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Scratched off a listing on my "Bucket List." Tailgating in the parking lot of the Rose Bowl at the 2010 BCS Championship game. We lost the game, however the trip was a dream come true.... We really started the day early......

I pulled the trigger on a couple of amps, I have 2 parasound HCA-1000A's and have one amp on each speaker. Forgot what you call it, but my thoughts are I am not really jumping up and down because it sounds soooo much better.....it will play louder and has a less "strained" sound...... still not up on the audio lingo but am assuming thats headroom. The HF seems to be not as smooth. It seems when you go so far with any system, you have to spend big bucks to improve!!! I think I am at that point, it upsets me as I have had several pairs of speakers over the last few years and I am thinking the forte II's where my favorite....sold them and bought the rf7's and was feeling like I took a step backwards, however it has motivated me to upgrade about everything in my system now. I will say adding the parasounds was a huge improvement over the yammie. I turned my sub down by at least an 1/8th turn and turned the treble up!!! I have a HCA750 run in mono for the RC7 (for now, may bi amp it in the same manner as the mains...ran out of cables!!)) and would never think of putting it back on the AVR. I think at this point I would love to find a nice black pair of 83's or maybe klf30's to play with. I love bass and the fortes would deliver in that area and where smooth as silk. The rf7 is on the bright side although on the parasound, they sound way smoother. Has anyone else bi amped and thought it was a day and night difference? I am using 1 amp left on lf and right on hf, one amp, 1 speaker, seems a guy said on here.... morey james? I think? thats the best route to go and was pretty easy to do....or do I have that wrong? After proof reading this, I am thining I am totally happy with the way it sounds and the volumes I can achieve..... I am upset because I enjoy the hunt of that new piece, the one I can have shipped cost effective. Not like finding 83's in denver with $300 shipping which is not worth it as chances are they will show up damaged!!! I feel like I need to start over!! I guess I have the "bug" !!! Upgradeitis!! Is that a word?

All good advice so far. I've had the RF62 system and heard the RF82s. Good speakers but like Derrick, I'm curious as to the room size and layout...that's going to play a huge role in how the system performs. I assume that since you want to hang surrounds that it isn't open to the sides or back. What are the dimensions though? Truth be told, the step up from the RF52 to the RF62 is much larger than the step from the RF62 to RF82. With the right sub, I doubt you'd hear a huge difference. Scrappy has owned them all and has posted pictures detailing the size difference. For my money (depending on room size and shape), I'd probably save the extra cash and get the RF62s/RC62 a pair of RS52 and a pair of RB61s. But...it all depends on the room... Best wishes on putting the system together.

If RF-7's are a step backwards from Forte's, then your ear may prefer 3 way speakers. Nothing wrong with that. A good way to find out is to try a pair of Heresy's and a good sub. Improvement is subjective to the listener. Before spending tons more money you might do some soul searching. I have upgradeitis too, and it can break the bank. Well you may be right!! I would love to have both as I do like my rf7's but the fortes where very much my fav. However the towers have a cleaner more modern apeal That is why I thought the KLF 30's would be worth a try. I live in a small town so I dont have anyone that I know of close to me for a listen!! I buy based on reviews and places like this!! I do have a dealer close to me but all the discontinued speakers I go from memory in years passed. I do have a freind that has the KLF20's and like them. The 83's just look great, never heard them but had a pair of 82's that I really liked!! but then again... they are a different beast, could a guy assume that if I liked the 82's I would love the 83's...or since I thought the KLF20's sounded pretty good the 30's have to sound better!!!! how do we really know untill we have them in our space with our electronics..... its just the way it is!!!

Not sure what you mean by 'Passive Bi-amping', I hope you are not confusing Bi-wiring from Bi-amping with a Passive Crossover between the Mid/high drivers. I am running an active Crossover between the Bass Bins and Midrange/Tweeters. But a Passive between the Mids and Tweeters. I have an active crossover between the Bass Bins and the Mids/tweeter. Biggest improvement in a Decade for me.

