Yet Anothert Heritage Horn Upgrade ?

[bmar]

Nice construction; I really like that design.

Bill Martinelli

[BS Button]

Good gawd! Jorjen, you are unbelievable.

[jorjen]

Thank you Mr. Martinelli. You know what they say about the sincerest form of flattery. Tried to do as I thought you would, I sincerely hope I did not miss the mark by much. I hope Dr. Edgar would be pleased with my implementation of his design as well.

Todd,

See, I told you I ALWAYS finish my projects. []

[jwc]

You are right about that article by Bruce Edgar. I've only skimmed it. You are onto something. Can't wait to see your thread. I may have to do this too. Excited I am.

jc

[Daddy Dee]

seti,

I have

wondered the same thing. Of course, one problem, for those using Khorns

is the upper frequency of the bass bin is too low for the single HF

driver to pick up and carry the freight the rest of the way.

However,

for the LaScala I think the transformation to two-way is a workable

proposition. Klipsch builds something in the KPT line which looks like

a Cornwall cab for the bass unit and something sitting atop like what

we saw on one of the Jubilees in Hope.

It is possible that the

pricey driver is part of the apparent reluctance to take this plunge.

Also, I don't think folks have identified a readily available and

satisfactory horn for the project. I think it would be important to

have a horn that could load the higher frequencies as well as the

midrange.

I don't remember the exact crossover points of Jubilee Khorn Belle Scala perhaps they aren't as close as I thought. I

The price tag is pretty high but I've been wondering if those pricey

drivers were what I really loved about that jubilee sound. I'll ask

around this weekend and see what sort of response I get.

I think the Jubilee as we heard it in Hope might have been crossed at

800hz. My memory is fuzzy on this, but I was thinking that Mr. Paul

might have been working on the combination of bass bin and mid/HF

driver to cross in the range of 600hz. I think the Jubilee bass bin

does go at least to 600hz. I might be mistaken about the 800hz

crossover in Hope.

I do think that HF driver that is the KPT (which is very close to

another driver they used in the prototype, the name of which escapes

me, but it is available on partsexpress.com) is part of what sounds so

good. The price is about $325 plus a piece.

There are two more issues in the Jubilee synergy... I think... that is

the two way design which is just seamless and effortless in

transitioning from the bass to hf drivers.... very smooth. Also that

bass bin is so well designed, it is moving alot of air fast and clean.

I don't think I've ever heard anything more natural sounding.

[3dzapper]

"There are two more issues in the Jubilee synergy... I think... that is the two way design which is just seamless and effortless in transitioning from the bass to hf drivers.... very smooth. Also that bass bin is so well designed, it is moving alot of air fast and clean. I don't think I've ever heard anything more natural sounding."

Shucks Dee, you were just in awe 'cause you was in Arkinsaw.-)

I'd love to hear a pair of Jubilees some day. Even the black cinema ones.

---

[seti]

*edit* ewps

[seti]

I think the Jubilee as we heard it in Hope might have been crossed at 800hz. My memory is fuzzy on this, but I was thinking that Mr. Paul might have been working on the combination of bass bin and mid/HF driver to cross in the range of 600hz. I think the Jubilee bass bin does go at least to 600hz. I might be mistaken about the 800hz crossover in Hope.

I do think that HF driver that is the KPT (which is very close to another driver they used in the prototype, the name of which escapes me, but it is available on partsexpress.com) is part of what sounds so good. The price is about $325 plus a piece.

There are two more issues in the Jubilee synergy... I think... that is the two way design which is just seamless and effortless in transitioning from the bass to hf drivers.... very smooth. Also that bass bin is so well designed, it is moving alot of air fast and clean. I don't think I've ever heard anything more natural sounding.

Very good description Dee I couldn't have said it better myself.

That jubilee thread with replies from Roy which list horn parts among other info. Glad the search funtion is a little better.

http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/1/636750/ShowThread.aspx

[Deang]

It sure is cool when you see something like that, and realize you're happy with what you have!

Beautiful work Jordan.

[jorjen]

Thanks Dean!

[bmar]

The workmanship is quite stunning. The time spent on the paint and finish makes them fit to be outside of the grille cloth.

There is an 1/8" bending ply you'll want to look. It's made in Italy and is poplar.

[Al Klappenberger]

Seti,

I just noticed that thread on the jubilee that Roy posted to. Thanks! I am particulary interested in his comments about digital delay. Has anybody else seen any posts by Roy since? I would really like to know his take on my ES networks with respect to the delay issue. My theory is that the delay is on an issue where the drivers overlap. That thinking says that the ES networks would be an alternitive to digital delay. I want to know what he thinks about this.

