Vintage tube tuners...is FM today worthy?

[jt1stcav]

Just aquired what looks like a pristine classic mid '60s H.H. Scott Stereomaster 370-B wideband FM MPX stereo tuner with all its original tubes. It was given to a friend who had plans on using it awhile ago, but he later turned towards building himself a tube guitar amp and lost interest in the tuner...so now it's mine (yes, a freebie)! Here's a pic I downloaded; I'll eventually take some pics of mine, but it looks as clean as this model shown.

Here's a brief description from www.hhscott.com website:

The 370 was Scott's low-cost Stereo-MPX tube tuner design, marketed along side the more expensive 350B/C, 310E, and 4310

The 370 featured low-cost, Compactron Tubes (6M11 & 6AG11), also use in the 345 receiver.

370's were unique in their use of vacuum tube diodes in the multiplex decoder switching matrix.

A 6HU6/EM87 tuning-eye tube was used for the tuning meter

Visually the front panel is very similar to FM-mono 314, the 370 uses a "tighter" (one-piece) tuning-eye aperture

also see
Kit version, LT-111,

used wide "C" Case/chassis

I haven't fired it up yet...I know it's been serviced once (due to the tag on its side), but there's no date indicating when. So I'm reluctant to hook it up until such time as I can have someone look at it (Craig, Erik, or my dad). If you think it's safe to plug 'n' play, let me know. The last owner who gave it to me said he did plug it into the wall recently (not connected to his system), and the dial light and tubes all lit up and there was no hum, buzz, or smoke!

I haven't listened to FM in over 3 years now (lost interest due to the crap on the radio these days). The local NPR station was the only program worth listening to IMO. I assume this tube tuner, with its MPX circuitry, is capable of listening to modern day radio stations (correct me if I'm wrong), but is FM radio worthy of this fine Scott tuner? And is tube tuners that much better sounding than their SS counterparts?

Your thoughts and concerns would be greatly appreciated at this point...thanks![]

[Chicago_Pete]

Cool stuff there. I like tuners too, although they are mostly useless these days. Here, there are just a few stations worth hearing, and since the hey day of FM fidelity is long gone, I think they pay little attention anymore to broadcast quality. However, that being said, I do like the sound of my tubed MR-71 versus my APS modded Kenwood 7100T SS rig. The Kenwood has a slight edge in reception though. Let us know how is plays for you!

md

Mark, I have a modded Kenwood KT-7300 and an MR71. Just got the MR71 back from Terry DeWicks. The MR71 sounds much better but the 7300 will smoke it at locking into stations. Reception in Chicago is very good so the Kenwood sits on the shelf. Pete

[lwhaples]

Nice looking unit! Sweet deal! I have a Dynaco FM3 that I use all the

time. We have a nice classic rock station. It's on when I'm not

spinning LP's. Good Luck!

Larry

[NOSValves]

Jim,

clean all the tube pins/sockets and controls plug it in and give it a whirl. Tube tuners fair much better then tube amps with age since they have less then 200V to deal with under the chassis. The 370 is indeed a budget Scott tuner so its only going to work well with strong stations. If you decide you like FM I would invest in a better tuner rather then sink to much into the 370. But this should give you some idea if its something you want to get into.

Craig

[Gilbert]

Congrat's. That is a really cool looking tuner.

[Guest " "]

Congrats, on your new peice.

I often wondered about how vintage FM tuners would work on todays FM transmissions. Would be intrested in your assesment.

[rcarlton]

I have a McIntosh MAC-1700 with a tube tuner. Works great, very good reception. I prefer it to the digital tuner I have on my Denon receiver. Different sound, smoother than the Denon. Have only compared classic rock so far, and the MAC-1700 is connected to Heresy II's, while the Denon is connected to the K-horns through McIntosh ss amps.

[DRBILL]

I have a couple of DYNACO tube tuners that I rebuilt with better power supplies and network boards that corrected a bad design error.

Sadly, they don't perform well here in the Fort Worth/Dallas area where the FM band is covered up with strong stations. The design probably worked very well in the '60s where you had only four or five stations available in typical city.

I make a real exception to my vacuum tube rubric and run a DYNACO FM-5 (SS) in my system. I can think of no reason that would justify the use of vacuum tubes in FM tuners. The SS damage has been done, long before the signal reaches your antenna!

The band is pretty much a wasteland with a few exceptions. We have a city-owned classical station, an NPR station, and two university stations. I don't know if this list justifies having a tuner.

Another reason not to spend a lot of money on a rebuild or upgrade of an FM tuner is that FM radio is going to be replaced with a digital signal in the near future.

DRBILL

[Daddy Dee]

Congrats on the nice piece of gear. The 370 is a beauty.

[jt1stcav]

Thanks everyone for all the kind words. And Craig, I will clean up, connect, and fire up the 370-B (with one hand on the plug just in case). I assume a standard long wire can be connected to the 300 ohm terminal for the antenna.

I'm not expecting to pull many stations in at all, but it should be interesting to say the least. Knowing that the tuner I have is Scott's base model, I guess I can hope for one or two of the area's strongest stations...we'll see.

I haven't kept up with news of radio's update to the digital domain...once FM has gone digital in the near future, what then to all these and other tuners and to all the antique radios I own? Will they all be useless then?

