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ODS123

Advice for Beginners - consider this test from an audio club

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Sure. Buy cheap, but make sure it has tone controls and a mono switch. 

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Also tactile appeal of the Knobs must be there. MDF is the very best speaker cabinet material.  OP is right you are wrong.

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30 minutes ago, glens said:

You can only be wrong when you disagree with someone.

Is that why everyone else is wrong all the time?

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15 hours ago, Dave A said:

Also tactile appeal of the Knobs must be there. MDF is the very best speaker cabinet material.  OP is right you are wrong.

 

Again...Yet further mischaracterization.  Sheesh, you two guys come across as hostile and childish; not a great reflection on this hobby.

 

I never said MDF is best and you know this..  ..I simply pushed back on your (ridiculous, imho) claim that plywood is sonically superior and that anything other is evidence that a speaker company has ceded all product decisions to its cost accountants.  I said MDF is best when sound is the only priority and Ply is the better when durability is the priority.  

 

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We were summing up your ludicrous advice for beginners. No one is being hostile. Maybe a little childish - you bring out the best in me!

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20 hours ago, Deang said:

Sure. Buy cheap, but make sure it has tone controls and a mono switch. 

That's effing awesome!

:)

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12 hours ago, ODS123 said:

 

Again...Yet further mischaracterization.  Sheesh, you two guys come across as hostile and childish; not a great reflection on this hobby.

 

I never said MDF is best and you know this..  ..I simply pushed back on your (ridiculous, imho) claim that plywood is sonically superior and that anything other is evidence that a speaker company has ceded all product decisions to its cost accountants.  I said MDF is best when sound is the only priority and Ply is the better when durability is the priority.  

 

Here... let me help a little with a machine shop analogy. 

Ply or hardwood construction is like working with Iron, basic... MDF is like working with an Alloy, formulas and properties can be designed, changed and material machined.

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As far as construction between the two materials it's not a night/day difference.  I wouldn't rely on only screws with either and wouldn't run a screw into an edge with either, either.

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23 hours ago, Deang said:

Sure. Buy cheap, but make sure it has tone controls and a mono switch. 


More accurately:

 

" if you’re new to this hobby and you’re budget constrained, give serious thought before devoting a big chunk of your budget to a pricey amplifier, cd player and cables.   ..Spend the bulk of your money were it matters most: your speakers."

 

I never told newbies that a mono switch or tone controls are a must.  ..A personal preference, perhaps, but not a "must".

 

I can't believe you have such a problem with that advice.

 

 

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I pointed out several times that even the most naive and uneducated know that the loudspeaker is the most important part of the overall purchase. No one ever disputed that.

 

You went on to say ...

 

“But the audible differences made by rest of your components, including amplifier, CD player, DAC ... are negligible. So negligible, in fact, that there is considerable debate whether they are audible at all.”

 

The end result of that discussion was that since no one can really hear the difference between components - buy pretty much whatever, as long as it’s “linear”, and possesses some basic features. 

 

So like I said, just buy cheap. Just go to Walmart and buy the cheapest components you can find - because you won’t hear one iota of a difference. Hey, just ask Richard Clark!

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20 hours ago, ODS123 said:

 

Again...Yet further mischaracterization.  Sheesh, you two guys come across as hostile and childish; not a great reflection on this hobby.

 

I never said MDF is best and you know this..  ..I simply pushed back on your (ridiculous, imho) claim that plywood is sonically superior and that anything other is evidence that a speaker company has ceded all product decisions to its cost accountants.  I said MDF is best when sound is the only priority and Ply is the better when durability is the priority.  

 

Well you made many defensive claims that the best speakers are made of this by the best companies who choose to use it so just what should my interpretation of that line of though be hmmm? It is the pretentious side of your commentary that invites response at times.

  Why did you stop with your MDF days count? I rather enjoyed that.

