jacksonbart Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Maybe, but what do you expect a gun to do when you pull the trigger? True, but he didn't pull the trigger on purpose. He had a Glock stuck in his pants, and it jiggled loose -- it went off as he tried to stop it from going down his pants. Actually, the whole incident could have been averted if he'd had the gun in a holster. I do have one question about the whole incident.... Given that it was a Glock... just what got caught on the trigger?..... I believe it was a bag of frozen peas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryO Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 "Dean, I wonder if you may have opened up another subject for pages of arguement along the lines of other Klipsch forum mainstays like CD / Vinyl or SS / Tube or many of the other equipment issues (where I usually have no idea what you guys are talking about)" lol, you can see from Harry's last post that the thread could easily go in that direction. "You win Harry. I've never been in combat or received any training as an armourer. I'm just going on practical experience specific to me -- which is restricted to time on range with paper targets. My guns are always clean and I always use new brass -- and after thousands of rounds over the course of 30 years, I've never experienced a failure from either type weapon. But yeah, I can see how sand or dirt in a cylinder could cause a real problem for a revolver that wouldn't impact the functioning of good semi-auto." I'm not trying to win anything. The post was originally about 1911 models which I'm familiar with. Practice promotes familiarity. If you're going to carry a firearm and practice for defense I strongly suggest practicing/training on an urban combat course. This is the most critical training you can have. Most people I know including military and police have no business with a firearm. They could desperately use the urban combat course to hone their skills so they will be safe with a firearm. I'm sure this will stir the pot but it's the truth. Take the course and see how much you don't know. Firearms are forever. PERIOD!!! Harry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSport Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Maybe, but what do you expect a gun to do when you pull the trigger? True, but he didn't pull the trigger on purpose. He had a Glock stuck in his pants, and it jiggled loose -- it went off as he tried to stop it from going down his pants. Actually, the whole incident could have been averted if he'd had the gun in a holster. I do have one question about the whole incident.... Given that it was a Glock... just what got caught on the trigger?..... ...just the tip...[] Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSport Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Harry...sad to say but I agree with you...many have no business around firearms and the even sadder part is many others assume that they know what they're doing... Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy W Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Maybe, but what do you expect a gun to do when you pull the trigger? True, but he didn't pull the trigger on purpose. He had a Glock stuck in his pants, and it jiggled loose -- it went off as he tried to stop it from going down his pants. Actually, the whole incident could have been averted if he'd had the gun in a holster. Sounds fishy to me, but yes, a holster is the only safe way to carry a loaded gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 with everyone owning a gun on this forum I am going to need to start sporting a bullet proof vest full time Other than not having enough practice, I don't think the guys on here are the ones you need to worry about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me Loves Khorns Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Dean, On an audio forum aren't we supposed to have a speaker in the background at least? Bob Bob, that really was too funny!!! Maybe some old tubes or something. Now, shooting old burned out tubes could be fun! Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me Loves Khorns Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Does anyone have any experience with the HK USP's, especially the compacts? In the 45 or 9? Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSport Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Like anything HK...very high quality and like so many things German...overbuilt...I find them a bit expensive for the intended purpose but that hasn't stopped me from buying other expensive pistols so that is no criticism...when I used to carry SiGs for duty, the HK was a natural progression when I wanted a high Capacity .45ACP but I went another route...still...very nice...the only HK I own (or have owned) is a P7... Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 Pretty much what I think too. I probably wouldn't have said overbuilt, but extremely well built -- and bulky. I believe the USP is being phased out, some calibers have already been discontinued. Their hot item right now is the HK45C. http://www.hk-usa.com/hk45c_general.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSport Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 ...sorry...mostly speaking of the P7...squeeze cocker...very accurate and low bore axis...my boss carries the HK 45C...he like it very much... Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Does anyone have any experience with the HK USP's, especially the compacts? In the 45 or 9? Paul I have the USP in 9mm and 45. Both work very well for me. I will probably keep the .45 and sell the 9mm at some point. I've reduced the "gonna' keep these in my inventory when I retire" down to 1 x M4A3; 1 x MP5 (perfect for home defense....); 1 x Mosberg M500 12 gauge (nice mil version, parkerized, extended tube, etc.) and the HK USP in 45 cal. The HK is a very accurate pistol, as are most of the others. I've had no problems with ammo, and generally shoot 230 grain, FMJ "Blazer" during practice. Duty ammo is "Gold Dot", but it's expensive and we only shoot one or two mags of that stuff every 90 days. Weapon is extremely easy to break down, clean and re-assemble, etc. Never had a single misfire (yet...) and would likely be the result of a defective round if it occurred. We also practice with fake "stovepipe" jams, "round did not go off" drills, etc. all the time to make sure clearing and relocking a round is second nature. That being said.... I may sell the 45 and eventually buy a Springfield Armory 1911 to keep after I retire. I'd install a Wilson trigger and a high quality guide rod with a better bushing and that's about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twistedcrankcammer Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 with everyone owning a gun on this forum I am going to need to start sporting a bullet proof vest full time, just please don't shoot me in the head or groin. AWwww Damnnnit!!! I was planning on shooting you in the "TOP NOTCH"!!! Roger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryO Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Does anyone have any experience with the HK USP's, especially the compacts? In the 45 or 9? Paul I have the USP in 9mm and 45. Both