Maple RF-7's in the House

[InVeNtOr]

i have something else.....disreguard the color. you can't see the finish behind the false wall. since i have the 7's i know what is possible. i would stick with them. sell the 83's get more money, have it to play with the 7's, and do something fun with the family.

if you are asking for advice, that's mine. good luck, i am sure you will make the right decision for you.

[tragusa3]

I think keeping the mains and centers matching would be valuable in the long run. I'd probably make the decision based on that alone.

You say you hear an audible difference when the speakers are behind the false wall. What material are you using there? I can't tell any difference behind mine. Mine is Seymour AT screen material and GoM Anchorage.

It never fails that I find suprises on a first visit to someone else's room. All these subjective adjectives we throw around (I'm guiltier than most) can mean anything. That's why I love to hear comments where the comparisons are direct and in the same room, etc. This is fun!

[Zen Traveler]

I received an email from a forum member. Instead of retyping my final thoughts, here was my email to him.

... From what I've read, the DeanG makes them sound more like the RF-83's. LOL. Seems like most say that the RF-7's were harsh and the DeanG tames them back, which is what the RF-83's are by default....

Fwiw, Dean said his crossovers DON'T make the RF-7s sound like RF-83s. [:|]

[Fish]

Fish, I've never owned a Pre/Pro so i can't comment on that. I'm sure different components do play a role in how a speaker sounds. I'm using a PS3 where someone else maybe using an Oppo. Maybe one day way down the road, I might move to a Pre/Pro but frankly, they sound so good right now, I don't see any need whatsoever to "upgrade" to a Pre/Pro. I'm very content with the setup so far.

The difference in a ps3 and an oppo is minor compared to prepros, the most important after speakers to me.A good musical prepro(in a realistic budget) is what I spent 10 years looking for.All that matters in audio/video is the owner is content, when you get there then you can just enjoy, so enjoy!

PS. I would rather have a spotless pair of 83's than a rough pair of 7's.

[Youthman]

'Lovely troubles' you have there, Youthman, hehe. I wish i had problems like that: RF7 or RF-83?!

Danzo, Yes, it's a good problem to have. []

you shouldn't count the grills against the 7's. you should have them off in the first place behind that false wall. take the grills off and store them (in that false wall could be a good place) and don't think about them again.

InVeNtOR, that's exactly what I have done with the RF-83's and the RC-64 since I purchased them. Grills have never been on since I put them behind the false wall. The grills on the RF-83's and the RC-64 are stored within the false wall. But the reality is that I might not live in this house forever and if I do move into a home that does not have a dedicated HT, then the grills would likely stay on.

i have an idea, i'll trade plus cash my rc-7 for your rc-64! sound good? i thought so! i'll ship it out monday!

You wish [] I owned the RC-7 before I sold it and purchased the RC-64. The 64 is by far the best center I've ever owned.

i am stealing someone elses line......."Mmmmmmmm Maple......."

It's funny, I used to think "Maple....yuck." That is until I purchased these. I am VERY surprised at how stylish they look. Never in my wildest dreams would I have thought I would have liked that finish. I still prefer dark woods (Cherry and Mahogany), then Black and Maple, and at the bottom of my list Oak.

The caps, inductor are all above my head (zoom.....). Out of my knowledge base.

Great comparison exercises. I liked the way
you recorded the data in decibel ranges instead of just peaks.

Bill, yeah
it was difficult since the meter is always bouncing, depending on what
is being played. I had to try and replay the same section and monitor
the same beats or vocals and look at the "range" during that sequence.
It was a lot of fun.

FYI....I LOVE bananna plugs! This whole RF-7
vs RF-83 would not have happened if I did not have banana plugs. What a
convenience.

[]

How much would it be to ship a pair of RF-7's from Plant City to Kissimmee?

I
am licensed to "Marry and Bury". If you brought another set of
speakers home, I think I would be perfoming the later for you. LOL.

i have something else.....disreguard the color. you can't see the finish behind the false wall.

InVeNtOR, I still like having matching speakers (both color and timbre). The RC-7's have totally different drivers.

since i have the 7's i know what is possible.

I
have them too. [] I know that I would likely never change
components in any speaker system that I own. If it doesn't sound good
from the factory, I would rather purchase another set of speakers than
to tinker with it. That's just me. I just have no desire to change
xovers, capacitors etc. It's just not my thing.

[quote
user=InVeNtOR]sell the 83's get more money, have it to play with the
7's, and do something fun with the family.

I haven't
checked recently but I'm sure the 83's are going for more than the 7's
but the Lord has blessed us financially...mostly due to paying off our
debts, no more car payments, no credit cards etc. That's what allows us
to do something fun with the family. Dave Ramsey has been a key
instrument on helping us to get to where we are with our finances. I'm
by no means wealthy...(youth pastor and teacher's salary), we just don't
have payments other than our house and a piece of property we purchased
before buying our home. Being debt free (other than our home) has been
a huge blessing.

I agree. I prefer to have a system that is not mix matched and was designed from the beginning to play together.

