jjennings2510 Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 Hello all. I'm glad to say that I have truly gotten into home theater. I'm currently upgrading my system to Klipsch Reference speakers. Bookshelf speakers for the living room and floor-standers for the big media room up front. I'm debating between the RF-7 and RF-83s (even though they are discontinued) But before I get into my dilemma I have to say I love Klipsch speakers. I used to work at Best Buy back in 2003-06. So I used to hear the explosions coming from the speaker room but I never ventured to the speaker room. Mainly because I thought all systems were the same and I was satisfied with a Home Theater in a Box [] Well one night we had an employee movie night at the store and the manager whipped out a Klipsch set for the movie. 4 F-3s, a C-3, and a Sub 12. The movie we watched was Van Helsing. I had went to the movies to see it and I knew the great soundtrack the movie had for special effects etc. Well I have to say when he cranked the system up I thought I was back at the movies. And this was with the Synergy line! That night made me a Klipsch convert. When I checked the prices I couldn't believe one speaker cost the same amount (or more) as a full HTiB! With me being a college student at the time and still living at home (my parents would not have let that fly. they already hated my 2.1 "gaming" computer speakers that pulled double duty as my tv speakers) so I put my dream on hold, lol. Fast forward a few years after I moved out and I settled for a HTiB. Fast forward another year and I found a great deal on a Sub-10. And thats when it started. A few months later I ended up replacing my fronts with Sony, Center with Polk, Receiver with Onkyo TX-Sr507, and I went ahead and got a brand new Sub-10 for my room and put the used one up front. Well my parents found a great deal on a Reference RF-62 home theater set. They got a receiver (Onkyo TX-SR608) and called me to hook it all up. After a few hours of running wires and setting up the receiver I popped in Avatar. Well I have to say the Sub 10 made a huge difference along with the Onkyo in my room.....but after hearing the Reference line on Avatar I had the same feeling I had in Best Buy that night. Fell in love all over again and I had to get the Reference line. So thats where I sit now but I have a few questions. 1. I have already ordered the RB-61 IIs for my fronts. I know people say I should get what I can afford but I want to know. Will the RC-62 II really make that much of a difference over the RC-52 II? The bookshelf is in a bedroom. A little smaller than average (sorry don't know the measurements) I do plan on moving to another house soon (renting right now) but even when I move the "man cave" is going to get this system and I doubt the room will be too much bigger than the one I have now. So can I save the money or should I go ahead and get what I can afford which is the RC-62 II? 2. Same question for the surrounds. Should I just go with the RS-42 II and go with what I can afford, the RS-52 II? Will there be that much of a difference? 3. Will the Sub-10 be sufficient for the Reference line? I should I go ahead and upgrade it too? 4. I have the TX-SR507 but I am going to get the TX-NR808 after I get all of my speakers. Its rated at 135w per channel. I know that's only 2 channels driven so with the RB-61 II being rated at 100 watts will the receiver put out enough power with all channels driven to have the speakers sound good or should I get a separate amp for cleaner sound? 5. When I start piecing together the front should I overspend on one of the Pioneer Elite receivers which are all rated as all channels driven or should I just step back a little to a cheaper model and just get a separate amp? As I stated earlier I plan on getting floor-standers. Preferebly the RF-7 II or RF-83....I may even just settle for the RF-82. 6. Are the rumors on certain receivers being bright true? My Rb-61s just shipped today so I haven't heard what people are talking about. How does a "warm" receiver sound? Is Denon a warm receiver? I'm debating between Denon and Pioneer Elite for the front. Honestly I didn't hear the overly bright sound at my parent's house when I played Avatar. The movie sounded great. But then again I was only listened to them for the course of the movie. So will it seem to bright if I listen to them all day? (Of course everything is routed through the receiver. My cable, blu ray, etc. and I rarely watch tv during the week but I watch tv all day on the weekends) I don't want ear fatigue because I have a bright receiver which leads me to my final question. 7. I may sound stupid on this but I'm not an audiophile yet and I'm still young (26, not THAT young but young lol) so I haven't had alot of experience listening to alot speakers but what the heck does ear fatigue feel like? Do your ears hurt? Do they ring? Because thats another term I have heard Klipsch haters use. They say Klipsch speakers are very fatiguing to the ear so you can't listen for long periods of time..... Sorry if I sound stupid but this great hobby has a firm hold on me so I'm determined to have the man cave have amazing sound in case the front TV is taken by the fiance or guests but I want the front to be the ultimate movie spot for me. So it has to be perfect. Right equipment matching etc. lol. So any advice is greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help Jamar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 