joessportster Posted December 21, 2008 Author Share Posted December 21, 2008 thank you all for your thoughts and experience and the invite, i will keep it in mind Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boom3 Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 This is slightly off the beam...some years ago I got to hear Model 19s vs. LaScalas in an A/B set-up. The 19s walked all over the LaScalas in the bass department, but the midrange and treble of the LaScala was clearer. Both speakers were only a few years old, and it was in a large, hard room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cut-Throat Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 I don't doubt that at all. The 19's don't do it for me either. They are a two way and trying to force the highs out that horn doesn't work quite right. Then there is the woofer that is trying cover the lower mid range freqs, seems to me is smearing the midrange. I am not fond of the horn and driver in the 19's. I do like the 288-16K drivers and 1005B horn, and use this with my Khorn Bass Bin - But it still needs a tweeter IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djk Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 "At a 97 db rating, the VOTT will not play as loud as a LaScala even if you push 4 times as much power through it. (FACT)" Which VOTT product are you refering to? The A7-8G (last of the small VOTT) was 104.5dB http://www.lansingheritage.org/images/altec/catalogs/1989-pro/1989-12.jpg In the early 70s I owned BOTH the A7 and the Klipschorn at the same time, in the same room, same amplification, etc. The Klipschorn had better bass, the A7 had better midrange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie dave Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 DJK, don't try confusing anyone with the truth, now. FACT is there are multiple Altec drivers that are withing spitting distance of Klipsch ratings, but everything is statistics; ie lies, damn lies etc. Dang, there are seven speakers on that flyer that will meet or exceed 121 dB! I happen to like Klipsch better for indoor listening and Altec for outdoor work, but I listen at lower levels indoors than out. The Klipsch speakers sound more detailed and crystal sharp than the Altec two ways by design. Triceratops, the Magnificents are rare by virtue of low demand back in the day. The market for VOTTs was bands, institutions, and theaters - and few homeowners wanted 200 pound walnut behemoth speakers lurking in the living room. They are strictly gussied up VOTTs in lambs cloth. Altec marketing figured this out and threw the enclosure on a strict diet, hence the lineage for the Valencias, Flamencos,and Madrids. The only set of Magnificents I have heard in the last thirty years is a quad set at the Record Exchange in St. Louis, but they are up twelve feet high on shelves overlooking the record bins. The Magnifs will command any room they reside in, and will throw a sweet spot zone similar to the KHorns. Two years ago it would be reasonable to shell out $1500 to $3000 to get a clean set, but our baby depression has killed off most of US demand, and the Asian rim buyers that drove the above $2000 bids are running scared as well. Maybe you can get lucky and get the discout for having to move these out of the house. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 The Altec sounds lousy no matter what you drive it with. I would rather have a pair of Hereseys than VOTT. The Altecs don't even make good firewood - the paint stinks when burned. They will get pretty loud, but you wouldn't want to be listening when they did. The only speaker they would compare favorably with would be Bose 901s. It's not nice to bash a set of speakers with such detailed and helpful comments as "lousy" without actually having heard a pair of them (or perhaps just one pair).......... Carry on. Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twistedcrankcammer Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 "At a 97 db rating, the VOTT will not play as loud as a LaScala even if you push 4 times as much power through it. (FACT)" Which VOTT product are you refering to? The A7-8G (last of the small VOTT) was 104.5dB http://www.lansingheritage.org/images/altec/catalogs/1989-pro/1989-12.jpg In the early 70s I owned BOTH the A7 and the Klipschorn at the same time, in the same room, same amplification, etc. The Klipschorn had better bass, the A7 had better midrange. DJK, 97 db is the sensitivity rating printed on the A7-500 owners manual. You can go to the Altec Lansing site and print it out. The sensitivity was poor on the Model 19 as well if memory serves me correctly. Roger SPECIFICATIONS Frequency response ±10 dB 35 Hz to 22 kHz Low frequency roll-off -3 dB 54 Hz System power capacity Rating based on test signal of continuous pink noise, per IEC spectrum for two hours duration. 200 W Sensitivity 1 watt at 1 meter 97 dB Nominal impedance 8 ohms Crossover frequency 900 Hz Nominal coverage 90° horizontal, 40° vertical System polarity Positive voltage to RED produces forward cone motion Binding Posts Two pair. Jumpered for mono wiring. Bi-amp capable. Accepts either spades or bananas. Finish Black, abrasion resistant splatter Dimensions (W x D x H) 30 x 24 x 54 inches Net system weight 170 lbs DJK, I also found two sets of sensitivity specs on the VOTT that you mentioned, and the Model 19 as being 99 db sensitivity. It seems that Altec fudged numbers by using pink noise from 500 Hz to 3,000 Hz at 1 watt at 4 feet. This spread that 1 watt input over a smaller frequency spectrum where the VOTT was stronger and gave a rating of 102 db at 4 feet for the model 19, so it looks like Altec was using some non industry standard ratings on these speakers. Roger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twistedcrankcammer Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triceratops Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Triceratops, the Magnificents are rare by virtue of low demand back in the day. The market for VOTTs was bands, institutions, and theaters - and few homeowners wanted 200 pound walnut behemoth speakers lurking in the living room. They are strictly gussied up VOTTs in lambs cloth. Altec marketing figured this out and threw the enclosure on a strict diet, hence the lineage for the Valencias, Flamencos,and Madrids. The only set of Magnificents I have heard in the last thirty years is a quad set at the Record Exchange in St. Louis, but they are up twelve feet high on shelves overlooking the record bins. The Magnifs will command any room they reside in, and will throw a sweet spot zone similar to the KHorns... ...Maybe you can get lucky and get the discount for having to move these out of the house. :-) Dave, Thanks for your insight. I really think the midrange on the Altecs sounds great, even if the bass is not as strong as the Khorns. The Magnificents are owned by a friend of mine who already has Khorns and doesn't have the space for the Magnificents at home. We're working out a deal and he is helping me out by taking a few things in trade to