Guest " " Posted December 27, 2008 Share Posted December 27, 2008 A good old crossover argument.......hasn't been one for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted December 27, 2008 Share Posted December 27, 2008 This is great... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 Bruce, some of us who own Jubilees are out of the loop too. I don't hear a thing about improvements. For the 2 cents it's worth, I thought (and still do) that you had Roy's correct passive design for when using the K69. He now has one out for use with the TAD driver and I think Mike has tweeked his a bit (the version you have), adding a zobel thing onto his (I do not understand what a zobel does) The real tweeks comes as Dean suggested, with those who are using the Dx38 as we can choose to add a PEQ at 32 hz or not. He also came out with what I think was, a steeper sloped design (on the Dx) by adding something or another into it. Again, that stuff is a bit past me. Point being... on the passive side I'm not so sure Roy has come out with anything more than a Version 1 with the addition of Mikes zobel so we'll call that version 1.5. On the active route, he came out with version 1, then the steeper sloped version 2, then added the 32 hz peq... Maybe someone will correct me if I'm wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 This is great... Will these animated gif's work here? (gonna try!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 Dont bring a sword to a gun fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebse2a3 Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 For the 2 cents it's worth, I thought (and still do) that you had Roy's correct passive design for when using the K69. He now has one out for use with the TAD driver and I think Mike has tweeked his a bit (the version you have), adding a zobel thing onto his (I do not understand what a zobel does) Richard the Zobels Network (I only did the design for the K402/K69A along with the active crossover setup in mind) I did was designed by Roy and I built because of a conversation I had with Roy about since many Jubilee Owners are using Tube amplifiers of which especially single ended types having a high internal impedance(low damping) the frequency response of the system is altered somewhat by the changing impedance of the driver/horn relative to the same horn/driver driven by a solid state amplifier which very often has a low impedance(high damping) and will maintain a tighter frequency response variation. To sum up basically I was looking to eliminate one variable as much as possible between a Tube amplifier driven K402/K69A versus the Solid State amplifier driven K402/69A. What I observed from that experiment was that the Zobel lead to a correction of the frequency response by 1db to 2db in certain parts of the frequency response and this had a subtle but audible effect. I in the end felt that the Zobel gave me the best and most accurate tonal balance but at the same time I also realized that someone using a Tube Amplifier might prefer either with or without the Zobel network due to other system/room variables. One other thing to be aware of is a Zobel Network such as this can tax a small wattage single ended tube amplifier due to a decrease in impedance presented to the amplifier. In my case it worked fine but if someone is already using most of the available power(say due to a large room) from their SE Amplifier then it's probably best to not use the zobel network. Roy also as a request/experiment designed a zobel to be used with the passive crossover version used with the K69A/K402 as well as with the passive crossover designed for the TAD-4002/K402 which rigma has built both versions. The issue with this version is again if one is using small wattage SE Amplifier designs available power can become an issue and the preference might be not to use them for this reason. The real tweeks comes as Dean suggested, with those who are using the Dx38 as we can choose to add a PEQ at 32 hz or not. He also came out with what I think was, a steeper sloped design (on the Dx) by adding something or another into it. Again, that stuff is a bit past me. This is an awesome tweek which I enjoy very much when listening to many recordings. If I remember correctly I believe he was able to acheive 114db at 32Hz with 1 percent distortion (of course the results will be some what dependent on the room response as it would be with any sub woofer also). Point being... on the passive side I'm not so sure Roy has come out with anything more than a Version 1 with the addition of Mikes zobel so we'll call that version 1.5. On the active route, he came out with version 1, then the steeper sloped version 2, then added the 32 hz peq... Maybe someone will correct me if I'm wrong. I personelly hope Roy (especially in rememberance of PWK and his unending work with the Klipschorn and finally the Jubilee LF Horn) never runs out of ideas to push the envelope with the Jubilee whether it means Advanced Driver Designs, HF Horns and etc.....! and that he lets us continue to join him in this pursuit of perfection even though we all know we will never get there the journey itself makes this all worthwhile for me! mike tn[] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blvdre Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 I can walk down a street and notice some people dont look finished,, should have stayed in the incubater a couple of days more,,, That statement speaks volumes about your character, Maron. You have my sympathy whether you want it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 Dont bring a sword to a gun fight. Or an under done speaker to the market place... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 That statement speaks volumes about your character, Maron. You have my sympathy whether you want it or not. Your comment reminds me of something I once read. I'll butcher the story from my memory of it but you'll get the gist. A guy buys a new home and is standing at the fence, talking to his (new) older neighbor. The neighbor asks 'what was it like where you used to live' to which the new neighbor responded "Everyone was nosey, meddling in my business, they were rude, didn't know how to drive, had no mannors, didn't keep their lawns manicured and had smelly dogs" Then this new guy asks the older neighbor..."What are people like around here?" to which the old neighbor responded "I suppose you'll find people here about the same" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 BLVDRE... Didnt we have a president like that ???? There is a book called Hot Spots,,,Giving a study as to our reactions,,As you walk down the street,,Some people will react to visual clues,, weather some one seems a Threat or if the person coming toward you is friendly. Even the pattern of a beard or eyebrows could set off warnings,,, Next time at a restraunt,, Look closely and you will see when some one is eating and putting food in there mouth they will raise there eyes,,, its a defensive reaction to protect there food.. I can tell by your comment you have a passive agressive trait. You have my sympathy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie dave Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 It is nice to see the Jubilee Protection Society(JuPS for short) finally ride to the rescue. It is obvious to me that Klipsch has assigned flaship status bearer to the Palladium, and not the Jubilee. The management, and company owner's answer to the "What is Klipsch's BEST speaker?" question would be a resounding Palladium. The Jubilee is not even an authorized Klipsch speaker, and it is not produced by Klipsch for consumer use. ANY "Jubilee" speaker purchased outside of commercial sound suppliers that are authorized Klipsch contractors have been bad boys, per Amy and others at Klipsch. Maron has been iced in for a week now, and his boredom is showing. You hypersensitive Jubilee owners need to chill out and learn to laugh at yourselves a little bit...it is too easy to lampoon the situation, even without your capable assistance at every turn. And for those of you who don't look at people, there is a reason why most zombie movies hire actors from the hill country areas of Appalachia and the Ozarks - and it ain't because everyone is a beauty queen.