I think vertical bi amp but not sure.... What is passive? no active xo. I have the rxa1000 left channel going to one amp say to the right input on the amp, then the parasound has a daisy chain output or loop....i took another rca cable and went into the left channel, So on one amp the left runs the HF and right runs the LF and ditto on the second parasound. What do you call that? Not a huge gain in sound quality...as a matter of fact the more I listen I think the HF has become dirty...grainy....garbled. The bass and volume has improved tho......should I try something else?

No reason: http://jacksonville.craigslist.org/ele/4260238074.html

No affil.: http://pensacola.craigslist.org/ele/4259509534.html *Deleted*

Nolo comprende: http://pensacola.craigslist.org/ele/4267485806.html Make offer

He's got the specs of the RF-82 but a pic of the RF-82ii.

No affil.: http://dothan.craigslist.org/ele/4256539783.html OBO...

Of course the 82's may dictate upgrading surrounds/center...?

Works well as it hides thin or missed spots.

It would be a nice upgrade for you over the 62's, IMLimitedO

Is this also helpful for the La Scala II? I think the LSII is about 3 inches taller than the original LS. Does the LSII also benefit from risers, or is the tweeter/midrange height already elevated sufficienctly in the taller LSII cabinet? Thanks.

Thanks guys for you help. Would the rf-82ii be good?

The ugly duckling has been warm all day playing sweet sounds through the house. Knocking out the honey-do list while I got the house to myself. On my way to the hardware store to pick some things up. Thought about doing a trial Mdf build of the ported riser to the lsi's today if time permits

I used Duratex on my Lab 12 build, and it turned out nice. I used the plain white vinyl spackle they recommended to fill screw holes, and did not have any problems. I did notice that the Duratex did not cover as well, where there was any glue residue from the PL glue I used had been wiped off. This was on the inside and did not affect my results. I would use vinyl spackle to fill, and sand any excess glue spots off. Vinyl spackle shrinks as it dries, so you may have to do some spots several times. If you have a thick spot of spackle,just give it plenty of time to dry and check for shrinkage. If you need to use a primer, use the one they recommend. Bill

you should ask yourself 1 thing about sound stage and that is do you prefer 3d or 2d, the khorns excel in everything except 3d sound stage (in other words sound appearing to come from behind the speakers) they will present an ultra wide sound stage but everything stops at the rear wall they are placed against (at least that was my impression on all 4 pair i have owned) i have had lascalas at least 3 feet off the back wall and they would present a nice deep sound stage but of course the bass suffered (subwoofer solved this, but thats another big hunt for a good sub, that sounds good musically. Not just a boom maker)

I've always liked this pic. Would have loved to be in the desert listening, but I didn't take this.

I don't know how in depth you are going with the build but if you have to finish walls then don't forget to run some extra wiring to future proof your build if you do ever plan to venture into 9.1,11.1,projectors, networking, or lighting. Even if you don't run your wire you can still drop in some pathways( conduit, PVC, smurfpipe) and string to pull them through later.

If RF-7's are a step backwards from Forte's, then your ear may prefer 3 way speakers. Nothing wrong with that. A good way to find out is to try a pair of Heresy's and a good sub. Improvement is subjective to the listener. Before spending tons more money you might do some soul searching. I have upgradeitis too, and it can break the bank.

Are you using passive bi-amping or do you have a active xo? The gains from passive bi-amping may be minimal to none. If you are looking to spend money to improve the sound in your room, consider room treatments.

Which sub do you recommend? They are giving that sub for $100. Also, get 4 rs-52 ii instead of the 62ii?if your doing 7.1 get rs-52 for sides surrounds and RB-61 for rear surrounds. That's the ideal 7.1 configuration. What is your budget for a subwoofer?

How about a pic of the room, maybe it doesn't seem practical to you. But we may have better ideas if we see what we are working with.

Monoprice. 12 guage. In wall. Done. Next make sure you give mike at acoustic sound design a call. He will smoke any deal you have found and get you the rf-62ii theater for super cheap. And if steer away from that sub unless they practically give it to you. Get something from Svs or hsu or another ID company.

Done! You will be the first to know.

http://columbia.craigslist.org/ele/4259508871.html They look pretty nice. No affiliation.