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13 hours ago, Dave A said:

Well you made many defensive claims that the best speakers are made of this by the best companies who choose to use it so just what should my interpretation of that line of though be hmmm? It is the pretentious side of your commentary that invites response at times.

  Why did you stop with your MDF days count? I rather enjoyed that.

 

I have no idea what you are saying here.

 

My remarks about MDF being the material of choice for just about EVERY speaker company weren't mere "defensive claims" - they are statements of fact.  

 

And I'm not sure how arguing that modern amplifiers which are engineered to be linear will be hard to differentiate is "pretentious."    Whatever. 

 

Oh, by my count Corny-L and Corny-R (Cornwall III's, MDF edition) are closing in on 16 disintegration-free months in my home.  Thanks for asking.

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3 hours ago, ODS123 said:

 

I have no idea what you are saying here.

 

My remarks about MDF being the material of choice for just about EVERY speaker company weren't mere "defensive claims" - they are statements of fact.  

 

And I'm not sure how arguing that modern amplifiers which are engineered to be linear will be hard to differentiate is "pretentious."    Whatever. 

 

Oh, by my count Corny-L and Corny-R (Cornwall III's, MDF edition) are closing in on 16 disintegration-free months in my home.  Thanks for asking.

So we are back to deflection again? And of course you are still right and I am wrong . See part 3 of my comment that got you riled. "OP is right you are wrong" is the quote you are looking for.

3 hours ago, ODS123 said:

And I'm not sure how arguing that modern amplifiers which are engineered to be linear will be hard to differentiate is "pretentious."    Whatever. 

 OK see the next quote.

 

On 2/16/2019 at 3:54 PM, Dave A said:

Also tactile appeal of the Knobs must be there. MDF is the very best speaker cabinet material.  OP is right you are wrong.

So how do you tie your comment into what I said?  THANKS you helped start my day off with a smile once again.

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2 hours ago, Dave A said:

So we are back to deflection again? And of course you are still right and I am wrong . See part 3 of my comment that got you riled. "OP is right you are wrong" is the quote you are looking for.

 OK see the next quote.

 

So how do you tie your comment into what I said?  THANKS you helped start my day off with a smile once again.

 

Dave..  Can you please be a little more clear?  What do you mean defecting?  ..How am I deflecting and from what??   Your posts seem long on anger but short on substance or clarity.

 

Tactile appeal of the knobs??  I never suggested this should be of great concern to beginners.  ..I cited it as one of many reasons  why I spent more than necessary to get good sound.  ..I like the look, feel, features of my Mac.  ..But for years I was happy with the sound from countless simpler and less expensive integrated amps and separates.  You seem to think pointing out I have a McIntosh amplifier is some big "gotcha!" but I fail to understand why?

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39 minutes ago, ODS123 said:

Dave..  Can you please be a little more clear?  What do you mean defecting?  ..How am I deflecting and from what??   Your posts seem long on anger but short on substance or clarity.

 OK I don't mean to go all grammar cop on you but you did teach me to do this. "What do you mean defecting?" should have been deflecting right?

 Not angry at all and I am entertained by you.

45 minutes ago, ODS123 said:

Your posts seem long on anger but short on substance or clarity. 

🤣 Hows this for brevity and clarity?

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The idea that MDF is a structural equivalent to plywood is ludicrous!  This is a different use but you simply don't want this stuff to ever get wet!

I had a water heater burst a few months ago and thought I was lucky to be home at the time so I could get it turned off right away.  Water was mopped up quickly but within half an hour the MDF underlayment started to swell.  I'll spare you the details but the end result so far is over 40k in repairs and a week spent in a local hotel.  If the underlayment had been decent material the mopping and drying would have been  the end of it.  Luckily, only the house suffered and not much "stuff" was even touched.

I have 2 pairs of Cornwalls that are over 50 years old... I won't be around to verify but I wonder how many MDF constructed speakers constructed in recent years will survive to that age?

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