[quote
user=tragusa3]You say you hear an audible difference when the
speakers are behind the false wall. What material are you using there?
I can't tell any difference behind mine. Mine is Seymour AT screen
material and GoM Anchorage.

Tragusa3, it's not my projection screen
that I'm referring to. I do not have an AT screen (have considered
upgrading to one). The difference in sound is because the speakers are
tucked away in a corner behind the "doors" of the false wall. Because
of the space constraints and the depth of the RF-83's, I cannot toe them
in as much as I would like. With them being in a "pocket", it somehow
affects the sound. If I removed the doors, I could move the front edge
of the 83's to the front edge of the false wall and they would sound
much better. I know because that's the way I had them for a few weeks
until the cabinet guy came back to install the doors.

If you take a look at this part of my build thread,
you can see that the front of the speaker is close to the cabinet and
further out from the back wall and side wall than in the photo below
taken behind the door. I currently have to have them there so they can
clear the door and fire through the screen.

That's why I love to hear comments where the
comparisons are direct and in the same room, etc. This is fun!

This definitely has been fun and educational for me. This hobby is great!

Fwiw, Dean said his crossovers DON'T make the RF-7s sound like RF-83s.

Tkdamerica, my
bad, I can't speak for Dean since I've never heard them for myself.
Only going by what I've read from others. I stand corrected. My bad. []

All that matters in audio/video is the owner is
content, when you get there then you can just enjoy, so enjoy!

Fish, [Y][Y] I'm there bro. Just chillin' [H]

I
really only have a few more things I want to do (acoustic treatments,
install step lights, IR Repeater so my lights can be controlled even if
I'm not pointing the remote at them, possibly remove the doors from the
false wall, possibly get an AT screen so I can move my center down
lower, and maybe add a second Velodyne HGS15 sub just for kicks). None
of those items are critical and if I didn't do any of them, I would
still be satisfied with my system. It's turned out by far, better than
anything I ever dreamed I would own.

PS. I would rather have a spotless pair of 83's than a rough pair of 7's.

Yeah, I'm the same way. I'm very meticulous and OCD when it comes to my gear. I take excellent care of my gear. I keep the original boxes. When I painted the room, I put the RF-83's in their original box just to move them into the other room. LOL So yes, I prefer to buy and own mint or in great condition gear.

[Rivernuggets]

This is a great thread! Been on the fence about purchasing an SPL meter. Gotta get me one a them.

I wish I could keep both pair

It sounds like the 83s win by a hair of a hair. Would you be able to store the RF-7s for one of your kids? It might be a long way off, but hey, continuing his/her education beyond high school with 7s can only help. []

[dtel]

Youthman, sorry if i missed it but how are you switching back and forth ?

Are you changing the wires from speaker to speaker or just switching on the receiver ?

I only ask because the less time between the switch the easier it is to hear the difference. Not as good but still helpful If nothing else use L and R for each speaker.

Sorry if I just missed how you were doing it.

[Youthman]

Been on the fence about purchasing an SPL meter. Gotta get me one a them.

I bought mine awhile back from a forum member. He had 15 or so of them that he was selling. Believe I paid $15. Great investment and a fun toy too.

Would you be able to store the RF-7s for one of your kids? It might be a long way off, but hey, continuing his/her education beyond high school with 7s can only help.

Yeah, the only one that might appreciate them would be my son. He's 11. I offered awhile back to give him my RB-35's for his room but at this point, he's satisfied with the speakers from his TV. LOL

but hey, continuing his/her education beyond high school with 7s can only help.

When I was in High School, my first speaker purchase was a pair of Technics (3 way with 10" driver). Then I traded them in at Circuit City for a pair of DCM (3 way with 12" speaker). They had tons of slam and were very descent speakers. I couldn't imagine being in HS or College with a pair of RF-7's.

sorry if i missed it but how are you switching back and forth ?

Just
good ole fashioned banana plugs. I listen to a section of music,
pause, rewind, switch speakers and relisten. I don't have a switchbox
or anything. Manual switching them.

I only ask because the less time between the switch the easier it is to hear the difference.

Takes about 15 seconds to do the swap and hit play again.

Not as good but still helpful If nothing else use L and R for each speaker.

Yeah,
I don't think that would be too good of a test to use an RF-83 on one
side and an RF-7 on the other. Guess if you didn't have banana plugs,
that might be a last resort.

[Youthman]

Sorry if I just missed how you were doing it.

No problem. I mentioned it on page 3

FYI....I LOVE bananna plugs! This whole RF-7
vs RF-83 would not have happened if I did not have banana plugs. What a
convenience.

[Youthman]

Been on the fence about purchasing an SPL meter. Gotta get me one a them.

Man...now I know why I waited so long to buy one. I just looked on Ebay and the cheapest is $36. It's no wonder why I jumped on it when the forum member had them for $15 - $20. They even have some on Ebay for $300 - $400 but I believe they are much more than just an SPL Meter. Think they have a spectrum analyzer as well.

[CECAA850]

It would be time consuming but I'd be interested if there was a difference in SPL readings and subjective findings if speaker locations were swapped. Placement can make a huge difference.

