Speaker - Break In time...Is that true?

[BillA]

Hey all,

Just got my RF-35's yesterday, ran new 12 gauge wire thru the house, got the RC-3 center and RF-35's all hooked up (only new addition is the RF-35's), quintets as surrounds and KSW 15 sub complete the package.

Went into my Onkyo menus, changed from small to large (for front speakers vs my old Quintets), just that sorta stuff,,,

And I wondered is it true that a speaker has to be "broken in" in terms of listening time before it will produce its full effective tone and sound?

Maybe I misunderstood it (read a few posts about breaking in speakers) and this all sounds good to me here and now, but wondered what is that whole breakin thing and is it true and what is the amount of time most agree on for a speaker to become broken in...

Also has anyone really HEARD a difference from say hour 1 to hour 30 or something (whatever the breakin time is)

Thanks for any help on that,

Bill

[hwatkins]

This can become a can of worms, so I'll go first -

There are folks all over the place on this issue. Many engineer types will textbook you to death on the concept that speaker break in is probably true, but that the number of times that a cone (the most common type that folks say needs break in) moves in even the simplest of passages means that break in happens so quickly that it is unimportant to try and spend time breaking in a speaker. Winthin two hours they believe you hear the speaker as it will be for most of its life.

A bunch of Full Range folks (especially the Lowther crowd) will tell you that break in is required (after all it is in the documentation). Many talk in terms of days worth of hours before the speaker hits its potential.

I do believe most would agree that compression drivers do not have any measurable breakin time - although I have heard some fuzzy conversations about the magnet needing to settle in, but can't get my mind to accept that concept.

My experience is with a sub woofer - I set up the SVS 20-39pci with spl meter two days after it arrived. While my ear did not notice any tone or timbre changes, I had to recalibrate two months later. The spl output had increased noticably - I can't say when it happened for sure during that 60 days, just that it happened. Two years later and no further recalibration (I have checked it several times). Something happened - break in? - yeah I think so, just not sure of why or how...

[damonrpayne]

Trey Cannon mentioned they occasionally get calls from new Klipschorn owners claiming "These things have no bass!", the same people call back a few days later saying, "Never mind"; while not an official statement that Klipsch supports the idea of break in it does lean in that direction doesn't it?

As hwatkins said, just check your calibrations a few days/weeks after you get new speakers. Be sure to report back here either way, the large amount of anecdotal knowledge is one of the good things about this forum.

[itsmyforte]

all drivers, whether from a 1/2" tweeter to 18" woofer do "break in". but whether that affects the acoustics is the question. your ears break in more than the speaker does. basically what i'm saying is you get used to the way they sound.

[D-MAN]

I am in agreement with the idea that there is some sort of break-in period required for speakers to reach optimum performance and efficiency.

I also agree with that the time required is rather nebulous. But I have found that it seems to exist but varies with the application. I did not notice it per se with my newest woofers, but for midrange and tweets, I say definitely. I attribute this to the fact that the lower bass tone changes are harder to detect than the uppers.

DM

[CECAA850]

Billa, I can't give you facts or figures on how or why. All I know that is with my RF-5's and 7's I was relatively unimpressed when I first got them. They weren't what I had hoped for. Sometime during the first month of use, they came alive. Again, I don't know how or why, I just know what I heard. At this point, you couldn't get me to trade them for anything, I love the way they sound. I still have both pair. I've heard the theory of your ears getting used to the way they sound but I don't buy into that. Again, no scientific evidence here, just my thoughts on the matter. Carl.

[SteelerFan]

I'm a believer now. I was also a little disappointed with my RF-7's when they were new compared to my Forte's, the bass just didn't seem to be there. But the bass is terrific now.

[DrWho]

well im of the crowd that thinks break in time is a bunch of crap

consider the crowds that purchases used speakers, or speakers that would have ample "time to break in"...i would bet good money that once they start learning the speaker and start ignoring the new distortions, that they will start changing their settings and start noticing new things they've never heard before. This improvement in sound couldn't be "speaker break in" because it's already had years of use.

I think "speaker break in time" if we want to use that term, refers to how the listener changes his listening habits. With every piece of equipment, there is going to be a new set of distortions and new areas of clarity that your ear is going to need to adjust to.

I think another way to test this concept would be to purchase a brand new pair of speakers (say the RF-7's) and then later down the road "after they're broken in" purchase another brand new pair of the same model and then have a friend wire one new one and one old one together to make a stereo pair. If someone could blindly locate the new speaker, then I would subscribe to speaker break in theory. I've never seen or heard of any reports like this.

[Fish]

The answer is YES,most anything that moves requires time to "break in".That said,with speakers this time is very short.

[Soundthought]

Hmmmmmm.

I dunno......

Thermodynamic effects on suspension compliance?

Magnetic supersaturation?

Network "burn in"?

Who knows?

Interesting thread, though.

Rock and roll ain't no riddle man, too me it makes good, good sense.