If you can swing a separate amp, do it and get a good one. This way you need only swap out pre/pros to keep up with changing technology. A good amp is basically timeless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 If you can swing a separate amp, do it and get a good one. This way you need only swap out pre/pros to keep up with changing technology. A good amp is basically timeless. Well put. [Y] Separate's are the way to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 1/2.Will it make a difference? Yes. Will it be a huge difference? Well that depends on your ears, your room, and what you demand from the speakers.Keep in mind that the crossover to your subwoofer is not a brick wall. If you cross over to your subwoofer at 80Hz, and you're pushing 120dB of volume, you might want a heftier center and surrounds versus crossing over at 80Hz or 100Hz and 100dB of volume. In the former situation, you'd probably want something that was reasonably flat an octave below the crossover point for "optimal" sound. In the latter situation, obviously you could get away with less and probably not notice. 3. Again, it depends on your ears, your room, and what you demand from your system. If you're perfectly happy with the Sub-10's performance, you don't need to upgrade because I think you should. If you feel that you'd like more and tighter, cleaner bass, then by all means, upgrade. 4/5. Separates will generally tend to be better than the best receivers. And as others mention, it will cost less over the years as an amplifier doesn't ever really need to be upgraded once you have a good one. 6. That's a yes and no question. Most receivers will tend to measure fairly flat across the audible spectrum, at least into a base 8 ohm load. The problems start because speakers are of course, not simple 8 ohm loads. Higher quality receivers and amplifiers will be robust enough to drive complex loads such as a speaker without significant distortion. That $150 value Sony receiver on the shelf at Best Buy...not so much. That's where "brightness" and "fatigue" tend to come into play. 7. Can't say I've ever really had ear fatigue to be honest and I've listened to some pretty chintzy car speakers at high volumes for long periods of time... Some people claim their ears bleed though! Sounds pretty bad [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjennings2510 Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 Lol yes the ear bleeding does sound pretty bad. But thanks for your input. I definitely know better than to drive my Klipsch with a cheap Sony Receiver or any other $150 one. That means my speakers will be like 3 times the cost of the receiver, lol. I have to admit thats one thing I never understood but thats another discussion. But basically any good quality receiver should sound good with these speakers. Also I think imma go with the heftier center but smaller surrounds. Because I do play my stuff loud but with my low sensitivity Sony's that I have right now I rarely go past "48" on my reciever bc it gets too loud since my room is so small. I may eventually upgrade for the tighter Sub but I'm satisfied right now. I'm still impatiently waiting for my RB-61 IIs. UPS rescheduled the delivery date for whatever reason and now the tracking info says they will be delivered Tuesday. Which sucks because they were orginally scheduled for Friday.....and then Monday....Monday was perfect because I'm off Sunday and Monday but of course as luck goes I'll have to sit through a full day of work before I get to set them up. But I looked into separates and setting them up is actually easier than I thought. And a little cheaper. Especially Emotiva. I may get 3 monoblock amps from them once I get my speakers from the front. In my bedroom I have to stick with a receiver because I don't have any space. The added height of the 808 vs the 507 is already going to be a tight squeeze. But I'm blabbing again. I'm just excited to be building up my Klipsch Home Theater system. Now I know this is off subject but have any of you heard the Klipsch Heritage Line? They're really expensive but I always hear high praises for them especially the Klipschorns. I don't have any dealers near me that sell Heritage unfortunately. They just sell Synergy and Reference lines. Again thanks for your input! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjennings2510 Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 If you can swing a separate amp, do it and get a good one. This way you need only swap out pre/pros to keep up with changing technology. A good amp is basically timeless. Thanks for your input. I will most likely end up going this route for my room up front. In the bedroom I may even see if there's anyway for me to squeeze an amp back there too but I doubt it as space is limited. I've looked at Emotiva, Denon, Sherwood, and Marantz. Anyone better than the others? Emotiva is the cheapest and pretty much has great reviews on all of their equipment. I know McIntosh is good but they are sorta out of my price range. Well not sorta.....they are out of my price range, lol. Because I still have to get a Samsung TV, theater seating etc. But I don't wanna get something cheap and have it ruin the sound of my system....ahhhh too many choices and questions for a noob LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boxx Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 If you can swing a separate amp, do it and get a good one. This way you need only swap out pre/pros to keep up with changing technology. A good amp is basically timeless.Agreed... This is the best route to go... