Palladium Podcast is live

[Amy]

I hope to see great success for both the Palladium and the Jubilee and I believe anyone who chooses either one for whatever their reasons will be extremely happy.

mike tn

Well said, mike tn.

[Amy]

Amy,

Is there a working pair at CES right now? The online directory says that you are at the Renissance 29. Which hotel or expo center is this?

No, we choose not to have a working pair at CES. We have a suite only this year for meetings and display units, and are not on the show room floor.

[Deang]

Damon, badge of honor? A rogue is something that has been rejected, running loose, out of control -- and not accepted or embraced. Marketing/sales channel aspect? He said "not finished", and I definitely took that to mean, well, you know -- not finished, like what we're using ("DIY kits") is some kind of half-assed engineering effort. I really don't care all that much one way or the other, and I was really more amused by the comments than anything else.

"It has no official components, measurements, specs, design, materials, voicing, etc etc because nothing was ever finalized. That is what was meant by that, and he's right."

Amy, that's pretty much what I thought he meant. The Jubilee became "official" and "finalized" when they started being sold to consumers for home use, and it doesn't matter if they come from the cinema side or the consumer side. Now, if Roy can handle engineering the horns for the "finalized" version of the Palladium, then how are the components and horns he deems appropriate for the Jubilee considered not "finalized"? It is indeed a Klipsch finalized product, engineered by Klipsch and Delgado in Hope Arkansas -- with "components, measurements, specs, design, materials, and voicing". There is nothing "rogue" about the Jubilee, and I even have a Klipsch warranty to prove it. I'm not here to argue, I just thought Mr. Garrett's comments were insensitive to the legacy of PWK. "It doesn't count" made me smile.

[bodcaw boy]

What, because Garrett called the Jubilee a "rogue...not really a real product...not finished...doesn't count...?" I think Jubilee owners are beyond caring what anyone thinks. I'll tell you what though, if PWK wasn't rolling in grave before he is now.

You need to put those comments in context, ie the Jubilee Never Went Into Production for Klipsch in a Home Version. It has no official components, measurements, specs, design, materials, voicing, etc etc because nothing was ever finalized. That is what was meant by that, and he's right.

Let's not get into the millionth argument about this product, please. Exactly ZERO people would know for absolute certain what PWK would think.

hmmmmmmm.....

in Christ, because of God's grace,

roy

[bodcaw boy]

"A rogue is something that has been rejected, running loose, and is out of control -- and not accepted or embraced."

hey! i resemble that remark!!

in Christ, because of God's grace,

roy

[bodcaw boy]

Damon, badge of honor? A rogue is something that has been rejected, running loose, and is out of control -- and not accepted or embraced. Marketing/sales channel aspect? He said "not finished", and I definitely took that to mean, well, you know -- not finished, like what we're using ("DIY kits") is some kind of half-assed engineering effort. I really don't care all that much one way or the other, and I was really more amused by the comments than anything else.

"It has no official components, measurements, specs, design, materials, voicing, etc etc because nothing was ever finalized. That is what was meant by that, and he's right."

Amy, that's pretty much what I thought he meant. The Jubilee became "official" and "finalized" when they started being sold to consumers for home use, and it doesn't matter if they come from the cinema side or the consumer side. Now, if Roy can handle engineering the horns for the "finalized" version of the Palladium, then how are the components and horns he deems appropriate for the Jubilee considered not "finalized"? It is indeed a Klipsch finalized product, engineered by Klipsch and Delgado in Hope Arkansas -- with "components, measurements, specs, design, materials, and voicing". There is nothing "rogue" about the Jubilee, and I even have a Klipsch warranty to prove it. I'm not here to argue, I just thought Mr. Garrett's comments were insensitive to the legacy of PWK. "It doesn't count" made me smile.

hey, anyone can be wrong! [8-|]

In Christ, because of God's grace,

roy

[WMcD]

I'm impressed beyond recovery. That pertains to many of the subjects.

Dammon is great. May I ask what sort of microphone was used for the intro? There were a few pops but gosh it sounded good, what a natural appealing voice, too. Dammon should be on NPR. He is a gifted interviewer.

The Jubilee as a rogue speaker? I'd say it was a speaker by a couple of rogues. Smile.

It is hard to believe that the Jubilee is described as not Klipsch. Well, maybe if you ignore the fact that PWK, in part, designed it. And it uses Klipsch drivers. And it is sold by Klipsch. How can that work?

