La Scala II

[sunburnwilly]

Shinall is alot smaller operation than Speakerlab, too. How many units could a one man shop turn out?

He would make a great elf .

[Daddy Dee]

Indeed. I'd sure like to have one of his "Belle" cabs.

[audiophile.1963]

I'm with Scooterdog ... to copy and to sell a clone like Shinall is not good! I understand who has little money to spent, buys Klipsch components and builds a loudspeaker ONLY FOR HIM, this is another thing. But the "La Scala" of Shinall is not a La Scala only a copy: I'm curious to see how the new cabinet of Klipsch La Scala was built (front, back, inside) not of Shinall (I should never buy these).

Excuse me for my language, I hope to speak frankly

Beppe

[Marvel]

Beppe,

There are quite a few on these forums who have built their own LaScalas, Khorns, and Belles. Even though they weren't built by Klipsch, most will still call them by their factory name even though they are really clones. These are so old the patents have run out. There are a couple who have posted here who actually bought some of Gary Shinall's speakers and been very satisfied with them. At least these guys aren't making Bose clones and telling you how great they are.

Bruce

[Daddy Dee]

Bose clones. hmmmm.

like they say "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery".

too bad for Bose.

[formica]

to copy and to sell a clone like Shinall is not good!

He's using very old (patent expired) designs to build a hand full of

speakers a year to satisfy his passion for audio and woodworking

They do have unique names... so technically he isn't doing any

wrong.

Not much different IMHO than those selling reproduction xovers built with current parts.

ROb

[Trey Cannon]

I talked to him on the pnone once.

He told me that he uses "Used" parts and test them all by ear.

I guess you get what you pay for.

Klipsch is aware of him and his sales.

At this time there is nothing to be done...who knows if it will stay like that.

[Marvel]

I talked to him on the pnone once.

He told me that he uses "Used" parts and test them all by ear.

I guess you get what you pay for.

Klipsch is aware of him and his sales.

At this time there is nothing to be done...who knows if it will stay like that.

Last year I emailed him and he was putting in new parts, but not what Klipsch uses. Let's see... he doesn't claim that they ARE Klipsch speakers, uses diffeent parts in a cabinet design the the patents have expired on. Makes a few a year. I would guess it would hurt more in the PR department if Klipsch did anything at all against him.

Bruce

[Daddy Dee]

I talked to him on the pnone once.

He told me that he uses "Used" parts and test them all by ear.

I guess you get what you pay for.

Klipsch is aware of him and his sales.

At this time there is nothing to be done...who knows if it will stay like that.

Last

year I emailed him and he was putting in new parts, but not what

Klipsch uses. Let's see... he doesn't claim that they ARE Klipsch

speakers, uses diffeent parts in a cabinet design the the patents have

expired on. Makes a few a year. I would guess it would hurt more in the

PR department if Klipsch did anything at all against him.

Bruce

My impression is also that he uses alternate parts, not identical to

Klipsch, though for example, would leave the tweeter hole open if

someone wants to use a K77.

Another thing that I find interesting, Mr. Shinall fabricates his own

horns, bending metal, I think. I've been trying to imagine what his

process would be like.

[LarryC]

I wonder if he could bend a 600 for a certain reissued speaker?

[Al Klappenberger]

Guys,

I have had several conversations with Shinall. He evaluated a set of my Universal netwroks. He said that they were "Not musical". That's a tip-off to me that somebody don't know what a speaker is supposed to do! It's the job of the artis making a recording to be "musical". A apeaker is just a "window" through which you listen to that "music"! He also expressed an interest in my Trachorn during the time I was trying to get a local wood shop to build them. He was considering putting them in his Klipsch clones and want to know what the local shop was going to charge me. At the time I did'n know so told him I would get back to him. I never did! He admists that he has no test equipment. My conclusion about him is that he is an expert cabinet maker but doesn't know squat about speakers! If you buy from him, get the cabinet only and build the rest of the speaker into the box yourself! I did find him to be quite flexable and I think you could easly get him to modify the dimensions to fit my Trachorn or any other components you might want right into a cabinet he would make for you. I think that kind of arangement could allow somebody to make up a beautifull set of top performing speakers at a very good price.

Al K.

[mark1101]

I spoke with Mr. Shinall a couple of times at length, and he is a very nice guy. I agree with Al, from all I found out he is definitely an expert cabinet maker. He definitely uses different electrical components than Klipsch, but all of good or high quality. I have heard that his speakers sound excellent, but I haven't heard them myself.

He professes that his Khorn clone cabinets are exact copies, piece for piece, but with better construction and fasteners. If this is what you are looking for, I would stop and give him a call. His cabinets and finishes are VERY well done, and he is flexible to sell just cabinets.

At one time I was interested in cabinets only since it is frustrating to try and find a pair of Khorns here in the south. I eventually decided that although beautiful, authenticity meant more to me, so I still wait.

Nice guy, hard working one man shop. No threat to anyone, and builds nice things.