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elitedemo Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 theres a few things you could skimp on to make others better, buying used is always a great idea as you can plan on getting a 2x better system for the same cost as a lesser new one, the center always go with the best you can, id get a cheaper receiver with preouts and then just get a xpa-5 from emotiva as you mentioned them or find some marantz ma500s, either option will power the klipsch speakers above and beyond a highgrade receiver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 I had great success with a Marantz SR7001 receiver and am thoroughly enjoying my separates that replaced it. Like was mentioned, a good system of separates lets you build something that's very easy to upgrade and change. Pick a capable 5+ channel amp and you'll probably have it around longer than any component you'll ever own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 10, 2010 Share Posted September 10, 2010 But I'm blabbing again. I'm just excited to be building up my Klipsch Home Theater system. That's what it's all about! Well that and actually listening to the system [] Now I know this is off subject but have any of you heard the Klipsch Heritage Line? They're really expensive but I always hear high praises for them especially the Klipschorns. I don't have any dealers near me that sell Heritage unfortunately. Can't say that I have, although it's definitely on my to-do list. Closest dealer to me that sells Heritage equipment is 70 miles away, which is rather curious given that I live in one of the major metroplexes of the country. I guess Chambersburg, PA is a much more happening place for hi-fi than Washington, DC... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted September 10, 2010 Moderators Share Posted September 10, 2010 Now I know this is off subject but have any of you heard the Klipsch Heritage Line? They're really expensive but I always hear high praises for them especially the Klipschorns. I don't have any dealers near me that sell Heritage unfortunately. They just sell Synergy and Reference lines. Again thanks for your input! Yes many here have Heritage models and they have been around long enough to be called Heritage for a reason. [Y] There hard to beat. IMO There is nothing wrong with the RF or Synergy line at all, either line set up properly will make you smile, guaranteed. Take your time and put this setup together right the first time, it will save you money in the long run even if it takes you longer. And Welcome to the forum, use it to get answers because there is a ton of experience here which will help you save money from making mistakes, I sure do, I can't afford to spend money on junk only to replace it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted September 10, 2010 Share Posted September 10, 2010 have any of you heard the Klipsch Heritage Line? Just them old fogies who are throwbacks to the old ways of doing things. They're kinda like the Heritage line themselves.... been around for a while.... might have some improvment tweeks done on themselves....might have spent some time in their life stuffed into a corner. If you fill your profile and post your location, perhaps one of them will be near enough to allow you to hear things for yourself. Welcome to the forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted September 10, 2010 Moderators Share Posted September 10, 2010 If you fill your profile and post your location, perhaps one of them will be near enough to allow you to hear things for yourself. Thats a good idea for an old guy ! [Y] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjennings2510 Posted September 11, 2010 Author Share Posted September 11, 2010 theres a few things you could skimp on to make others better, buying used is always a great idea as you can plan on getting a 2x better system for the same cost as a lesser new one, the center always go with the best you can, id get a cheaper receiver with preouts and then just get a xpa-5 from emotiva as you mentioned them or find some marantz ma500s, either option will power the klipsch speakers above and beyond a highgrade receiver Yes I had thought about going used on some of the stuff. Most likely it would probably be the amp if I could find a great deal on it. But its hard to beat Emotiva prices. But if I find a good McIntosh or some other high dollar brand at a great price then I'll jump. Because call me a dork but there's nothing like opening the box for a set of speakers or a tv, lol. I checked eBay but some of the used stuff is as much as the new stuff or its only like $200 cheaper. I'm a big ebay shopper though so I'll keep checking. Whenever I see a great deal I usually can't pass it up. I'm bidding on a set of RB-51 speakers as I type. If I can get them cheap enough I may relegate them to surround duty in my bedroom to see if I like it. I have a really small set of surrounds right now and they're alright but I really want to try the Klipsch surrounds with wide dispersion......but if I get a deal on the 51s I can hold off a little longer and go ahead and buy the center, I don't know which to buy first. The surrounds or the center speaker because they are both around the same price. I already have a huge Polk center that matched pretty well with my Sony's but I doubt