Jubilee 53 at work

[Chris A]

Yea, I tried that, too.  But my listening distance isn't 25 feet away, as it apparently is for Mark (IIRC).  Convergence issues and vertical separation of tweeter vs. midrange driver centerlines means that, depending on whether you are sitting or standing, your time alignment of these two drivers is more than 90 degree of phase different.  I discarded that "enhancement".  My room is 40 feet long, and it sounded better in my listening position (about 10-12 feet) AND at the back of the room.

 

JC: I never knew what your listening distance was in your old house.

 

Perhaps you guys should fix some of your music, and it will sound better with one horn instead of two, too, 

Edited August 27, 2015 by Chris A

[jwc]

Yea, I tried that, too.  But my listening distance isn't 25 feet away, as it apparently is for Mark (IIRC).  Convergence issues and vertical separation of tweeter vs. midrange driver centerlines means that, depending on whether you are sitting or standing, your time alignment of these two drivers is more than 90 degree of phase different.  I discarded that "enhancement".  My room is 40 feet long, and it sounded better in my listening position (about 10-12 feet) AND at the back of the room.

 

JC: I never knew what your listening distance was in your old house.

 

Perhaps you guys should fix some of your music, and it will sound better with one horn instead of two, too, 

My new room is 35 x 35.

 

Old room was 28 x 22...used the long wall.

 

I'm letting go of my big horn setup for now.  My son and I are building cornscalas together on Saturday  Right now my kids are at the age that I need to spend my limited free time with them.  I know eventually I will have to go bigger.

 

I contacted Roy a few months ago.  He tells me there is no existence of a passive or active setup for the K402/510 combo for home use.  The network on the back of my setup was for behind the screen.  I didn't use it.

 

Congrats to the OP here.  I'm sure you will enjoy those big horns.

 

jc

[Chris A]

Right now my kids are at the age that I need to spend my limited free time with them.

 

Clearly I understand that - I took a 22-year break to raise kids, and forgot about audio...to support my kids with my limited spare time then.  Now I have time to invest. 

 

My flac music library is coming along--and even my son-in-law (he has his own band that's released several albums) and daughter (also a musician) hear the difference...and on music that also includes the music that I listened to in the 60s-90s, which is interesting.  They both say that most of the music today is, well, crap.  Funny...I remember saying that when I was young, too.

 

Chris

Edited August 27, 2015 by Chris A

[PrestonTom]

Unless the distance between the two mouths decreased by a factor of 2, the mouth diffraction problem that was discussed (above) is still with you, regardless of the drivers used or how many stiffeners are used internally.

 

I'm glad you "love them very much".  I think that they're pretty nice myself.

 

Chris

Chris and Mike: The OP has linked to some "misleading" images.

 

The top link (the "discontinued Jubilee") is an error. Look at the midrange section. That is not a K-402 with a 1133 driver.

 

BTW, the issue of the 2-way vs 3-way is an interesting one, but not for this thread.

[mark1101]

_{As you guys probably figured out, I am only getting a pair of 510 assemblies from JC to add to my 402s.}

 

_{The 510s are hard to come by, and I feel very lucky and am excited to be getting them.  No greed is involved.    I'm humbled.} 

 

_{I think the 2-way / 3-way is a matter of personal taste.  Based on our preferences and the music we each play,  plus all else involved, one could easily be preferred over the other.}

 

_{The 402 even alone in 2-way was significantly better than what I felt sounded next best............and that was some of these DIY home engineered wooden horns that have shown up over the years.  I think those are excellent and if I couldn't have the really big horns I'd be right into those instead.}

[Coytee]

If you look at the 402 pictures and notice the bug screen.

 

My recollection is, the K402 when mated with (I think) the K1133, the bug screen is back-set maybe 2-3 inches and not visible right at the junction of the mouth.

 

This is how we figured out that Ralph (in London) had the wrong parts.  I thought it was a defective setup with the screen missing, Roy realized that was the distance in front of the driver and asked to look on back to verify if it was a K69 or 1133.  It was a 1133.

 

These seem to have the screen at the mouth which would imply it's either a different driver than the 1133 or they've changed something and put the screen there when it used to not be there.

 

Anyone ever see a K1133 with a front screen verses recessed?  Am I off base here?

[mikebse2a3]

Unless the distance between the two mouths decreased by a factor of 2, the mouth diffraction problem that was discussed (above) is still with you, regardless of the drivers used or how many stiffeners are used internally.

I'm glad you "love them very much". I think that they're pretty nice myself.

Chris

Chris and Mike: The OP has linked to some "misleading" images.

The top link (the "discontinued Jubilee") is an error. Look at the midrange section. That is not a K-402 with a 1133 driver.

BTW, the issue of the 2-way vs 3-way is an interesting one, but not for this thread.

Hey Tom

My post was just to clarify that both KPT-KHJ-LF cabinet builds meet the same specifications requirments.

Whether 2-way or 3-way is chosen these are excellent reproduction systems.

miketn

Edited August 27, 2015 by mikebse2a3

[PrestonTom]

If you look at the 402 pictures and notice the bug screen.

 

My recollection is, the K402 when mated with (I think) the K1133, the bug screen is back-set maybe 2-3 inches and not visible right at the junction of the mouth.

 

This is how we figured out that Ralph (in London) had the wrong parts.  I thought it was a defective setup with the screen missing, Roy realized that was the distance in front of the driver and asked to look on back to verify if it was a K69 or 1133.  It was a 1133.

 

These seem to have the screen at the mouth which would imply it's either a different driver than the 1133 or they've changed something and put the screen there when it used to not be there.

 

Anyone ever see a K1133 with a front screen verses recessed?  Am I off base here?