[D-MAN]

Al K, since he isn't using the Klipsch components, who is to say that the ALK-A is NOT a good match to his Eminence drivers - remember the FUN we had with mine? I would think that it probably has a big impedance mismatch at the very least, knowing that he is using an 8 Ohm woofer.

I can imagine from experience that it might, in fact, just sound like C.R.A.P. on just about any other Eminence 8 Ohm driver (like mine, for instance).

It probably sounded bad, so why not say it's "not musical". That would be putting it nicely. But the ALK is designed as a Klipsch upgrade - you assumed it would work on something else, and we know that Eminence has a wide variance in the total Z of their drivers, and you were evidently wrong. Don't get bent out of shape, it has nothing to do with the quality of the ALK, of course. I have a pair, but I certainly won't use them on my particular horns because it sounds "not musical" and that is putting it nicely. Not the crossover's fault by any means.

Here is the TRUTH:

Even if Klipsch WANTED to, there is nothing that they can do legally speaking. All of the PWK designs are in the public domain now, except those covered by patents (I think the MGM has expired by now, too).

The Klipschorn patent expired in 1965. The La Scala and Belle were not patented at all, neither was the CW or Heresy.

There is not patent infringement, and no reference to any Klipsch trademarked names is made by Shinall - so where is the beef?

I would only think that Klipsch has a BIG problem if they waste their time chasing this. And anyone concerned about it is also wasting their time, too. The only thing preventing anyone from manufacturing these is the stigma of using someone's well-known design. Shinall has never claimed that they are his designs, although he has a couple of interesting ones of his own.

It would also only help Gary to sell his stuff, after all, if KlipschCo was concerned, he is doing good, ain't he? More power to the little guy!

I agree that the empty cabinets is the way to go.

DM

[Daddy Dee]

I wonder if he could bend a 600 for a certain reissued speaker?

I think there might be a win-win situation in that question.

[Deang]

Surprisingly, Al hasn't said much -- but he is soon to take delivery of the first set of Trachorn 600's from Martinelli. It really is time for people to stop spending money on gear upgrades that offer nothing more than slight shifts in sonic signature or that more times than not only provide perceived "improvement" by the mere fact that it sounds different. It's time to suck it up and do the single best thing one can do to reduce distortion and increase midrange coherency/transparency.

Incidently, the new Cornwall uses the same 700Hz horn and driver as the new reissued Heresy -- it's not a 600Hz horn.

Since our midhorns cover a full four octaves of music -- it's simply not the place to ignore or skimp on.

[NOSValves]

Surprisingly, Al hasn't said much -- but he is soon to take delivery of the first set of Trachorn 600's from Martinelli. It really is time for people to stop spending money on gear upgrades that offer nothing more than slight shifts in sonic signature or that more times than not only provide perceived "improvement" by the mere fact that it sounds different. It's time to suck it up and do the single best thing one can do to reduce distortion and increase midrange coherency/transparency.

Incidently, the new Cornwall uses the same 700Hz horn and driver as the new reissued Heresy -- it's not a 600Hz horn.

Since our midhorns cover a full four octaves of music -- it's simply not the place to ignore or skimp on.

Dean,

You haven't paid Al yet?

[Deang]

LOL, yeah -- I have to kiss everyone's arse until I get them paid off, then I can't write the "real" reviews.

[Daddy Dee]

The new Cornwall does use the K701 horn. I was thinking though, that it is crossed at 800hz.

Can anyone help me with that?

[Al Klappenberger]

Dana,

My Universal network uses a single 2.4 mH inductor in sereis with the woofer, just like the Klipsch AA and the A clones that Shinall builds himself. That makes it universal with virtually any woofer. I'm pretty sure Shinall uses the Eminence Kapp 15 woofer driver in his stuff. That's as close to the K33 as you can get. The only different driver he uses that is unknown to me is the squawker driver. My expericen says that doesn't mak any real major difference. In short, they guy simply picks the stuff he LIKES. With no instruments, his speakers simply reflect HIS taste! SO, you will simply be buying what HE considers "musical"!

BTW: The original Cornwall and the Cornwall II used a 600 Hz horn and crossover. It's the Heresy that was 700 Hz. OF course, I don't know what the newest incarnation is using. The Trachorn 600 project is on the back burner, but it is in the works. Martinelli is doing it as a "personal" job for me to put in my home made "Heresy on steroids" speaker in my den home theater. They will directly replace the K501 horns I took out of my Belles. When I do, the old K501s will be for sale! SOMEDAY! Right now though, I am having him concentrate on the big Trachorn 400 until I get ahead on orders for them. That should be in about a week.

Al K.

[LarryC]

The new Cornwall does use the K701 horn. I was thinking though, that it is crossed at 800hz.

Can anyone help me with that?

I'm sure that's what I also heard in Hope. Didn't the earlier 600 Hz horn cross at 600? That's a not-insignificant interval of a fourth, almost half an octave lower.