Vintage Tube Amp Restoration Walk Through

[Deang]

I had pointed out their history in an earlier post and have modified my last post (removed last comment).

I thought a hermetically sealed capacitor was considered "protected", while the ubiquitous axial wound types were considered "unprotected".

Edited May 1, 2015 by Crankysoldermeister

[Thaddeus Smith]

[AEA Audio]

First of all, we would like to thank everyone who chimed in on this subject for their interest. These subjects are all things that interest us also. And we certainly agree with people approaching things they may not be familiar with by using a heavy dose of critical analysis and healthy skepticism. Our hope is that the information we provided will be useful, and we will try to answer anyone’s questions if we can.

 

Contrary to what almost everyone feels when they first hear about immersion cleaning, or using soap and water to clean electronics, this is an old and tried-and-true method of restoration for vintage tube electronics, especially tube gear. It has been used for years by many. One of the best YouTube tutorials about this was done by Bob Sumption. Bob shows how to wash, rinse and bake the chassis of an old Heathkit tube radio, but the same technique can be used on all old tube gear. Buy the way, Bob worked as an engineer for Heathkit, designing tube ham radio gear before he retired. We strongly recommend the techniques Bob demonstrates for restoring old tube amps: 

 

 

What we have done is experiment with adding ultrasonic methods to improve this process. We have used the more traditional soap and water hand scrubbing method on all kinds of vintage tube gear for many years on our own vintage equipment, long before starting a vintage tube amp restoration service. After using this new ultrasonic method with a large number of amps, and seeing its benefits, we decided to share it on this forum in hopes readers would find it useful. We found that using ultrasonic cleaning, with tarnish removing cleaners added to the water, results in an almost miraculous transformation. It’s not only restoring the shine on what you can see, it’s that the tarnish is removed from places that were not possible before, including all the connectors, sockets, controls, component wiring, etc. We do not want to start a debate or argument, but want to reassure everyone who is interested in these cleaning methods that if done correctly and carefully, they do no harm components in any way. 

 

The amp we used to document the restoration process was from our own stock of vintage gear we acquire for restoration from time to time, not a customer’s amp. When we got the amp it was not working, with all the tubes and a knob missing. It was quite a mess and probably had not been used in over 20 years. Hopefully the results speak for themselves.

 

To answer some specific questions: 

 

Yes, of course we return bad tubes to customers, as well as any parts we replace. And yes capacitors and resistors are manufactured in sealed coatings or containers, and suffer no harm. Any water that might enter a component is evaporated in the drying process. The drying possess should be done directly after the cleaning. We do not recommend ultrasonically cleaning for power and output transformers because it has a possibility of abrading the thin ceramic insulation used on the windings and this could cause troubles due to the high voltages present. Receiver IF transformers, on the other hand, are not effected by ultrasonic cleaning.

 

Yes, we wouldn’t recommend using orange drop capacitors for speaker crossovers either. We use them for what they were designed for, and they work great. 

 

Although our company is indeed a recent arrival to the community, it was originally founded by our current CEO and lead designer/tech way back in 1970, designing and manufacturing recording studio equipment and high-end audio equipment. Our team has a lot of experience in audio design, and in other fields of electronics design, along with advanced degrees in physics as well as a long history of founding successful technology companies. We certainly don’t claim to know-it-all by any means, and always welcome constructive criticism and new ideas or suggestions. Our aim is to participate with the community in learning more about audio equipment and the enjoyment of music. Along with everyone here, we want to share information and learn from each other’s experience.

Edited May 1, 2015 by AEA Audio

[NOSValves]

edited the one sided edit 

Edited May 4, 2015 by NOSValves
abusive

[Marvel]

Want to buy some ocean front property?

Already have some... thanks...

Edited May 1, 2015 by Marvel

[NOSValves]

 

^{First of all, we would like to thank everyone who chimed in on this subject for their interest. These subjects are all things that interest us also. And we certainly agree with people approaching things they may not be familiar with by using a heavy dose of critical analysis and healthy skepticism. Our hope is that the information we provided will be useful, and we will try to answer anyone’s questions if we can.}

 

^{Contrary to what almost everyone feels when they first hear about immersion cleaning, or using soap and water to clean electronics, this is an old and tried-and-true method of restoration for vintage tube electronics, especially tube gear. It has been used for years by many. One of the best YouTube tutorials about this was done by Bob Sumption. Bob shows how to wash, rinse and bake the chassis of an old Heathkit tube radio, but the same technique can be used on all old tube gear. Buy the way, Bob worked as an engineer for Heathkit, designing tube ham radio gear before he retired. We strongly recommend the techniques Bob demonstrates for restoring old tube amps:} 

 

 

^{What we have done is experiment with adding ultrasonic methods to improve this process. We have used the more traditional soap and water hand scrubbing method on all kinds of vintage tube gear for many years on our own vintage equipment, long before starting a vintage tube amp restoration service. After using this new ultrasonic method with a large number of amps, and seeing its benefits, we decided to share it on this forum in hopes readers would find it useful. We found that using ultrasonic cleaning, with tarnish removing cleaners added to the water, results in an almost miraculous transformation. It’s not only restoring the shine on what you can see, it’s that the tarnish is removed from places that were not possible before, including all the connectors, sockets, controls, component wiring, etc. We do not want to start a debate or argument, but want to reassure everyone who is interested in these cleaning methods that if done correctly and carefully, they do no harm components in any way.} 

 

^{The amp we used to document the restoration process was from our own stock of vintage gear we acquire for restoration from time to time, not a customer’s amp. When we got the amp it was not working, with all the tubes and a knob missing. It was quite a mess and probably had not been used in over 20 years. Hopefully the results speak for themselves.}