work very well for me. I will probably keep the .45 and sell the 9mm at some point. I've reduced the "gonna' keep these in my inventory when I retire" down to 1 x M4A3; 1 x MP5 (perfect for home defense....); 1 x Mosberg M500 12 gauge (nice mil version, parkerized, extended tube, etc.) and the HK USP in 45 cal. The HK is a very accurate pistol, as are most of the others. I've had no problems with ammo, and generally shoot 230 grain, FMJ "Blazer" during practice. Duty ammo is "Gold Dot", but it's expensive and we only shoot one or two mags of that stuff every 90 days. Weapon is extremely easy to break down, clean and re-assemble, etc. Never had a single misfire (yet...) and would likely be the result of a defective round if it occurred. We also practice with fake "stovepipe" jams, "round did not go off" drills, etc. all the time to make sure clearing and relocking a round is second nature. That being said.... I may sell the 45 and eventually buy a Springfield Armory 1911 to keep after I retire. I'd install a Wilson trigger and a high quality guide rod with a better bushing and that's about it. The HK line is "Top Notch" (to borrow the phrase) I wouldn't sell any of my extras unless replaced by another "personal" piece.I'd be all over the HK 9mm from Marshall if I needed another one. HEY, Marshall, you around? Harry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twistedcrankcammer Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 My opinion, but the 9mm is a womens wepon. I had a good friend that died about 8 years back when he was 74 years old. Al was the one who taught me to reload for accuracy. Al was a master sergant in the army and was in on the battle of the buldge, fighting in hedge rows all the way up through the surrender of germany. Al picked up a Thompson sub machine gun early in the war, and through away his M-1 30 carbine. He got the Thomson off of a dead English officer, as the US gave them to the Brits, but he couldn't get one as a sergant. Al told many stories of guys getting up and still fighting with several round of 9mm Parabelum in them, but he said he never saw anyone get up after being hit with a >45. As for Gun MNFRGs. I wouldn't have an S&W shoved up myARS sideways with the stance they have taken with the gun grabber group. Ruger and Tarus have the absolute best waranties in the country PERIOD. I have a friend with one of the Tarus 9mm that was made on the old Bereatta tooling. New shooter, bought Gun Show reloads. Some were double charged compressed loads and others were empty primered brass. He didn't know any better and ended up with a stuck slide on a bulged barrel with 8 rings in the bore. Taurus replaced everything damaged with all new parts, no questions asked. That friend has a buddy that bought the blued Bereta at the same time and they both went shooting at the same time. He screwed up the Beretta in similar fashion. The Berretta cost more in blued then the basically identical Tarus in stainless. Beretta charged him more then half of what he had paid for the gun to fix his!! I have a 1971 Ruger M-77 in 7mm Rem Mag that belonged to Al that he wanted me to have before he died. Al had dropped the gun on a Mulie hunt out west in the mountains and the stock had been cracked and glued/refinished. The gun was well warn from many hunts but extremely accurate. After Als death, I sent it to ruger to have a reblue and new stock put on it. Ruger reblued the barrel, put a new trigger gaurd and sill plate on it, and a new stock. My only complaint is that they put a new stock trigger in as well because the orriginal trigger had been worked and was below factory pull specs. Charge for all of that Zero $, nada. I have a Ruger Stainless RedHawk with custom Hogue Wood grips, 4 power fixed silver Leupold scope, a Lazer, and trigger work. I have shot many 10s of thousands of rounds through that pistol. I used to shoot it at least once a week, and I usually shoot between 300 and 800 rounds each time out. I have 1400 loads loaded at all time out of the same orriginal order of brass for consistancy. I have tried over 800 variations of loads through that gun, and have shot a 12 shot group at 150 yards at the rage off of sandbags, not a rest, that I covered all 12 shots wiyh my clenched fist. That RedHawk likes HOT rounds, the hotter the more accurate. I am shooting a 265 Gr Lead semi Wadcutter with Gas Check with 21.3 Grains of 2100. This is way off of the chart for a 250 Gr bullet, let alone a 265Gr. bullet. I have several friends with .500 S&Ws and my .44 is louder and has more recoil then any of the factory ammo they have shot through their .500s, It actually scared a femail I know who owns a .500 Smith, and she said "I don't like shooting that". I shot the gun so much like this, and believe a .44 colt or S&W would blow up in your face with my loads, but I shot it until the trigger gaurd came loose and messed up the brushed finish at the parting line where it joins to the frame. My primers back out to the point that they flatten out and no longer have a smooth curve arround the perimiter, the firing pin dimple actuall gets pushed back outward into the firing pin hole. Anyhow at the same time I had shot the trigger gaurd loose, I had also swaged the dowel pin that the firing pin comes through to the point that the firing pin was stuck in the out position. I sent it to Ruger, they replaced all damaged parts, rebrushed the finish on the entire gun, x-rayed it for metal fatigue, test fired it, and sent it back, NO CHARGE, NADA, FREE!! I don't no of anybody else that will fix damage clearly done by the owner for free. As for .45s, I have always wanted a real nice .45, but can't see paying close to what I payed for my .475 Wildey for one though. A good shooting .38 special has always been on my to get list. Roger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSport Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 9MM gets a black eye from a lot of people BUT in modern loadings especially...the 9MM is no slouch...some who plan for a battle, like the capacity idea...I lean more to the bigger hole in lets more blood out school but would never feel undergunned with "only" a 9MM...many believe that the 9MM is ballistically superior to the .38 special...Colt Government .45ACP with two extra mags may be 22 roundsand a GLOCK 17 with the same two extra mags might be 52... Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 A high capacity 9mm with some good "hot" ammunition will do quite a fine job..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacksonbart Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Shit, if you're worried about a revolver or a glock nine failing at some point..... Aren't you better served by moving to a safer place.... I mean what the ****!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groomlakearea51 Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Sergeant Confucious Say: "When going to a gun fight... take two guns...." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 ***, if you're worried about a revolver or a glock nine failing at some point..... Aren't you better served by moving to a safer place.... I mean what the ***!!! Good point! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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