[Youthman]

It would be time consuming but I'd be interested if there was a difference in SPL readings and subjective findings if speaker locations were swapped. Placement can make a huge difference.

I thought the same thing and even mentioned that in one of my posts. I just might have to give it a try before putting them up for sale. I don't think it would take too much time since I documented pretty well what parts to test. I too would be curious if the readings change after swapping the speakers.

[Youthman]

I've swapped the speakers and am about to head to the HT to do the final testing to see what differences I hear. My guess is the bass of the RF-7's will be increased and the bass in the RF-83's will slightly decrease.

[Youthman]

I just finished redoing the test with the RF-7's near the wall. I have included both the original Test 1 (RF-83's near the wall) and the Test 2 (RF-7's near the wall) so you don't have to flip back and forth between the original post and this one.

For the most part, the midrange, vocals did not change. As expected, the bass generally increased in the RF-7's and decreased with the RF-83's which would prove the concept that placing speakers near walls reinforces the lower frequencies.

I tried to remember the exact beats and notes I was listening to yesterday when doing my original testing. It might not pass scientific process but I think it's safe to say that it is a pretty fair test.

Nora Jones DVD - "One Flight Down"
(vocal section)

Test 1 with RF-83 Near Wall

RF-7 (90 - 94db)

RF-83 Near Wall(88 -92db)

Test 2 with RF-7 Near Wall

RF-7 (90 - 94db)

RF-83 Near Wall(88 -92db)

Michael Jackson's This is It - "Billy Jean"
(strong bass beat at the beginning of the song)

Test 1 with RF-83 Near Wall

RF-7 (96db - 98db)

RF-83 (96db - 99db)

Test 2 with RF-7 Near Wall

RF-7 (96db - 98db)

RF-83 (94db - 97db)

Eagles Hell Freezes Over DVD - "Hotel California"

With this one, I metered three sections of the very beginning of the song:

1) Dialogue where he says "For the record, we never broke up, we just
took a 14 year vacation"

Test 1 with RF-83 Near Wall

RF-7 - Vocal - (94db)

RF-83 - Vocal - (92db)

Test 2 with RF-7 Near Wall

RF-7 - Vocal - (94db)

RF-83 - Vocal - (92db)

2) Guitar Solo after above dialog

Test 1 with RF-83 Near Wall

RF-7 - Solo - (86-88db)

RF-83 - Solo - (84-86db)

Test 2 with RF-7 Near Wall

RF-7 - Solo - (86-88db)

RF-83 - Solo - (84-86db)

3) Conga beat after guitar solo

Test 1 with RF-83 Near Wall

RF-7 - Conga - (88-92db)

RF-83 - Conga - (89-94db)

Test 2 with RF-7 Near Wall

RF-7 - Conga - (89-93db)

RF-83 - Conga - (88-91db)

[CHASLS2]

I wonder how the 7's would compare with my RF63's? I've been looking for some RF7's local for a while now.

[Vital]

Thanks for taking the time to do the testing and share it with us here. I went thru the same thing when I picked up a pair of Chorus lls and Fortes. I put them against my RF-7s and at first I thought I liked the Chorus ll better but after a lot more testing my friend and I still prefer the RF-7 over all. I have not personally heard the RF-83s myself but the guy I bought my Chorus lls from had RF-83s and he sold them. He said the Chorus lls sounded better to him. I love the Chorus ll, Forte and RF-7 and they all have a place in my house lol. I'd like to hear the RF-83 someday as well as the KLF-30.

[Youthman]

I wonder how the 7's would compare with my RF63's? I've been looking for some RF7's local for a while now.

To be honest, I'm not sure. I've heard Bill Land's RF-63's but they had a sub hooked up to them. We didn't listen to them by themselves.

Maybe someone else can chime in with their thoughts.

[Youthman]

Thanks for taking the time to do the testing and share it with us here.

It was a lot of fun and I'm glad to share with everyone. I know this forum has been a wealth of knowledge to me so I thought I would contribute a very practical thread comparing the RF-7 and the RF-83.

I'd like to hear the RF-83 someday as well as the KLF-30.

I hear the KLF-30s are great speakers as well.

I enjoy listening to any Klipsch speakers whenever I get the opportunity.

So far I've had the priveledge of hearing:

Quartets, LaScalas, Fortes, Khorns
RF-83, RF-7, RF-63, RF-35
RB-35, RB-5
RS-52, RS-42, RS-35
RC-64, RC-7, RC-35
RT-10d, RSW-10d
CF-2

[CHASLS2]

My RF63's really rock with the DVD War of the worlds, you can feel the sound waves at half power from my Pioneer 1120k receiver, and this is without a sub.

I have gone from the SF3's to the RF82's and now have the RF63's. There was a big jump from the SF3's to the RF82's and another jump going to the RF63's. I just wonder how a big a jump going to the RF7's would be.

My setup is in a bedroom around 12x14ft.

[CECAA850]

Thanks for the second set of tests, it confirmed what I was thinking. It appears that they are pretty darn close in sensitivity.