[:S] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 Yes the JuPS has,nt figured out when some one is pulling there leg... Its been fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjnif Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 You know what I like about this forum??........The Moderators don't Rush in to delete the flaming!! Its good that everyone cna dish it out and take it too!! On other forums everyone must be pollitically correct.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blvdre Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 BLVDRE... Didnt we have a president like that ???? There is a book called Hot Spots,,,Giving a study as to our reactions,,As you walk down the street,,Some people will react to visual clues,, weather some one seems a Threat or if the person coming toward you is friendly. Even the pattern of a beard or eyebrows could set off warnings,,, Next time at a restraunt,, Look closely and you will see when some one is eating and putting food in there mouth they will raise there eyes,,, its a defensive reaction to protect there food.. I can tell by your comment you have a passive agressive trait. You have my sympathy. Maron, your original post had nothing to do with visual cues. It was about marginalization of those who you perceive as either unfit or deficient. At least that's how it read (sometimes statements don't translate so well in print). There are several reasons why people engage in this type of behavior (admittedly, sometimes as a coping mechanism out of necessity), none of them ultimately being healthy. Sorry for going way off topic, I just had to respond to that. I'm done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebse2a3 Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 Dont bring a sword to a gun fight. Or an under done speaker to the market place... When has any great speaker been done? Klipschorn is over 60 years old and still gets improved in it's existing form as well as evolved into the Jubilee LF! Name one good speaker manufacturer of speakers that doesn't improve designs/models they are dedicated to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebse2a3 Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 It is nice to see the Jubilee Protection Society(JuPS for short) finally ride to the rescue. Yep! Wherever you see Maron then sheltie dave isn't far behind! Blah....Blah.....Blah Maron has been iced in for a week now, and his boredom is showing. You hypersensitive Jubilee owners need to chill out and learn to laugh at yourselves a little bit...it is too easy to lampoon the situation, even without your capable assistance at every turn. So when Maron gets bored does he call you up and say lets talk trash and spread untruths about the Jubilee on the Forum until we get all those Jub owners defending it against our crap! And for those of you who don't look at people, there is a reason why most zombie movies hire actors from the hill country areas of Appalachia and the Ozarks - and it ain't because everyone is a beauty queen Yep! One good way to measure a man's character is how he thinks about and treats other people! You've said a mouthfull here sheltie dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebse2a3 Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 Yes the JuPS has,nt figured out when some one is pulling there leg... Its been fun. Yea! A real sick form of fun Maron. Like someone else posted I feel real sorry for you if this is how you get pleasure out of life! mike tn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebse2a3 Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 Jubilee Protection Society(JuPS for short) Actually I prefer the Jubilee "Rogue" Underground Society(JUBS-R-US) mike tn[] Main Entry: 3rogue Function: adjective Date: 1872 1 : resembling or suggesting a rogue elephant especially in being isolated, aberrant, dangerous, or uncontrollable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 The Jubilee is not even an authorized Klipsch speaker, and it is not produced by Klipsch for consumer use. ANY "Jubilee" speaker purchased outside of commercial sound suppliers that are authorized Klipsch contractors have been bad boys, per Amy and others at Klipsch Perhaps you could name a single Jubilee purchase that was made outside of an authorized Klipsch cinema dealer? Just one, ok? It's not too high of a standard for you to meet given your implication above is it? My only restriction on you is, it must be a new purchase and not someone buying something on the used market like the guy who bought Dean's or the other guy who bought some from someplace that was going out of business (a theater I think). Since we'll wait for he!! to freeze over for your list of none, maybe you could expand further on these conversations you've had with Amy "and others at Klipsch" where you've discussed this mythical crowd making Jubilee purchases from unauthorized Klipsch dealers....especially, since there haven't been any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted December 28, 2008 Share Posted December 28, 2008 The Jubilee is not even an authorized Klipsch speaker, and it is not produced by Klipsch for consumer use. ANY "Jubilee" speaker purchased outside of commercial sound suppliers that are authorized Klipsch contractors have been bad boys, per Amy and others at Klipsch. Hmmm... there is one owner on here who uses a set for his club. I would think those are authorized, even if made with marine grade plywood. I think quite a few pair were purchased through the commercial sound suppliers. Just who are the bad boys? Are you taking Amy's statements out of context, per chance? I'm sure Klipsch just hates it when they sell another pair of $7000 speakers. I've heard a lot of people on here say they heard different Heritage models, the Khorn Jubilee, ReferenceSeries, etc., and said they couldn't afford them, so they bought others in the lineup that still gave them great sound for the money. They all help sell the product. I work with two different people who have bought Klipsch products for their homes after hearing my LaScalas. One of them then ordered Klipsch ceiling speakers for use in some of our classrooms. It works better than an ad campaign... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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