lower my cash outlay and help me make some space to help win the approval of my remarkably tolerant wife. I'll post photos after we get it all worked out. triceratops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Twisted,,,, Your remarks are unkind and show your lack of character,,, Please refrain from your snide remarks to members of this forum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twistedcrankcammer Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Twisted,,,, Your remarks are unkind and show your lack of character,,, Please refrain from your snide remarks to members of this forum Maron, 1st He made two condescending remarks in two seperate posts first..... Where were you then??? 2nd Who made you hall monitor?? Roger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Twisted,,,, Your remarks are unkind and show your lack of character,,, Please refrain from your snide remarks to members of this forum Maron, 1st He made two condescending remarks in two seperate posts first..... Where were you then??? 2nd Who made you hall monitor?? Roger We appointed Maron hall monitor. He's earned it. Also, its not nice to say someone is "callous." Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twistedcrankcammer Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Twisted,,,, Your remarks are unkind and show your lack of character,,, Please refrain from your snide remarks to members of this forum Maron, 1st He made two condescending remarks in two seperate posts first..... Where were you then??? 2nd Who made you hall monitor?? Roger We appointed Maron hall monitor. He's earned it. Also, its not nice to say someone is "callous." Carl. Carl, Maron is just being petty because he said the VOTT was no longer in production and it has been remanufactured since 2003, and he didn't like being corrected. It has nothing to do with my other conversation except that they like you have been arround the forum alot longer and may be buds. I don't care. If you have facts to debate, hey, I love a good argument, but when you don't know enough to prove a point and have to say well they have just sold that for 5 years to protect the name, or I have done sound at a 1,200 person event, and compare PA versions of the VOT with home versions when Joe orriginally asked about for home use and it has no bearing on the orriginal conversation other then to be a spin Dr and try to hide that you can't effectively argue your point. I mean come on..,. "You may want to check your sanity" Someone else posts a legitamet add with ratings and asks a legitimet question as to where I got my rating number, and the guy jumps back in with "You don't need the truth when you have facts" How am I supposed to respect that kind of limited intellect. i didn't ask anybody to like me, just have something intelligent to say to prove your point!! I know that may be greedy of me, but that is just the way I am!! Roger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Twested,,, To keep the record straight,,,Now your calling me petty,,????? to keep the record straight Altec is officially dead,,, That so called ad from 2006 for the $5,900 VOT was to try to keep the copyright to the Altec name,,,The co. making small computer speakers and useing the Altec name has take,n its last breath...You need to calm down,, take your meds,,, No body here is trying argue with you,,, Its an honest debate,,,So please lighten up,, and enjoy the different views... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 A small group of exemployers of Altec,,,Are making the drivers and woofers very close to the Altec tradition..GREAT PLAINS AUDIO,,,although they do not use the Altec name,,,Tooling was bought from the origional co. The products are almost identicle. LTV and Telex did every thing possible to kill the company,,, But some ex employers kept a small cottege site open and made a go at making parts to some of the products,,,IRATE AUDIO,, MICRO MIKE LABS,, Great Plains Audio,,, Check out the Unofficial ALTEC site headed by TODD WHITE It has a great Forum Site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie dave Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Another great site is www.audioheritage.org. Klipsch, Altec and JBL comprise the three great historical players on the American speaker scene since WWII. Twisted, I have no need to argue with you. I have responded to the OP and an ancillary question in adequate depth, and have taken my little one out Christmas shopping and playing with his friends for the rest of the day. DJK is a wealth of information. Digest the message, don't shoot the messenger. As you continue to hone away at you axe, I question what your aim is. Your contention that Altec don't get loud has been shot down. 100+ dB sensitivity, 100 watts continuous program capability, and 121 dB max output all correspond to similar "loudness" levels you crave, so try plugging your debate bucket. It has a number of holes in it. It is fine if you don't like Altec speakers, but don't try to base a debate on a single data point that is plucked from a 50 odd year production run and then spit raspberries. There are enough folks on this forum who either own Altecs or use their drivers in modded Klipsch setups to immediately recognize the fallacy you present. Have a great holiday season! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blvdre Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 IMO, the GPA 902 HF driver does have adequate high-end (to address someone's assertion the the contrary). I did need to apply some EQ via my passives, and the result was a very sweet, detailed high-end that bested my k-55, k-77 combo. I thought the 902/511 was thin sounding down low, much improved with a tractrix horn. I still like the weight of the k-55 down low, tonal balance sounds more right. I have a pair of JBL 2470's on deck to try next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WMcD Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 And now, we return to our original program . . . Here http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/p/88905/898769.aspx#898769 I had posted the AES paper by PWK on the LS. He compares it to a theater unit. Of course we don't know whether it is VOTT. But it would make sense. This is not quite an answer to how the K-Horn compares but you can see some data in there which comes close . . . in curves. Wm McD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cut-Throat Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 . I thought the 902/511 was thin sounding down low, much improved with a tractrix horn. I agree - I don't think that much of this driver horn combo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blvdre Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 . I thought the 902/511 was thin sounding down low, much improved with a tractrix horn. I agree - I don't think that much of this driver horn combo! Thanks for the confirmation. Makes me think I'm not as crazy as I think I am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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