Erik Mandaville Posted October 7, 2004 Share Posted October 7, 2004 I've just finished a third SE OTL from Transcendent Sound. Despite the fact that some points of view maintain that the amp is grossly underpowered, even for Klipschorns, I have to say it is simply the most elegant and musical amplifier of any single-ended amp I've had in my system. The sound is just very difficult to describe -- it's not altogether tube-like, nor does it sound like most solid state amplifiers I've heard. It's tonal quality, even after just 15 minutes of playing music, seems so utterly natural and effortless, even at very low volume levels. It is truly an amazingly fine amp, and in kit-form costs under $800. If more power was an absolute must or desire, a pair of bridged monoblocks would be under $1,600. The SE OTL bridged will provide about 4 very high quality watts. All this has been discussed before, but I just really, really like this amp. I think my DIY, modified version of JFL's Horus is also excellent, but there is just something to be said, IMO, for output-transformerless coupling between amplifier and loudspeaker. For those of you who are less insterested in vibrating walls (though I think that can be fun, too sometimes!), this OTL has got to be on your short list if you're looking. Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 7, 2004 Share Posted October 7, 2004 could I bridge 10 and get 40 watts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted October 7, 2004 Share Posted October 7, 2004 Instead of poking fun at its measly 4 WPC, maybe you should give it a serious listen played through Klipschorns...it just might surprise you. Just a thought... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted October 7, 2004 Share Posted October 7, 2004 When your ears roll off at 8 kHz, you need the extra power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piranha Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 Congratulations. Glad to hear you like it. It sure sounds like a nice amp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J M O N Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 Erik: I've read many of your comments about these amps with interest. It has made me want to try one out at some point. It's been a while since I've done any soldering, so I might have to think a little bit about building one myself. Of course you're not the only one that has gushed about these amps. Thanks for keeping us informed about your experiences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 "Instead of poking fun at its measly 4 WPC, maybe you should give it a serious listen played through Klipschorns...it just might surprise you." Though I'm sure these things sound great -- I can't do "serious" listening with 4 watts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 4 watts in bridged mode! I'd like to hear that! The lowest power I've tried on my Klipschorns is a 10 watt per channel solid state kit amp I built a few years ago. It IS surprising how loud the Klipschorns will go with just a few watts. Maybe you can't crack plaster board with it but I'm sure high quality 4 watts sounds just fine - especially when you've built it yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 It's funny how a simple joke that I'm sure Eric took in good nature can bring the worst out in others. Just to bring you hostile low watt guy's up to date I own a very good example of SET and have listened to many in my day. Yes up to about 85dB it sounds very good with some types of music outside of those parimeters blah! Give it a rest !!! Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnysal Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 I wonder if strapping them to monoblocks would alter the sound somewhat, have you tried it? I have auditioned "paralell single ended" amps before and ofund they lost some of the "SET magic", is this basically the same type of deal? paralelling the output tubes? I too am starting to be intrigued by the number of people who speak highly of these economical OTL amps. thanks, tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 Tony, It already is running four tubes in parallel. You just double that when you run it as a monoblock. That might change the sound somewhat since it will lower its output impedance further. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 Erik, "I have to say it is simply the most elegant and musical amplifier of any single-ended amp I've had in my system." Utter heresy to even suggest this but have you ever tried adding NFB (which the SE OTL uses) to your other SETs to see how they sounded in that conguration? I had one amp years ago that had selectable feedback (GTA SE-40) and I prefered it with feedback turned on. The trick to comparing with and without feedback is to account for the difference in gain with the feedback. If you just go back to back the no NFB will play louder which is going to be prefered. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 Yep, I've got one of those SE OTL's and agree that it is amazing how it sounds on Khorns with 1.5 wpc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai2000 Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 Of course nobody will be surprised that I agree with Erik and Dee. I'd rather not get into the 1.5 vs x watts debate, but in my listening environment 'even' the SE OTL is able to make the neigbours realize what's being played in the listening room (in all fairness I should remind everybody that I am using a sub, but that is true for my other amps as well!) and for ME 'serious listening' is not a question of wattage, but often the result of my 'listening mood' . Wolfram Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 ---------------- On 10/8/2004 5:13:06 AM DeanG wrote: Though I'm sure these things sound great -- I can't do "serious" listening with 4 watts. ---------------- If one plans to do "serious" listening, maybe one should pursue "serious" music. Just a thought. Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted October 8, 2004 Share Posted October 8, 2004 ---------------- On 10/8/2004 7:55:27 AM NOSValves wrote: Just to bring you hostile low watt guy's up to date I own a very good example of SET and have listened to many in my day. Yes up to about 85dB it sounds very good with some types of music outside of those parimeters blah! Give it a rest !!! Craig ---------------- Could you please quantify in numbers and originator of the "many" SET amps you have listened to in your day, including how long you listened? Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piranha Posted October 9, 2004 Share Posted October 9, 2004 Please give it a rest. I know I can speak for others when I say that we're all pretty tired of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted October 9, 2004 Share Posted October 9, 2004 ---------------- On 10/9/2004 12:16:33 AM Piranha wrote: Please give it a rest. I know I can speak for others when I say that we're all pretty tired of it. ---------------- Are you sure of which login you're using this time? Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted October 9, 2004 Author Share Posted October 9, 2004 Shawn: You bring up an interesting point. I have indeed thought of the application of NFB, not only in earlier SET amps, but with the preamp I'm using now, as well. The preamp circuit looks like it would be a particularly good candidate in its similarity to the Grounded Grid. This is food for thought, thanks for responding. I'm not really sure why 'serious' listening is directly related to the output biceps of an amplifier, but am again reminded that people seem to hear and process 'heard' information differently. That some may be completely comfortable with low power amplification is simply a personal choice and preference. I don't believe it needs to be interpreted, as it often seems to be the case here, as a threat to those who prefer more power. I have never said that a low-power amplifier is necessarily 'better' or 'worse' than any other type of amplifier. I have mentioned what has sounded good or not AS good(as the case may have been)to me, but those instances -- as in the case above with the SE OTL -- have only been related to me and what I have found favorable in terms of our listening environment and overall musical preferences. The exact opposite of this statement holds true, I think, for those who need or want more power behind the type of music they listen to and how they listen to it. Craig was just joking around with me, and I got kind of a kick out of the mental picture of two long strings of SE OTLs parked in our listening room like a couple of trains at a train station. May I submit the possibility that we may have other things in our lives more deserving of the expenditure of emotional energy than the power of our amplifiers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted October 9, 2004 Share Posted October 9, 2004 ---------------- On 10/9/2004 6:37:06 AM Erik Mandaville wrote: May I submit the possibility that we may have other things in our lives more deserving of the expenditure of emotional energy than the power of our amplifiers? ---------------- Gee, that's a tough one, Eric. If we didn't strut around arguing about the power output of our amps, we'd probably be niggling each other about whose car is faster over the standing 1/4 mile, or how many girls....whoops sorry, I'd better leave that one alone! But seriously, I've just checked Transcendent Sound's website out. They have a good range and the concept of OTL tube amps appeals to me. There's no output transformer to worry about, so there's cost benefits, but also, and more importantly, the sound would not be limited by output transformer quality. You should get a much faster sound. This seems to equate with your observations, Eric. So from start to finish, how long did it take to put the amp together? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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