Well group, I am worn out from a road trip today to Roanoke, Texas. I found a fellow that specializes in restoring old/antique fans. He just complete a job for me on this Emerson Electric fan (a total going over with a clean-up and new wiring). It works great now. I decided to not "restore it completely" as I wanted to keep the patina that was already evident on the fan. A good fan is a must if you live in Texas. Therefore, following the "drag" of driving through the Dallas area (and still having to drive through ice), I've decided to have a beverage. Please Gary don't laugh.... Always serve chilled.... LOL...

Try placing some small wooden blocks temporarily under all 4 legs of the sub and elevate the sub cable off the floor (with a non conductive material). That should rule out static as an issue.

I keep contact with two people who are using 45 SET amps. They have 1.5 watts. They report room filling sound with no issues. I don't see how that's possible with ANY crossover using that type of amp, but that's what they're reporting.

I don't know what happened to Dennis. Maybe he's just tired of talking about this topic. I mean, you can only say the same thing so many times before you just throw your hands up. http://forum.speakerplans.com/16ohm-hf_topic74463_page1.html In your hypothetical problem -- aberrations in the amplitude response caused by the impedance peaks should be reduced. A swamping resistor is just one way of dealing with the problem. I'm sure you're familiar with conjugate networks, which are widely used in many fine sounding loudspeakers including the Jubilee and modern version of the Klipschorn and LaScala. I don't see what all the fuss is about, at least we still use an autoformer. So there is one resistor, big deal. The proof is in the sound, and so far it is has been preferred by every single person who has audtioned it. There has been one exception, and that person preferred the sound of the Type AA with Jensen paper in oil capacitors, and we all know how terrible those are. With so many trying different horns and drivers, the ability to attenuate is a useful feature, and so far, "the tradeoff" seems more imagined than real. In fact, it would seem the use of a swamping resistor really does help. "The fairly resonant decay signatures are typical of PA-style horns, and are caused by standing-waves reflecting from the sharp edge of the horn-mouth reflecting back into the horn and hitting the phase plug. The standing-waves are also responsible for the characteristic triple-peak seen in the impedance curves of most horns - which makes passive crossover design considerably more challenging for horns, thanks to the impedance variations." http://www.nutshellhifi.com/MLS/MLS3.html "You see that the value of mouth impedance will dictate the value of the throat impedance. As explained previously, there will usually be reflections at the mouth, and depending on the phase and magnitude of the reflected wave, it may increase or decrease the throat impedance. A horn with strong reflections will have large variations in throat impedance. Reflections also imply standing waves and resonance. To avoid this, it is important to terminate the horn correctly, so that reflections are minimized." https://www.grc.com/acoustics/an-introduction-to-horn-theory.pdf "Optional component (Rs) is a shunt resistor placed across the driver to swamp impedance peaks, where required." http://www.pispeakers.com/Pi_Speakers_Info.pdf At the resonance frequency of 37 Hertz, Lowther driver have a large peak in impedance. This occurs in the same range that many output transformers see a peak in their reactance. The combined effect causes poor power transfer to the speakers because the impedance is too high. Often a high quality 50 ohm resistor in parallel with the drive may lower the speaker impedance in the resonance range sufficiently to allow better power transfer. I suggest you use a Mills non-inductive wire wound resistor. http://www.lowther-america.com/tweaks.htm

Jensen is the only current production PIO I've heard. I preferred the Type A with the Apollos, but that doesn't mean that's what everyone else is going to prefer with their particular set up. For example, Bruce likes the DHA2 and Super AA, while Jay prefers the ALK (he also uses the 45).

For what it's worth, Dean made a set of crossovers for me using PIO caps and all I'll say is they surpass anything else I've tried in my Klipsch Heritage speakers. They sound open, dynamic and natural, without a hint of being overly bright. Every other capacitor I've tried sounded way too sterile. Dean's crossovers cured that problem! Dean knows how to build outstanding crossovers. IMHO, if you want great tube gear, Craig's the guy. If you want great crossovers Dean's the guy. They both know how to make Klipsch Heritage speakers sound great! Cheers! Jeff

Here is what Paul Klipsch had to say about impedance. He was defending the use of the autotransformer which raises impedance instead of using resistive attenuation. Bob Crites DFH Impedance.pdf