its going to match with the Klipsch with the horns.....I'll find out tuesday night. I'm really tempted to buy a pre and pro for the bedroom now so that I can go ahead and get a preview of what to expect up front. It just sucks because the entertainment centers just don't seem like they're built to hold alot. My center speaker takes up most of the second shelf. Its flanked on both sides by a PS3 on one side and a SA 8300 HD/DVR and Tivo on the other. (I like being able to record 4 things at once. 2 on the Tivo, 2 on the cable DVR. It seems like everything comes on Mondays....plus I need my OnDemand. Once they get this 2 way CableCard thing going I'll probably drop the cable dvr) On the bottom shelf I have a blu ray player, xbox 360 and of course my Onkyo. Now I know I can put the Amp where the Onkyo is but I don't have anywhere to put the Pre/Pro.....oh well patience. We're saving for a house so hopefully soon I'll be able to go look at some houses and piece together in my mind how everything will be setup. Thats why I'm trying to go ahead and get my 2 systems setup that way when we move all I have to do is transfer the stuff over. LOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjennings2510 Posted September 11, 2010 Author Share Posted September 11, 2010 I had great success with a Marantz SR7001 receiver and am thoroughly enjoying my separates that replaced it. Like was mentioned, a good system of separates lets you build something that's very easy to upgrade and change. Pick a capable 5+ channel amp and you'll probably have it around longer than any component you'll ever own. Yeah I felt stupid once I saw the point that you guys are making. It makes sense. Instead of spending $1500 on a really good receiver that saids it can push 140w per channel every few years just get some separates. Because believe it or not I hadn't even thought about upgradability for future standards. I was just thinking about the sound. But $500 for a new pre/pro sounds a whole lot better than $1500 and at least I won't have to go through the one step I dread. Getting behind the unit to hook up all of those speakers.....at least all I would have to worry about would be the video cables and most of my stuff is HDMI now with a couple of exceptions for component.....Separates definitely sounds like a winner. I'm glad you guys talked me into it because as I stated earlier I was a little intimidated because of course the reputation is separates are hard to setup etc. Which is crazy bc I love electronics and computers (went to school for computer engineering) and like breaking stuff down etc but it was just a "known" fact that separates were meant for "audiophiles who knew what they were doing and won't settle for anything less and drink wine after every meal while smoking a cigar" LOL. I'm so happy you guys are down to earth. Even though you all have multi thousand dollar systems you're not snobby. Now me on the other hand once I get my system built I will be the snobby guy! haha just kidding! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjennings2510 Posted September 11, 2010 Author Share Posted September 11, 2010 But I'm blabbing again. I'm just excited to be building up my Klipsch Home Theater system. That's what it's all about! Well that and actually listening to the system Now I know this is off subject but have any of you heard the Klipsch Heritage Line? They're really expensive but I always hear high praises for them especially the Klipschorns. I don't have any dealers near me that sell Heritage unfortunately. Can't say that I have, although it's definitely on my to-do list. Closest dealer to me that sells Heritage equipment is 70 miles away, which is rather curious given that I live in one of the major metroplexes of the country. I guess Chambersburg, PA is a much more happening place for hi-fi than Washington, DC... Same here. It seems Arkansas is more happening than Memphis. We have one Klipsch dealer here (2 if you want to count the Magnolia store inside of best buy that sells "Higher End" stuff.) The other ones are in Arkansas but according to the Klipsch site none of them have Heritage speakers. Just Reference. I'm thinking about going to the dealer here though to see if they have the new RF-7s set up. I want to hear them. I'm willing to make a blind purchase on a $500 set of bookshelf speakers bc I love Klipsch so much but a $3000 purchase is a different story, LOL. Not to mention those things are beasts to move. I definitely don't want to switch out floorstanders too many times. Well preferably not at all.....not until I want to upgrade but I doubt the boss of the house would allow that. She already passed out once when she saw the price of the Sub and passed out again when she saw the price of the RB-61 IIs......she may not wake up when she sees the price of the RF-7 IIs......or the 83s.....the 83s are a little bit better tho since they're "old" now.