Naturally, all congrats to the designers of the Palladium.

Roy got some kudos (not nearly enough) and maybe someday he will be able to share his insights on the technology. I was a bit concerned that the Palladium was a product of, granted, good engineers in Indy. It was good to hear that the Roy - Hope part of the family did the really important stuff.

I think that "palladium" has a hard A (?). There was this pronunciation on the radio in the USA when the element was discussed in connection with cold fusion. I don't know for sure. I've come to doubt by ear for such. I have a slight LawnGyland accent, myself.

I do have one thought in closing. I'd love to have a shoot out between the Palladium and my beloved Forte II. Or even a Cornwall .

Again, very well done, Dammon.

Gil

[mikebse2a3]

The Jubilee as a rogue speaker? I'd say it was a speaker by a couple of rogues. Smile.

Hey Gil[Y]

mike tn[]

[PrestonTom]

Congratulations on a successful interview. It was very interesting.

I won't discuss the "rogue" comments in reference to the Jubilee. There was a paper in JAES where it was clearly stated that this was a completion of a dream to take the original Klipschorn to the next step. It was designed, it was tested, and it was discussed in the article. Since PWK was an author on the paper, I think we can make some safe assumptions about his enthusiasm for the Jubilee. Whether the final version is being distributed through commercial sound vs home sound channels does not detract from this achievement.

I certainly heard the issue of cosmetics come up repeatedly during the interview. Apparently, some folks consider this to be a top priority. In my case, I can get used to the look of a big folded horn when they sound so wonderful. I guess that is my priority.

Not only did the the word "cosmetic" come up frequently, but several times it was mentioned that this new product was now going to let Klipsch be in the same league with a very high end market. There was almost a defensiveness about this. I find this interesting, since I always assumed that the Klipschorn, especially in the 1950s and 1960s, was generally considered to be in that small esoteric league of "high end equipment". They made it sound like Klipsch was never more than mid-fi equipment.

I hope the P39 does well. Although it is sad that a simple appreciation for two-channel listening is a nearly dead art. So much energy seems to be devoted to cosmetic issues and home theater. I would like to think there is still a place for enjoying big horns and really hearing the music.

-Tom

[Amy]

I would like to think there is still a place for enjoying big horns and really hearing the music.

That's why we have never discontinued the Khorn. And I'm pretty sure you can really hear music with the new stuff, too. []

None of mine nor Jim's comments were in disrespect to PWK or Roy.

[damonrpayne]

Everyone: I asked DrWho what my next podcast should be about. I can see now that he was correct that talking to Roy about PWK and the Jubilee would be of extreme interest to everyone. I don't know how easy this will be to engineer but I promise I will look into it.

Gil: Thank you for your kind words. The microphone is a Behringer studio mic I bought for room measurements. Using a mixing board and piping this straight into the PC via Audacity (thanks for the link doc) produces a far cleaner sound than the digital voice recorder I used for the interview, so I will be using this technique next time.

Preston: I wish I had recorded some of my conversations with Mark Kauffman and Jim Hunter on the same day. I really do think somethings from the palladium podcast are being taken out of context. I think MANY of us can recognize that there has been a bias against Horns in the audiophile community despite the many technical advantages of horns. The Palladium line is a way to "show them", those are my words. Also Mark made an interesting comment that I truly hope does not ALSO get taken out of context. This WILL be in my interview with Mark when I get it published. I asked him what the competition for the k-horn was. He said this was an interesting question and we had a conversation about it. He said two fascinating things: people are buying the k-horn with their ears, not their eyes; and, "K-horn buyers are MUSIC fans, not audiophiles." Personally I think the LaScala II is an even better example of this concept. Look at the spec sheet: +- 4db and rolls off at 16khz? That looks "bad" on paper, never mind that most people my age and older cannot HEAR 16khz anymore and my room has more than a 4db effect at various frequencies. The LaScala II sound like freakin live music though!

Mark, Jim, and others at Klipsch also talked about how HUGE 2ch is in Europe again, and how vinyl is coming back and bringing 2ch with it. Klipsch is not ignoring the 2ch market.

I think it's awesome that those of us on this board debate these things, but recognize that we are a small part of the potential market for Klipsch products overall. The work that Klipsch did to keep the Heritage line from dying in 1999-2000 (details in my soon-to-be-published interviews) should show very clearly that no one is forgetting PWK's legacy. Hell, people in the labs say things like "Are you sure we should be toying with The Man's speaker?"