Attached is page 3 from Richard Heyser's review of the Klipschorn - the plots show the complex impedance. The following link is from Stereophile's review of the Cary CAD-300SEI (single-ended integrated). http://www.stereophile.com/content/cary-audio-design-cad-300sei-integrated-amplifier-measurements Based on the information from these two sources, what does one think the frequency response of a Heritage speaker might look like driven by one of these type amplifilers (single-ended, zero feedback)? Review page 3 of 6.pdf

Mike, Thanks for the question... From what I have heard on here and understand, tube amp performance can greatly benefit with more stable load than most crossovers provide. Since the impedance can vary greatly, porviding a constant impedance (or nearly so) helps a lot. This isn't quite as big a problem with larger PP amps, but SET amps can use all the help they can get. This will also provide a more even freq. response. I know that's not very technical, but most of what I understand. Perhaps Dean could add to this. I think most of Al K's networks are also constant impedance. Bruce

First off, I am making a comparison between three different crossovers. In 2006, when I first got my '89 La Scalas, I found the original AL crossovers to be terrible to my ears. Fortunately, John Albright loaned me a pair of ALK Universals (I think) until I was able to build a pair of crossovers he designed for his brother. These have had a few changes, but are pretty much designated DHA2 crossovers. I have been living with these crossovers for a few years now. The woofer, and mid driver on my LS are stock, while the tweeter has been replaced with an Eminence APT-150. This is the same driver that Bob Crites still uses, made by a Tonsil in Poland. I have it mounted on a baffle and physically aligned with the K55 at the back of the cabinet. These are powered by my Welborne Labs Moondog 2A3 amplifiers. The preamp used is a JMA Merlin, a gift from forum members when my wife was struggling with Stage 4 Melanoma. CDs only for the testing, the CDP being a late '80s JVC model. I traded my AL crossovers for a pair of battery biased AAs done by Speakerfritz, and after checking to make sure the batteries were still good, swapped them into the LS. The battery biased ones that Speakerfritz sent to me aren't balanced. The mids are way too hot (Tom Brennan would agree!), meaning I have to turn the gain way down, then the bass seems nonexistent. This is probably due to them not being a constant impedance, and my 2A3 amps don't like them. I only left these in for an evening of listening, and then put in Dean's Super AA crossovers. These have bypass caps installed. Wow! So very smooth and a sound very, very similar to my DHA2 crossovers. As Dean pointed out to me, the main thing I might hear is the difference between a 3rd order (Super AA) and 1st order (DHA2) on the tweeter. For sure, at first I thought something was wrong, as the tweeters didn't seem to have much signal coming through them. Still, they sounded really, really good, the balance from bottom to top works very well. Transients are great, and don't seem squished, even with the Moondogs turned up. I haven't pulled out my DHA2s to check my tap settings, but I know that I have the mids pulled down some, which makes the bass seem a lot more full. The Supper AAs and DHA2s are constant impedance which seems to really help my low power tube amps. [After listening again to my DHA2 crossovers, the difference between the 3rd order and 1st order for the tweeters really stands out. With Dean's Super AA crossovers in place, you hear very little coming from the APT-150 tweeters. With the DHA2s, a lot more sound is coming out. ] On to the music. I started with some Bela Fleck and the Flecktones/UFO TOFU, Nora Jones/feels like home, Dave Weckl/Heads Up (cranked it up for the drumming!), Atlanta Symphony Orchestra w/Sibelius' 3rd and 7th symphonies - nice detail and sound stage. Pretty easy to pick out the placement of all the sections. Yo-Yo Ma, Edgar Meyer, Mark O'Conner/ Appalachia Waltz, Hilary Hahn/Mendelssohn & Shostakovich w/ Oslo Philharmonic Orchestra. One of my favorites is a Mercury Living Prescence CD, a 1958 recording of Respighi/Ancient Dances and Airs for Lute Suites 1, 2 & 3, with Antal Dorati. I actually listen to this three or four times a week, so I know how it sounds on my system. Other than the mids being a little hotter, the sound is as I am used to hearing it. I would certainly give a thumbs up to Dean's Super AA crossovers. They are a bit more complex than the DHA2s that I currently use (certainly built better), perhaps the addition of the bypass caps is helping. I can't fault them in any way. I am looking forward to my budeget allowing me to purchase a set of these for a second set of LS that I have been working on. Bruce