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjennings2510 Posted September 11, 2010 Author Share Posted September 11, 2010 Now I know this is off subject but have any of you heard the Klipsch Heritage Line? They're really expensive but I always hear high praises for them especially the Klipschorns. I don't have any dealers near me that sell Heritage unfortunately. They just sell Synergy and Reference lines. Again thanks for your input! Yes many here have Heritage models and they have been around long enough to be called Heritage for a reason. There hard to beat. IMO There is nothing wrong with the RF or Synergy line at all, either line set up properly will make you smile, guaranteed. Take your time and put this setup together right the first time, it will save you money in the long run even if it takes you longer. And Welcome to the forum, use it to get answers because there is a ton of experience here which will help you save money from making mistakes, I sure do, I can't afford to spend money on junk only to replace it. Thanks for the welcome.....and yes I definitely know those lines can make you smile. Synergy converted me to Klipsch.....the Reference line made me want to upgrade before I had purchased anything (other than the sub) so thats why I'm curious and would like to hear the Reference line because I just don't see how it can get any better than Reference but it does so I have to hear it. Bc if it sounds too good I may have to swing a pair of Klipschorns from the Klipsch website in a few years (at which time the boss would probably divorce me unless I bribed her with a diamond or something, LOL) But yes I have read many stories on this forum about members getting that upgrade bug and spending money on new equipment a few months later or as you said just not liking it. Thats why I'm doing alot of research and basically not trying to skimp on anything. I'm kicking myself for wasting money on my Sony bookshelf speakers. Only 2 months old and already being replaced. I should've just waited and went with Klipsch but I was anxious. You know how that goes. Was tired of the tiny HTiB sound so I upgraded....now I want that true Theater sound in my room.....but like any hobby this hobby is expensive so I can't complain. All my hobbies are killing me though. Gaming at $60 a pop for games not to mention new add ons etc, then R/C Helicopter flying can get expensive spending $200 for a good heli not to mention the parts you replace when you crash it or wear something out......And lets not get started on the car, lol. Are there any cheap hobbies? Maybe I'll start knitting......after I get my system built up of course, LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjennings2510 Posted September 11, 2010 Author Share Posted September 11, 2010 have any of you heard the Klipsch Heritage Line? Just them old fogies who are throwbacks to the old ways of doing things. They're kinda like the Heritage line themselves.... been around for a while.... might have some improvment tweeks done on themselves....might have spent some time in their life stuffed into a corner. If you fill your profile and post your location, perhaps one of them will be near enough to allow you to hear things for yourself. Welcome to the forum. LOL advice noted. I filled in my location. I will eventually fill in my bio etc. I'm always slow to do that. Even when I joined Myspace it took me like a month to fill in the info. But Myspace is sooooo 2004. I'm on Facebook now, lol. But maybe someone is close enough to me. I know on the AVS forums they have alot of meet and greets where people show off their home theaters but none of them are ever close to me [:'(] so I don't know. I may never get to hear someone's "perfect" home theater with separates and the whole nine yards. Thanks for the welcome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aab3rd Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 Here is another option that you may want to consider: Get a decent receiver and a three channel power amp to run the front speakers. The reason why I say this is that you can use the receiver to handle the rear speakers where the loads are not as large and your receiver is not trying to handle all five channels. The reason why I suggest this is that receivers can still be used a pre/pros as long as they have chanel outputs. Also, you will find that new features usually lag behind on pre/pros as apposed to their receiver counterparts. Just my $.02 BTW, welcome to the forum from a fellow West Tennesseer. [Y] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjennings2510 Posted September 16, 2010 Author Share Posted September 16, 2010 Here is another option that you may want to consider: Get a decent receiver and a three channel power amp to run the front speakers. The reason why I say this is that you can use the receiver to handle the rear speakers where the loads are not as large and your receiver is not trying to handle all five channels. The reason why I suggest this is that receivers can still be used a pre/pros as long as they have chanel outputs. Also, you will find that new features usually lag behind on pre/pros as apposed to their receiver counterparts. Just my $.02 BTW, welcome to the forum from a fellow West Tennesseer. Yes believe it or not I had thought about that. If I go that route I've already decided on a receiver. The Denon 3311ci.....it has full 7.2 preouts plus the usual 3d etc......and it comes with Audessey which is my fav auto setup system. The price difference between the receiver and a "good" pre/pro is minimal. Still don't have a pre/pro picked out yet. But I've got time. Have to setup one room at a time. And thanks! Its good to see another person in TN.....and its even better b/c you're right down the road from me. Its a 20 min ride down US 64 for me. I don't see too many Klipsch owners in TN....Now CA is a different story. I can't find any deals on Craigslist for TN, lol. Or even AR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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