Here's another pic I found online...I like its clean, simple layout.

[WMcD]

Dr. Bill makes some good points.

In my view, the biggest problem with FM is what is done to the signal before it gets to the transmitter. Rock and pop stations do a lot of processing to get the music to punch though the situtation in an automobile.

OTOH, Chicago's classical station, WFMT, has one of the very best audio systems on the planet. The quality comes through on every home or office system I've heard; Walkpersons too. They also run the Beethoven Network which provides classical programming to others.

I travel on business and it is interesting to investigate the variety of programming on NPR stations. For the most part I'd rate the audio quality to be higher (less processed) than most commercial stations. Of course we don't know what equipment is being used at the transmission end, or or how it is used.

As you may know, the NPR stations are sometimes affiliated with universities in out of the way places. I wonder whether some with old equipment are kept in tip top shape by some fanatic from the EE department while others have modern equipment suffering from lack of attention to detail. Further, I suspect that the universities keep them on the air just to make faculty members feel they are connected to a world outside the cornfields. So there is probably a lot of variation in the audio chain and who is running it, and why.

I think the audio quality, anywhere, is not a tube versus solid state thing. WFMT and its Beethoven Network is not relying on 12AX7s and vinyl for "quality". Rather it is great attention to good audio at all stages and in all mechanisms. And yes, some of the sources, like From The Recording Horn predate vacuum tubes. One can't say they are tube snobs or digital snobs. Smile.

I do think your tuner will benefit from good source material. You may find a good source on the dial if you hunt around. It might not be the music you like at first.

Gil

[khorn51]

That tunner dial on the 270 looks a lot like the one on my 310e. Maybe I should look for a cheap 270 to fix my 310e dial or anybody have a spare dial lying around.

[oldtimer]

The short answer on whether fm is worthy today is no. There are some good stations depending on where you live, but for my money an old transistor portable, receiver tuner, or car radio is just fine for listening to sports broadcasts when you can't watch the game on tv.

[jt1stcav]

Congrats, on your new peice. I often wondered about how vintage FM tuners would work on todays FM transmissions. Would be intrested in your assesment.

I'd love to find out, but one of my amp's 300Bs gave up the ghost, so unfortunantly my assesment may have to wait awhile longer.[]

[jheis]

Is FM today worthy? Depends on where you live.

However, if you've got a broad band connection, you can get what I get over the air. KCSM.org. Commercial free Jazz 24/7 (the real stuff - none of that "smooth" crap) can't give it a high enough recommendation (except that Sundays kinda suck after 2 pm - unless you're REALLY into the afro/cuban stuff).

James

[jt1stcav]

Finally listen to Craig and others and just installed the tuner to my system.

Several members on AudioKarma directed me to a link for a pdf owners manual which I read completely, and so I went ahead and hooked it up to my pre's AUX inputs.

It works...all its original tubes lit right up![]

Once I adjusted the numbered dial all the way to 88MHz to correspond to the indicator mark MEG, I picked up a good many stations from Tampa to Orlando using a single 4' wire antenna from my bro's new TOTL Pioneer Elite AV receiver.

Only problem I've found so far is that most of the strongest stations sound overmodulated when tuned in at their strongest setting (and magic-eye indicator bar is at its thinnest)! Even when I back out of from the station it still mostly sounds overmodulated (like distortion)...I assume the tuner needs alignment adjustments? Or are the tubes growing weak, or the caps need replacing? There was no hum, thank goodness.

At least it does work...maybe it's possible to put in a smaller voltage bulb for the dial's pilot light; this one is very bright and thus the dial is warped (and cracked) from the heat.

Thanks everyone for your input...greatly appreciate it!

[edwinr]

Nice tuner, Jim. I don't listen to Rock FM anymore. The music programming is sh*t, and the compression and processing these station's use is diabolical. I listen a lot to classical FM. I'm trying to learn a bit about classical because there's lots of cool classical stuff I like, but I don't know what it is. The classical stations usually discuss each piece before or after it's played. So I vote for a tuner as an essential item in everyone's system. [8]

Actually, I reckon looking for and then tweaking an old tube tuner would be a great bit of harmless fun.

[SilverSport]

I would agree with the classical FM...I hooked up my Father's EICO HF-92 Tuner with the HF-81 Integrated Amp...mind you this is MONO...sweeeeeeeeeeet sounds...didn't even try rock and roll...and I live in the Chicago area...good luck and enjoy!

Bill

[Al Klappenberger]

Guys,

For what it's worth, here's my experinece with FM tuners over the years:

1 - Dynaco FM1 with hime-made Scott clone multiplex adaptor - cleary a the bottom of the list:

2 - Marantz 10B - One of the best. Very good with weak stations but suseptable to car ignition noise.

3 -McIntosh MR71. Very nice in every respect and the finest interstation noise muting I have ever seen.

4 - McIntosh Mr78 (my presant unit) The best tuner I have had except for the reed-relay interstation muting. That stinks and I would rather hear the noise!

Al K.

[jt1stcav]

The local NPR station in Tampa is a very good station, with lots of great classical selections to enjoy (some of my latest classical purchases were made from music I first heard on our NPR station). Also love their new age and late night jazz selections as well. Once I have the tuner calibrated, I'll probably never change the station, except for when I'm in the mood for classic '70s rock!