 

^{To answer some specific questions:} 

 

^{Yes, of course we return bad tubes to customers, as well as any parts we replace. And yes capacitors and resistors are manufactured in sealed coatings or containers, and suffer no harm. Any water that might enter a component is evaporated in the drying process. The drying possess should be done directly after the cleaning. We do not recommend ultrasonically cleaning for power and output transformers because it has a possibility of abrading the thin ceramic insulation used on the windings and this could cause troubles due to the high voltages present. Receiver IF transformers, on the other hand, are not effected by ultrasonic cleaning.}

 

^{Yes, we wouldn’t recommend using orange drop capacitors for speaker crossovers either. We use them for what they were designed for, and they work great.} 

 

^{Although our company is indeed a recent arrival to the community, it was originally founded by our current CEO and lead designer/tech way back in 1970, designing and manufacturing recording studio equipment and high-end audio equipment. Our team has a lot of experience in audio design, and in other fields of electronics design, along with advanced degrees in physics as well as a long history of founding successful technology companies. We certainly don’t claim to know-it-all by any means, and always welcome constructive criticism and new ideas or suggestions. Our aim is to participate with the community in learning more about audio equipment and the enjoyment of music. Along with everyone here, we want to share information and learn from each other’s experience.}

 

 

^{That video is your proof of the ultra sonic dunk job is valid? Your kidding me right? First off he is a self professed amateur....second off he never dunked it and subjected it to your under water unltasonic bubble bath... third off the unit was a professed boat anchor,  I still think the guy is a nut job and would like to talk to whomever owns and has used that device long term with all those ceramic disc caps left in place... The couple months your work has been in the field (if at all) in the grand scheme of things is meaningless....} 

Edited May 2, 2015 by NOSValves

[CECAA850]

Seems this has gone from informative to personal.

[Thaddeus Smith]

Unlocking the thread for discussion about the topic. Keep it civil, keep it focused, and leave your off-forum grievances out of the discussion.

[PrestonTom]

Unlocking the thread for discussion about the topic. Keep it civil, keep it focused, and leave your off-forum grievances out of the discussion.

With all due respect, I think you are now  just rewarding the poor behavior. Just my thought.

[Tarheel]

How so Tom?  AEA Audio started the thread and did nothing wrong. 

[JL Sargent]

Ultrasonic cleaning can really be impressive. I have one that has a heater built in too. I think it is a 6 liter model. Honestly, I have never considered it for an audio chassis, but certainly find that interesting. What it can do for an old carburetor is something to behold. 

[PrestonTom]

How so Tom?  AEA Audio started the thread and did nothing wrong. 

AEA has been informative, friendly, and professional the entire time. They were not the guilty party.

[Thaddeus Smith]

pruned the outright personal attacks and unnecessary name calling. 

[twk123]

I have a question on the water dunk/wash. Would it be wise to use distilled water for this to ensure there is no salt/mineral residue left over that could cause potential problems down the road?

[NOSValves]

I have a question on the water dunk/wash. Would it be wise to use distilled water for this to ensure there is no salt/mineral residue left over that could cause potential problems down the road?

 

 

I can answer that one for you. Since the water is going to be mixed with soap and possibly some solvents would render distilled water no benefit. Perhaps a final rinse with that would be helpful but in the end a waste of time in my opinion. As the song goes the damage is done LOL!! In the end IMHO do the job right the first time by doing a 100% tear down before cleaning the chassis with this method.

[NOSValves]

pruned the outright personal attacks and unnecessary name calling. 

 

 

Thad exactly what did you prune? I personally do not recall doing any direct name calling or attacking that was not prevoked...but that does not mean it did not happen. If you can please PM or email me what you thought was inappropriate...

[NOSValves]

 

Want to buy some ocean front property?

Already have some... thanks...

 

 

 Marvel,

 

 Well good for you but one can never have enough!

[Deang]

I need to make a correction. I found the old thread where I described cleaning my Scott 299. I didn't use Dawn and steel wool, I used Scotchbrite pads and Windex. Do NOT use steel wool!

I'd also like to apologize to everyone for the orignal remark that set everything off.

[NOSValves]

By the way one other comment about old failing wire insulation mentioned in earlier post and that is it should be replaced if observed even in transformers(which isn't really that difficult) and not ignored because it could easily lead to shock and fire hazards.

 

 

 

With deteriorating cloth wire I have a very simple and effective fix that does not require messing with the delicate winding wire inside the transformer at all. Its called shrink wrap... if the actual wire conductor is bad then you work your way back until you find good lead wire and solder in new wire then SHRINK WRAP the remaining cloth portion. I actually stock various colors of actual modern transformer lead wire to perform this when needed.  Once you start messing with the paper insulation inside these vintage units it starts falling apart since it is very brittle and saturated with hardened varnish.... Unlike most of you I have been there and done all of this... trust me unwarranted messing around on the inside of a hard to replace 50+ year vintage transformer is asking for trouble.  

 

       The Fisher in this example did not even have cloth leads... but most vintage amplifier do....  

 

      The OP in this thread indeed comes off professional and very much like a marketer... sorry to say I find no meat in the responses. 

Edited May 3, 2015 by NOSValves

[NOSValves]

I need to make a correction. I found the old thread where I described cleaning my Scott 299. I didn't use Dawn and steel wool, I used Scotchbrite pads and Windex. Do NOT use steel wool!

I'd also like to apologize to everyone for the orignal remark that set everything off.

 

 

   I seem to recall steel wool but I could be mistaken. Another correction you might want to make is that amplifier was never part of my website. Kelly might of mentioned adding it but it never was. Getting Kelly to do updates was like pulling teeth.