Regards,

John

[Foxman]

I was told that for speaker break in I should turn on my AVR (at the time) and leave it on a low volume even if it was just static for 40 hours of continuous movement. I did and really didnt notice a differance. I have over time grown noticed an improved sound, now if thats my ears adjusting or the speakers maturing I wont argue. I also have had to recalibrate the speakers including my sub, although I have also made periodic upgrades that warrented adjustments.

Bottom line: I got no idea

[kenratboy]

Trey could probably answer this VERY well.

JBL Pro stated that on their 15" woofers (like the 2226), after 6 hours of use, the T/S parameters STOPPED changing (meaning there was a short period where the driver changed than stabalized).

It certainly wasn't THOUSANDS of hours of use, and I assume the changes were marginal at that.

This was not sound related, but design related (the cabinets are designed for the broken in speaker, not a brand new one).

This was a JBL Pro white paper, it is probably still available. I bet the Audioheritage folks could find it.

I figure, by the end of your first movie or CD, they are 99.999% broken in. I don't believe that they will change radically.

[Coytee]

Different angle on same topic...

If you take your K-horns, LaScallas, other... and put them into STORAGE for "X" days, months, years and then bring them out, do you need to REBREAK them in, or ought they be up to par immediately?

[Fish]

Richard,I don't think I would buy rebreakin(if thats a word).I think breaking in only applies to the newness(if thats a word)of the speaker.

[jdm56]

The only thing that has to "break in" with new speakers is your ears. You have to adjust to the differences in sound from the old pair. And lo and behold, after you've listened to them awhile, they start sounding better! Or worse, as the case may be. Happens every time.

[wheelman]

Absolutely true! Some times people don't like their speakers till they break in. On the other hand I have heard speakers where I loved them, and then when they were broken in I didn't care for them. They were really tight then got sloppy in the bass. Not true for every speaker. But for the most part I usually like them after they have been broken in.

[nuclearay]

I did hear some major differences in my RF7s when I listened to the same music in the store (their reciever) vs. when I got them home (my reciever). I was worried about the lack of bass as compared to some of the other products in the store. That concern disappeared when I got them home and turned them up.

I had the demo models in my house for a few weeks before my new speakers finally showed up. At the same time I also had to swap out a reciever.

For the first receiver and set of demo speakers my normal listening level was around -15db. For the second reciever and my new speakers the listening level went up to about -10db. At first I attributed this change to only the reciever, but as time went on that level has dropped to anywhere between -15 to -20db which makes me believe that the speakers have 'broken in.' Much of the same music and movies were used in both cases negating the differences between recording levels of different material.

I have absolutely nothing to prove that either the receiver or the speakers has changed over time. I just know what levels I like to hear things -- and the numbers have changed over time which sort of replicates what hwatkins has said.

A few weeks ago a buddy of mine came in to town (the same one who turned me on to Klipsh 15 years ago when we were young lads) and after about 14 hours of drinking homebrew my judgement took a nosedive -- I decided to see how loud my stereo would go. I popped in an oldschool Miami bass drum (in the style of what kids make their cars go 'boom' with) and kept turning the knob until...

My room is about 4000 cubic feet and the Ratshack meter was reading peaks of 120db at 15' from the speakers. It took my neighbor about 10 minutes before he rang my doorbell.

If there was a break-in period I'm sure I've passed it. And I don't question wether or not these speakers can reproduce bass (in a given frequency range, of course) anymore.

So to those people worried about speaker break-in... just do it.

[Sid]

Going back to the menu on the Onkyo, shouldn"t the front speakers be set to small? Sid

[WMcD]

I think there are two issues.

The first is whether the response of the "new" speaker changes after some use.

I had tested the TS parameters of two Pyramid drivers out of the shipping box and then after driving them fairly hard overnight. This was with the LMS system, which is pretty much the industry standard.

There was no change in my testing.

On the other hand, I was astounded to read some comments by Dr. D'Apolito that manufacturers claim there can be some change. Whether it is something which can be heard was not reported.

= =

The second is the extent to which our ear brain combination gets used to ANY set up. It is closely related. System A or B is different and both are "broken in."

You listen to system A for weeks and it is good. Then go to another set up B, and it sounds odd. After a while, B sounds natural. Then you go back to A and it sounds odd in comparison to B.

The subjective merits of the A or B goes on without break-in being a variable.

- - -

My best guess is that there is no appreciable change in actual speaker performance with break-in. We've not seen anyone publish a sound curve of before and after.

Rather, it is a matter of getting used to a system in a psycho-acoustic sense.

Best,

Gil

[wheelman]

Think of it like a pair of brand new boots. Very stiff and hard on your feet. As time goes by of course things are gonna break in when there is movement. Then all of sudden after time goes by those crappy blister given boots are comfy. In time the woofer will give way for more excursion and have more warmth and depth. Tweeters will loosen up in time making them less abraisive and grainy smoothing them out also making them more open. Most reviewers will play speakers for about a week straight before they review them. Do you think all the reviewers are smoking the same stuff? Got to be something to it. Just my opinion, and almost every speaker reviewer on the planet. I also agree with getting used to the sound of a speakers tone. But some speakers you just aren't gonna get used to. They are headaches in the waiting, and no break in period is gonna help them.