Coytee, You missed my point. In the top link, the mid section horn looks like a KPT 305 (an 8inch driver on a K402-like horn) and not the K-402 with a 2 inch compression driver (1133 for instance).

 

Anyhow, all this is irrelevant to the OP's choice of a crossover point. After all, he is convinced that we are all idiots.

[Chris A]

I've got a KPT-305 in my hands, and I can say without a doubt that the picture shown by the OP here is a K-402 horn--not a KPT-305 assembly:

 

[PrestonTom]

I've got a KPT-305 in my hands, and I can say without a doubt that the picture shown by the OP here is a K-402 horn--not a KPT-305 assembly:

 

I was referring to his link to the "discontinued Jubilee". Again, the OP has stated a number of things that might confuse a potential Jubilee buyer. I was merely trying to clean things up a bit.

[Chris A]

Capisce.

 

Actually that's a KPT-XII (12 inch driver) module, now discontinued.  That's actually what threw me.

 

Chris

Edited August 27, 2015 by Chris A

[Coytee]

You both are still missing my point.  I apologize for being vague or confusing.  (as you know, I'm the dummy of the group)

 

If you look at HIS pictures, the K402 looks like it has a bug screen "at the mouth" just like it looks when a K69 is hanging on it.  When I was in London, visiting Ralph, his had a "tube" there (much like the looks of the TAD driver) and the screen was recessed.

 

Here is a picture of what Ralph had with the "missing" bug screen however, it wasn't missing.  He didn't have a K69 on there, he had the 1132 (or 1133) where Klipsch simply attached the wrong driver to the horn.  Ralph was complaining about not having "enough tinkle" and it turns out he had the wrong driver.

 

It was the missing screen to me that helped figure that out (I sent the picture to Roy)

 

This is Ralph's K402 with the K1133 (or 32?)

 

Notice the recessed bug screen.

 

Now, go back and look at the OP's K402 and you will see what appears (to me) to be a FLUSH bug screen, exactly like the K69 would give him.

 

I contend he either has a different driver than the 1133 or might have a K69 on there but....he does NOT have a K1133 based on the visuals of the bug screen.

 

One picture of missing bug screen.  Other picture is my 402 when I had the K69 attached.  

 

[Coytee]

ok,as I look closer at the left picture, it's possible I had a TAD attached (which gives that recessed look)

 

My apologies.  I can't find a close up of mine with the flush screen.

[Scotty H]

 

I've got a KPT-305 in my hands, and I can say without a doubt that the picture shown by the OP here is a K-402 horn--not a KPT-305 assembly:

 

 

I was referring to his link to the "discontinued Jubilee". Again, the OP has stated a number of things that might confuse a potential Jubilee buyer. I was merely trying to clean things up a bit.

 

 

The Modern Jubilees.....1200watt each for the Bass Bin alone....and mine measure around 3.3ohms with both woofer in parallel, as the factory wired them.

 

They do say 8ohm labels, but each woofer measures 6.3 by itself and when wired together in parallel (the way they came) measure 3.3ohm (dunno why not 3.15....but this is what Two different Multi-Meters measure...?)

 

So, I power them with 4ohm outputs on my McIntosh MC352. I am not running nearly enough amp for these. Need more.

 

This is what I get for reading the stupid internet and buying amps before the actual speaker arrived.

 

 

It takes 3x the power as what Klipsch web-site states.

 

Each woofer can handle 600watts, according to Chris in Arkansas, and my decal on the bass bin....??

 

Go figure..?

 

Top section ohm at just over 12ohm. (Measured at the included crossover network)

 

Recommended RMS power....I have no friggin clue? Came with no paperwork, and no labels.

Yes, Roy Delgato emailed me yesterday....but I think he is either on vacation or out of the country on business?

Edited August 28, 2015 by Scotty H

[Scotty H]

[angusruler]

I, for one, really enjoyed the pics in the first post(s).

 

 

also right aboot the price of GN's....they (it) is going thru the roof for low mileage models!

[Scotty H]

 

 

Unless you are here....with me....in this very room.....with these very speakers and accessories.....

you really are not in a position to say my systems needs this or that.

 

Or, that blah blah is wrong....or whatever.

 

??

 

Love my Klipsch.

 

about me.....I am in business of high tech manufacturing. 5-axis CNC milling of titanium and exotic ceramics....

I sell, operate, repair and fix very complex rapid-prototype machines. We do 3d-scanning and CAD/CAM work....reverse engineering at my business.

I build my own CNC mills and build custom mills for others globally.

We sell German CAD and Italian CAM software, and Korean and German 3d-scanners.

I love music as well, and the science and physics behind it. Have an electrical engineer and software engineer and many other smart employees here to enjoy the music with me.

www.3d-dental.com is One of my sites. It is international 3d CAD/CAM for medical manufacturing forum. I am "DMC" on there....the owner.

I own dominion milling center, prime dental products, old dominion dental corp, and 3d-dental.com

 

I dropped out of high-school as well.

Nothing I do today was invented anyway when I was in School. I am 42yrs old.

 

Scotty

 

- Rare Church Organ La Scalas with built-in 100watt amps and Square magnet, K33P woofers.

- Cornwalls

-  2015 Jubilee 535b

Edited August 27, 2015 by Scotty H

[Scotty H]

 

 

 

[Scotty H]

.....right aboot the price of GN's....they (it) is going thru the roof for low mileage models!

 

Over 60,000miles......STILL asking over $60k!!

 

That car sold around $24k in 1987!!

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Buick-Grand-National-/321837996422?forcerrptr=true&hash=item4aef0a1986&item=321837996422

Edited August 27, 2015 by Scotty H

[Scotty H]

Another..... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Buick-Grand-National-GNX-/262017575516?forcerrptr=true&hash=item3d0176ea5c&item=262017575516

Edited August 27, 2015 by Scotty H