Schu Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Do certain output tubes have specific sound qualities inherent to their structure? for instance... how do KT66's sound compared to KT88's or KT77's? how do EL34's sound in comparison to 6V6's and so on. I can run kt66,kt88,kt77,kt120,kt150,el34,el37,6v6,6l6 and 350b's... so far I have tried kt66's and 350b's, all Octal. these things are expensive so before I spend anymore money, I would like to get some semblance of how the tube might sound BEFORE I spend any more money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derrickdj1 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 In my limited experience, the biggest difference between the tube types is high gain vs lower gain. This will effect the sound. High gain will have tighter bass but may have more noise that may affect clarity and the Hi's. Low gain will have that so called warmer presentation and not as tight of a low end. My EL 34's are high gain compared to the 6CA7. The EL is more SS like with the tight bass and sparkling Hi's. The 6CA7 is more laid back and the bass is softer, Hi's seem the same as the EL 34. Do I like one over the other, no. I'm more concerned with good clean sound and don't fully get this thing on wanting a warm sound. Maybe I have been using the Pioneer Elite to long and am use to a clean unaltered sound. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfbane Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 When I had a tube amp that could use EL-34's or KT-88's I preferred the EL-34's for Jazz and Pop and KT-88's for Classic Rock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted December 20, 2016 Author Share Posted December 20, 2016 I have found a very wide and varied quality of sound when rolling tubes... everything seems to make a difference. Even when I changed a 6x4 recifier tube in my pre stage I could hear the difference. This is especially true with the 12au7 output in my pre, but these are the same tube types with the difference being the layout and manufacturing. With different tube types, I now have to choose type as well as manufacturer. Critical listening is about all I do, I rarely put music on in the back ground for entertainment. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted December 20, 2016 Author Share Posted December 20, 2016 3 hours ago, wdecho said: Unless you are a super critical listener I doubt if you are going to hear much difference. There are subtle differences in the sound from what I have read on the net. The only experience I have had is with EL-34's and KT77's. I am not familiar with the 350b's at all. I am currently using the reproduction 350b's... they are more reasonable ($$$) copies of the general electric 350b from the 1940-1950's. These originals can run from $500-$800ea and even the copies are nealy impossible to get hold of for some reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Egad...maybe try 6V6. You could buy a mountain of nice ones for 800 bucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert_kc Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Is this for your Inspire amp? FYI, there's another forum with more than 3,000 posts about Inspire amps - mostly discussing owners' assessments of tube rolling. (I don't know if its OK to name another forum here.) In the Inspire amps, tube selection has a noticeable effect on sound quality. IME 6L6GC have the "warmest" sound. KT88 is probably the opposite extreme. You really have to decide what works best in your amp, with your speakers, for your music, in your room, and for your ears. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tube fanatic Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 As was pointed out, you can only judge the sound quality of a tube in a given piece of equipment. A tube which sounds wonderful (to some at least) in a Scott amp with a push-pull output stage may not sound good in your SE amp at all. It's impossible to take anyone's word about which is the best tube to use. Some may have the identical amp to yours but consider a particular presentation as being the best imaginable. To your ears it may sound awful. Unfortunately, the only way to know what you like is to try it- definitely a potentially expensive proposition depending on what you decide to try. If changing the rectifier tube in your preamp resulted in a noticeable change in the sound, one of the tubes is no good. I think this was discussed before in another thread. Maynard 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derrickdj1 Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 Well, I swapped the EL 34 and preamp tubes with 6CA7 and Electroharmonix Gold pin 12AU7 and 12 AX7 tubes. These are lower gain compared to the Tung-Sol. The top is not as bright and the bass is not as tight. I guess this is the warm sound? I was not particularly thrilled with that sound. Now the tubes are new with little burn-in time. I adjust the equalizer only slightly and that made a world of difference. I guess since we are using tubes to change the tone of a system, that a little bit of EQ from an external equalizer is a nice addition to getting the desired sound. This keep from having a set of tubes that you might not use much. This just an initial thought. I will let these burn-in a bit and see if the sound changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derrickdj1 Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Well, the tubes have burned in a bit and I am pleasantly surprised. I am liking the softer sound of these lower gain tubes. Vocals shine on these tubes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schu Posted January 4, 2017 Author Share Posted January 4, 2017 :thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtmudd Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 On 12/20/2016 at 10:37 AM, Schu said: Do certain output tubes have specific sound qualities inherent to their structure? for instance... how do KT66's sound compared to KT88's or KT77's? how do EL34's sound in comparison to 6V6's and so on. I can run kt66,kt88,kt77,kt120,kt150,el34,el37,6v6,6l6 and 350b's... so far I have tried kt66's and 350b's, all Octal. these things are expensive so before I spend anymore money, I would like to get some semblance of how the tube might sound BEFORE I spend any more money. http://vintagetubeservices.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 It depends 8-) You could have three KT88 amps that all sound different because of different filtering in power supply or operating points or on how they are driven. There is so much that can make or break sound before even getting to tube types. I usually start with pretty generic tubes and if I like it enough to keep it I start trying primo tubes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derrickdj1 Posted January 13, 2017 Share Posted January 13, 2017 I previously mentioned high gain vs low gain tubes. Since the high gain tube are a bit stronger, it takes more to reach distortion from them. If one is looking to achieve the distortion from their tube amp, then a lower gain tube may be a better choice. If you like playing the music loud then a high gain tube is a better choice. Tube selection depends a lot on how and what you listen to. Another thing, is the amp sound bland or thin then a higher gain preamp tube may be need. It the top sound harsh, a lower gain preamp tube is called for. It is much easier to roll preamp tubes. Caution should be noted with tube rolling. The amp was designed to work with a specific tube. Keep in mind that this doesn't mean you can put a 12AY7 (40) into a 12AX7 (100) socket just because it has a lower gain. First thing to consider is that the bias circuits for a given socket are designed such that the spec'd tube will operate in the center of the load line - which is based on a given socket's supply voltage and the Plate Load Resistor. If a tube other than spec'd is used, then either the top half of the signal will top out early or the bottom half of the signal will bottom out early. Ya want them to "clip" at the same time to max the level of that stage. The second reason is gain structure. If one stage drives the next with too low of a signal, then some of the dynamic range is being thrown away. In other words, you'll have to turn up the amp to get the same volume and you'll be turning up the noise floor with it. http://www.seymourduncan.com/forum/showthread.php?29521-12AX7-vs-12AT7-vs-12AU7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audio Flynn Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 Transformers have a huge influence. I have not tried everything but I do like kt88 or 6L6 over el84 for bass weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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