OLD VS NEW

[toomanyspeakers]

In the opinions of those who have heard both does a newer model khorn, lascala, etc. sound any different that a simular model made say twenty years ago or so. I was just wondering in regards to improved drivers, crossovers, etc..

[IndyKlipschFan]

WOW what a loaded question, as we all hear "it" differently. I will say this. Last year at the Klipsch get together I got to hear the "New" Heritage line consisting of the K horn, Belle, and La Scala.. (the Heresy was not hooked up) I think we all in attendance, liked them all. Most people said they "felt" that all of the speakers we heard seemed smoother from the lowest lows to the highs.

That said, some will argue, which is hard to prove of course, that an older say 1977 Klipschorn, which in that era, had all of the top of the line drivers and workmanship perhaps was at its best from those that built them too.. That that year / combination was Paul Klipsches design at it's finest.

It is a touchy subject for the purist and one looked at by the tinkerers trying to find Nirvana. That said, even the worst combination K horn (whatever that year is lol) is Incredible, compared to say better than 90% of what else is out there.

If you have the money, I doubt you would be disappointed in the new K horn. If you need to save your pennies.. But still, you will need a lot of them... LOL. Look at ebay or elsewhere.

Hope that helped skate around the answer some. I feel like a politician.

[TBrennan]

Indy----Top of the line drivers? When did Klipsch ever use top of the line drivers?

The answer of course is never. Oh, in the 1950s he used some EV and Stephens woofers which were arguabley top of the line stuff (maybe, big maybe) and for awhile he used a WE compression driver (but not their best one).

Otherwise the components he used were of good quality (mostly) but hardly top of the line horn stuff.

[artto]

Some people seem to think that a 2 (verses 1") compression driver with a larger voice coil having more mass makes a better mid range driver with faster transient response & wider, smoother frequency response. Or that a tweeter that is capable of withstanding 40 or more watts is actually worthy of the name for the same reasons. Or that a woofer driver that has a one inch peak to peak excursion has lower frequency modulation distortion.

Those are components for sound reinforcement, and other professional applications where a certain sound or coloration is often desirable, & where the reliability required under extreme & large scale operating conditions are encountered and are of paramount importance, more so than hi-fidelity. Obviously there are many aspects to what the definition of top quality is & what is required of it.

[D-MAN]

I estimate that the 70's stuff is probably a nostalgia thing, rather than actual fact... sort of like the "golden age" of audio when we were young and the like...

I can only say that the modern gear I have now certainly outclasses the stuff I had then, like the old EV T35 tweeters, etc.

Hard to say, but I'll take new over old as far as sound goes.

Manufacturing still wants to sell you something that maximizes their profits, rather than what is actually the best (or even what sounds good). That hasn't changed at all.

But my guess is that the performance per dollar has possibly increased since then. That is, a 35.00 tweeter today like the Eminence APT-50 is a better performer than the EV T-35 back then which cost about the same back then too. Technically, in 70's dollars, the EV cost more and did less: what a deal!

DM

[lynnm]

I love my 1982 Khorns. I modded the Xovers from AA to A and like the result.

That said,I have not heard the newest versions of the Heritage line. I would not be the least suprised to discover that the later models are in some ways better sounding simply because technology does not stand still and the Klipsch R&D department has access to a long technical history,multiple examples of the earlier versions,the latest in materials,the best of test equipment and presumably a large cadre of sound freaks anxious to demonstrate their expertise to each other and management.

The analogy that occurs to me is related to my lovely old home. This house built in 1909 would have been a joy the day the new owners moved in. Various successive owners made improvements to add to its comfort and overall liveability. At this point the home is far more comfortable and convenient than at any time in its history and I suspect that at some point after I am fertilising the daisies another in the line of its owners will justifyingly brag about how the house has been improved in their tenure.

My home and the Heritage line have this in common:

A really marvelous original has been subjected over a period of many years to the attentions of people determined to improve on it using the advances available to them subject to economic realities. I am sure that if the homemaker who first moved into this house had had access to an automatic washer and an automatic dishwasher those machines would have been installed. I am also sure that the reason we were the first to install such devices was that even though they had become available long before we moved in was simply that the dear old lady whose passing made our purchase possible couldn't bring herself to spend what would have been a year's income for her in her early years, ( even though she could have well afforded the cost years before she died. )

In any event the fact that the Klipschorn holds the record for continuous production in the high end audio world speaks volumes.( Yes I am aware of the recent 2 year hiatus ).

[TBrennan]

Lynn---Iconic has put the Altec 604 back into production after a few years, four or so, out of production. The first 604s were sold in the mid 1940s, 1945 as I recall.

[IndyKlipschFan]

TBrennan

There will always be an argument to what is "top of the line" vs/ and or, what fits best for the application. If Paul was a genious, and I think he should be qualified as one, then he was even more so by finding (lets be generous here for the sake of the argument) good quality speakers to put inside his wonderful speaker designs to achieve the desired result of getting the particular sound he wanted.

On paper, we can argue this is a better tweeter, mid horn, woofer, along with the cross over built for that cabinet... should provide a better result. Maybe if they were ALL top of the line price and performance wise, we would be looking at 20k speakers instead of enjoying a healthy used market for parts to keep our speakers singing. The new Heritage speakers still are a great deal IMO as a few have posted on here as well.

But audio is also an "art" in my opinion, and to "voice it" I think is the term used, so it sounds a certain way. How many times if something is so flat like studio monitors are made to be, does it sound lifeless and dull? The hidden tweeks to the cabinet to get a desired effect and drivers working with the cross overs is what makes the magic that is Klipsch.

Kinda like a big 4 door sedan with a Formula One engine. Fun, but not too practical or needed. Then again... vroooom vrooom... LOTS of fun!!!