As I told Jim in the interview, one of the reasons I wanted to do this is to let the hardcore fans (that's us) air these thoughts out. I hope I'm not making it worse.

[DrWho]

I think the problem is everyone wants to have or know or have heard the best speaker ever....the problem is two different tools are getting compared, when niether is really better considering the different functionality...

[JBryan]

Nice interview - thanks Damon! Lots of good information and well presented.

The only comments that gave me pause were when Chris said " ...they [the palladiums] don't sound at all like horns, which is a real achievement..." Who does he think he is and why is he still working at Klipsch?! ;- ) Calling the Jubilee a "rogue" and the Klipschorn "ugly" didn't bother me at all... as its pretty accurate depending on your perspective. Klipsch being perceived by the US market as a "mid-fi" company is probably being kind considering that most folks listen to Klipsch speakers hooked up to their computers and their exposure is limited to the lines that Best Buy carries. In that context, "taking it to the next level" isn't much of a reach.

Finally, I understand why Jim said that the Palladium and Klipsch will finally be in the conversation when folks discuss the best speakers built but I do recall Klipsch already being in that conversation - albeit a few decades ago and by folks who didn't really put much emphasis on the cosmetics - but then, I don't think they were trying to adorn the best-sounding speakers with the 'Hi-Fi' label either. When PWK started deigning Khorns, his goal was to make a speaker that would sound as close to live music as possible. What he came up with, only an engineer would love and I'm sure he would've sold quite a few more if he had designed them with cosmetics and the WAF in mind but the final product would have been more compromised. Today's audio market is full of beautifully-compromised designs that sell very well. Here's hoping that Klipsch knows the difference and keeps its soul intact.

I'm not bitter - just having some fun...."Klipsch Rocks!"

[Deang]

I think the problem is everyone wants to have or know or have heard the best speaker ever....the problem is two different tools are getting compared, when niether is really better considering the different functionality...

No one is debating which speaker is "better" or which is/should be the "flagship" (at least not in this thread). What's being discussed is the exact meaning of J. Garrett's comments. There is a misconception that the Jubilee is somehow "incomplete" because it doesn't have veneer and isn't being wheeled out of the consumer division with a 300% markup.

The question was clear and the response was equally clear -- I'm struggling to see what I took out of context!

[IndyKlipschFan]

"but several times it was mentioned that this new product was now going
to let Klipsch be in the same league with a very high end market. There
was almost a defensiveness about this. I find this interesting, since I
always assumed that the Klipschorn, especially in the 1950s and 1960s,
was generally considered to be in that small esoteric league of "high
end equipment". They made it sound like Klipsch was never more
than mid-fi equipment."

To most in a Best Buy world... I can see where this is true. But even "Magnolialand" inside a Best Buy, is a good start to introduce people to starting to look at the upper Klipsch lineup. (I am sure some people are intimidated to even go in there as well.) A good Synergy System set up, while to some might be mid fi to some people really does sound quite good! (especially with 2 subs. If you really love this hobby and have some more $$, of course the reference and now the Palladium will provide an even better WOW factor.

We all have our biases, and that is ok too. Just like a woman to a man, we all have our ideal one of perfection!

[LarryC]

Dr. Who, you have mail.

Larry

[Chris A]

What, because Garrett called the Jubilee a "rogue...not really a real product...not finished...doesn't count...?" I think Jubilee owners are beyond caring what anyone thinks. I'll tell you what though, if PWK wasn't rolling in grave before he is now.

You need to put those comments in context, ie the Jubilee Never Went Into Production for Klipsch in a Home Version. It has no official components, measurements, specs, design, materials, voicing, etc etc because nothing was ever finalized. That is what was meant by that, and he's right.

Let's not get into the millionth argument about this product, please. Exactly ZERO people would know for absolute certain what PWK would think.

Reminds me of a quote from Pride and Prejudice: "...Madam, you have a very small garden..."

[Amy]

Reminds me of a quote from Pride and Prejudice: "...Madam, you have a very small garden..."

I understand, and I apologize if I am coming across as harsh and unwilling to allow others to voice their opinion. Most people who know me know I am very lenient on this forum. I just get frustrated from the arguments that appear here over and over.

There's more to it than that, of course, but I will resume my role as moderator instead of contributor.

Thank you!

[BLSamuel]

Fascinating. Thanks Damon. A very nice interview.

[NOSValves]

Exactly ZERO people would know for absolute certain what PWK would think.

Ain't that the truth......