Roy, are you listening? Private email would be appreceiated!

Al K.

[Al Klappenberger]

Guys,

BTW: Bill Martinelli and I would consider a 2 Inch throat version of my Trachorn if there is any serious interest. It would look exactly like what Jordan posted earlier.

AL K.

[Guest " "]

Guys,

BTW: Bill Martinelli and I would consider a 2 Inch throat version of my Trachorn if there is any serious interest. It would look exactly like what Jordan posted earlier.

AL K.

 

So it sounds like this would have to be a version that mounts outside (on top) of the cabinet.

Would the physical space in a K-horn or Belle limit getting to an optimal physical size to leverage at 2" throat?

[jorjen]

Thanks again Mr. Martinelli, coming from you that really means alot. Also, thanks for the heads up on the bending ply.

SpeakerFritz,

In this particular format, the horn is exactly 10" tall and 18" wide at the mouth. Is'nt the Khorn top section opening like 9.5" tall or so? Cannot remember what mine were. Anyway, new calculations for construction could be used to change the the ratio of width to height of the mouth making it wider but not as tall if I am not mistaken. If one took this approach of course, you may only have room to mount a K-77 style tweeter next to the horn in a vertical only orientation if any room for a tweeter at all. Don't know what the width would be without recalculating the horn. If your were doing a 2-way, obviously no big deal I guess.

I have always thought about Mr. Martinellis 21" horn being usable in the Khorn top if just a tad was shaved off the top and bottom edges. I think it just misses fitting by like 1/4" to 1/2" or so. Looks like there might be enough meat there to do this without compromising the horns structural integrity. Only Mr. Martinelli would know for sure. But then again, who in the heck would want to hide his horns from view. And, we also have Mr. K's Trachorn available to us, so maybe that is not sensible thinking anyway.

[Al Klappenberger]

speakerfritz,

A 2 inch throat horn for the Khorn would not be quite as long at the Trachorn for a 1 inch throat. The mouth of the 1 inch version just fits in the Khorn so the 2 inch version would be even easier to fit in.

BTW: I got software here that will design the Edgar type tractrix horn for any mouth size with any height / width you want to any throat size you want. The only gotcha may be with the resulting lower frequency limit.

AL K.

[Guest " "]

speakerfritz,

A 2 inch throat horn for the Khorn would not be quite as long at the Trachorn for a 1 inch throat. The mouth of the 1 inch version just fits in the Khorn so the 2 inch version would be even easier to fit in.

AL K.

 

Makes sense now that I think about it. So this sounds like it could open up some trachorn opportunities for folks who want to put them internally in a LaScala.

[Deang]

Smaller driver/horn combinations supposedly have better dispersion characteristics. The majority of big drivers have an upper end response as haggard as the K-55 -- and I have yet to see any that really do any better in the 400-500Hz range. Experimentation at this level is expensive, and I'm inclined to believe that unless the room is huge, or one listens at the highest of SPLs -- the best sound is going to come from stretching as many octaves across the middle as possible and then topping off with some sparkle. Klipschorn users are really bottled in, though there is some wiggle room for LaScala and Belle Klipsch users. Fact is, regardless of the cut-off of any big horn -- there just isn't much of anything out there that's flat at 400Hz. The big Altecs are nice when they show up in good shape -- but they don't come up often. The ones that usually show up look like hell, and they still want an arm and a leg for them. The new 399 from Great Plains looks hopeful, but until someone tries it on a 2" horn and takes some measurements ...

[Deang]

I had just finished the above post, went to check my email -- and saw this:

Dean,

Are you ready for this? Are you sitting down? I think I just found my mid driver!

Just got off the phone with Bill from Great Plains. They are getting ready to come out with a "390" Driver, like the old 290. Get this...WITH A PHENOLIC DAIPHRAM! WOOHOO! $325.00 each, same as the 399's. Very cool eh?

Jordan

Well, Al -- I think you and Bill better get busy. Remember what I told you a year ago?

[jorjen]

Sorry Deano, did'nt realize I spelled "diaphram" wrong. Where in the Hell is Craig when I need him?[]

Just razzin' ya Craig!

Bill also mentioned some preliminary specs, but did not really want anything posted until they were more firm. Sure looks good though. Now I just need to make up a 1.4" to 2" adaptor that will not lengthen the throat on the Tractrix horns much.