BTW, how many, is too many speakers???

[Whyers]

Hello all,

First-timer about to purchase a pair of La Scala's.... I do have the year dilmea in a very real way however... exact same price / shipping on these...

1973 vs. 1989...

Are there any other modifications that occured in the build during these years such as crossover, wiring size or quality, driver longevitiy.... I'm leaning toward the 89's having read the posts here but wanted to get any clarification possible... I would, however, like to have vintage if that is the only determining factor..... so many tunes to hear, so little time...

Thanks very much, it's nice to become a part of community that has ears (I'm a perfectionist Drummer/Percussionist, tough to please, these may do it!)...

1973's

1989's (this guys has castors on these.... yikes)

[oldbuckster]

Both my sets of Klipsch were bought new.........both times I thought about used, and ended up with new................Was there a reason for those casters on the 89 La Scalas?

[SilverSport]

Have you listened to both??? Does either sound better to you??? I am going to guess not or you wouldn't be in this pickle...okay...differences will be in the speakers themselves...the drivers and the crossover...the crossover will be set up to operate with the actual speakers Klipsch was able to get at the time they were made...all else being equal, that and cosmetics should be the key...

I do not know much on the LaScala, I have K'Horns BUT they have a similar (if not the same) crossover but with a different name...so, might the crossovers in the rear of the 1973 be AA and the ones in the 89s be AL-2s???, you will have to get feedback here from the gurus about the better network crossover...from what I can see from these two pics...the 1989s seem to have a better grain pattern...either pair will probably do better (not mandatory) with a freshening to the crossovers...then there are the "upgrades" by those brilliant people here...Al Klappenberger, DeanG, popbumper, Bob Crites (BEC) and others...TONS of threads here on those...this will get you to the top and hopefully some of the gurus will chime in here...good luck, nice speakers and nice to have that "tough" choice.

Bill

[Whyers]

He just wheeled them around the house and occasionally out onto the driveway for the party...

[JohnA]

I have La Scalas and have heard the new ones. They are so close

to my '81s as to be identical. Very, very similar and I cannot

really point out any differences.

The new K-horns, compared to my memory of the late '70s versions are an

apparent increase in deep bass and smoother all over, especially in the

mid-bass.

As to Whyers' question of which La Scalas to buy, there were no

significant changes close to either '73 or '89. If the '89s have

Type AL crossovers, plan on replacing the crossovers with newer Klipsch

(Type AL-3) or any of out several designs from the Forums. The

K-55-M squawkers in the '89s can be smoother than K-55-Vs, though I

prefer the sound of the -Vs.

The '73s will have Type AA, xovers, K-55-V squawkers and K-77 (AlNiCo)

tweeters, if original. That is my favorite configuration. I

have upgraded all of my speakers to K-77-M and solder-terminal -Vs for

their supposedly better performance. Testing on my personal

speakers have shown no visible response improvement in the K-77-M,

though.

The '89s will probably test smoother after the crossovers are replaced.

[Whyers]

Exactly the advice I was looking for ;-) I've decided on the 89's and will be picking them up this week. Again, thanks for the help in deciding...

[Lostinozz]

I'd opt for the new ones, that way you'd have some great big boxes to open...it would be like an early Christmas.[]

[mark1101]

Whyers,

Welcome.

Interestting old post you revived. I always liked to read LynnM's posts......a notable forum member who passed earlier this year.

I think the only thing not covered, and it probably makes little difference anyhow, is that the '89s should have the composite Squawker as opposed to the cast one in the '73s. I have Lascalas with each type, and I can't tell any difference.

The differences in the drivers that John mentions above is the biggest difference.

I think you made a good choice taking the newer speakers. You can make them sound much better with the crossover modifications that can be found on this forum.

[colterphoto1]

oops, I got caught in the time warp also. It is neat to read LynnM's old posts. Miss him.

I think one thing about the old 70's Heritage is that the wood veneers are so beautiful from that era. Either the supplier or the cabinet maker at Klipsch did great matching and mating of the veneered pieces.

I don't think the newer pieces look quite so nice.

M

[seti]

I got to hear the revamped line up in Hope at the last two gatherings and the most improved was the La Scala and Heresey. I am not as familiar with the Khorn and Cornwall to give an opinion. The new La Scala and Heresey I can safely say sounded much better than previous designs especially the La Scala. I think we were all impressed and I could be happy with the new La Scala if I didn't suffer from Jubilee lust. I guess you would have to see the new veneer they have for the La Scala but it is stunning especially the oak but my choice would be the cherry. If I could custom order I would choose the lacewood that they use on the 60th khorn. I do not have a good frame of reference for comparing the new khorn to the older but I loved the looks of the new khorn so sleek with that slim colar. The sound of the new khorns makes me want to trade my Belles for an older pair of Khorns.

My vote goes for new as I think PWK would be very proud of the current Heritage lineup. Bravo Klipsch

[Whyers]

took a while to coordinate schedules with the previous owner.... man, their in better shape than I had expected... $1100.... and now I'm hearing part of tunes I've listened to for years that somehow just weren't there before.... thanks for the suggestions everyone...

These have the AL-3 crossover which I'm going to leave for a while as I'm adding a KSW-12 or -15 to the mix and will then decide if the treble response is too hot...

And I decided to leave the castors.... brings them up off the floor for better bass response and now I can repoint as necessary very easily...

[sheltie dave]

Brian, if funds allow, you may consider the RSW series sub, as they are better than the KSW series.

The castor wheels are great for portability, but when you get a permanent spot for the Scalas, you may want to pull the wheels and save them. They actually uncouple the bass bins from the floor, lowering the output somewhat.

They look great!