweeter, but   even that would create issues.

 

In this particular, and pretty much all other, un-EQ'd crossovers the midrange would overpower the treble.

 

If you go to the websites of any driver manufacturers you can find their FR charts. It is easily 7db difference in the mids and highs.

 

 

[Deang]

‘“I’ve got a bad feeling about this.”’

[Heritage_Head]

What about another pro line speaker crossover? Like the 904 but one that xo lower (closer to 400)?

[Schu]

you can get close, but that timing coherence remains a 'slight' issue.

you're opposed to active?

[Schu]

did you see these OP...

 

k-69a

[jjptkd]

2 hours ago, Schu said:

did you see these OP...

 

k-69a

 

 Seems a little high on the price considering you can buy generic brand for $180 new:

 

https://www.amazon.com/LASE-BM-D750-2-Throat-Titanium-Compression/dp/B08BPFMBX2

 

Or the newer version of the Paudio for $340:

 

https://usspeaker.com/paudio bmd750-1.htm

 

 I've purchased a couple pairs of the k-69-a don't think I've paid more than $300 shipped. I apologize if the seller is a forum member but they are not posted for sale here as far as I know.