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numbnerve

Me = a true noob suffering from paralysis by analysis

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I humbly admit to being a complete novice with all things home theater and I have attempted to learn as I go along, but going along as proven to be overwhelming with a lot of the science and technical specs out there when trying to set up a basic system.

Basically, Black Friday's black hole at Best Buy sucked me in and I splurged on a pair of R-28Fs, a pair of R-15Ms and a pair of R-10SWs (I have 4 other speakers that can be used as surrounds - ALL speakers are rated @ 8 ohms) & I bought what I was told at the time was an adequate Onkyo receiver - which I soon thereafter discovered was woefully underpowering for the caliber of speakers I bought.

According to Klipsch's website regarding my pair of R-28Fs, they recommend an AVR that produces between 150-300w RMS @8 ohms since the speakers are rated at 150RMS @8 ohms. In my quest to find an affordable AVR that produces ANYTHING over 150w RMS @ 8 ohms, my eyeballs are slapped with units that cost nearly $2000 and more. I didn't go into this expecting to spend $5000 on what I imagine most of you on these forums would consider a pretty basic introductory system - but that is what I was hoping to start with until I continue to educate myself on putting together a custom system that I obtain audio utopia with - - - but until then, I am stuck with these speakers and have yet to locate an AVR that would sufficently power all of these speakers without forcing me to go to the bank to take out a loan - - but if that's what I have to do, I am about at the point of giving in so I can finally hook up these speakers. Over the phone, one Klipsch rep told me I'd be fine with an AVR that had 125w RMS @ 8 ohms even though their website contradicts that advice....another rep told me that an AVR with 185w RMS is what I'd need - so I just kinda hung it up for a while after all the misinformation.

All apologies if this post is redundant or was posted on the wrong board.

Can anyone point me in the direction of a respectable AVR that would be able to properly power the speakers I referenced above? I don't have a 3D HDTV (just a reg HDTV) * don't plan on 4K for a while * and will have to wait on Dolby Atmos until I evolve enough with the abundance of info out there that FOR NOW has me stumped with setting up my very first system.

Any tips, suggestions or specific instructions would be appreciated as I am learning all of this on the fly. 2-Channel system with the R-28Fs & a subwoofer? Receivers vs. amplifiers? Watts per channel @ 8 ohms that won't potentially damage the speakers by under or over-powering them? sigh....

Thanks a lot!!

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Welcome to the forum numbnerve, happy you joined us. Not sure why anyone gave you that information as far as required power from an AVR. You can get good sound out of your set up with an AVR producing 30 wpc. Sometimes people baffle me in this industry. I have four Sherbourn receivers that put out 125 per channel and it is deafening anywhere above 1/3 volume. I would direct you to one of those however they are a rare bird. I know of a couple Emotiva Fusion 8100 receivers for sale for around $400-$500 which are great sounding receivers that won't break the bank.

 

Personally I would suggest pairing a preamp/processor with a power amp as separates. I have only been wowed by the one receiver and I have owned many. When you can pair a nice pre/pro and multi channel amp you will really enjoy the results. I would point you towards the Emotiva site if you are willing to hold out a couple of months. They are a reputable and affordable bang for the buck company that is getting ready to release three new lines of amps and some new pre/pros.

 

There are plenty in this forum that bash Emotiva so I am already preparing for backlash. Denon and Marantz offer some decent receivers and you can see what they offer with some nice deals on accessoriesforless.com

 

 

Tim

 

Edit; To clarify my Sherbourn SR-120 is 125 wpc rated power across the front three channels and the remaining four channels are driven with 75 true wpc into 8 ohms. You don't see power like that often.

Edited by teaman
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First of all, Welcome, and second of all, Mr. Teaman ^^^ speaks true.  If you took his advice and quit there you would be well served, and others will have good suggestions as well.

 

You didn't mention what your budget was, and you didn't mention if pre-owned is an option or not.  I'm also not sure if you are going for 5.1 or 7.1. 

 

I will point you generically towards http://www.accessories4less.com/

 

Many people have purchased from them, I don't think I've ever heard a complaint.  I purchased an inexpensive Denon AVR from them, and I have no complaints.

 

Since Dolby Atmos is all the rage these days I think there are good deals to be had with pre-owned, just know the older models will likely not support Atmos, 3-D, but a a lot of them will support 4K, at least in theory.  I have an Onkyo 7.1 AVR and plug sound into it, and video directly into the TV so I don't care about 4K "upscaling."

 

What ever model you settle on, I suggest you run it by the denizens here.  You will get lots of honest opinions, then you pick which of us you deem most honest.  :D

Edited by wvu80
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Welcome! I'll tell you guys why he was told that by two different Klipsch reps because Klipsch hires a bunch of morons that have no clue what they are talking about. Might as well be Best Buy salesman. I wanna call and ask these guys to point me in the direction of a receiver that puts out 185 WPC all channels driven. Jeeze. Lol.

Op, where are you located? What's a budget you'd like to be around?

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I humbly admit to being a complete novice with all things home theater and I have attempted to learn as I go along, but going along as proven to be overwhelming with a lot of the science and technical specs out there when trying to set up a basic system.

Basically, Black Friday's black hole at Best Buy sucked me in and I splurged on a pair of R-28Fs, a pair of R-15Ms and a pair of R-10SWs (I have 4 other speakers that can be used as surrounds - ALL speakers are rated @ 8 ohms) & I bought what I was told at the time was an adequate Onkyo receiver - which I soon thereafter discovered was woefully underpowering for the caliber of speakers I bought.

According to Klipsch's website regarding my pair of R-28Fs, they recommend an AVR that produces between 150-300w RMS @8 ohms since the speakers are rated at 150RMS @8 ohms. In my quest to find an affordable AVR that produces ANYTHING over 150w RMS @ 8 ohms, my eyeballs are slapped with units that cost nearly $2000 and more. I didn't go into this expecting to spend $5000 on what I imagine most of you on these forums would consider a pretty basic introductory system - but that is what I was hoping to start with until I continue to educate myself on putting together a custom system that I obtain audio utopia with - - - but until then, I am stuck with these speakers and have yet to locate an AVR that would sufficently power all of these speakers without forcing me to go to the bank to take out a loan - - but if that's what I have to do, I am about at the point of giving in so I can finally hook up these speakers. Over the phone, one Klipsch rep told me I'd be fine with an AVR that had 125w RMS @ 8 ohms even though their website contradicts that advice....another rep told me that an AVR with 185w RMS is what I'd need - so I just kinda hung it up for a while after all the misinformation.

All apologies if this post is redundant or was posted on the wrong board.

Can anyone point me in the direction of a respectable AVR that would be able to properly power the speakers I referenced above? I don't have a 3D HDTV (just a reg HDTV) * don't plan on 4K for a while * and will have to wait on Dolby Atmos until I evolve enough with the abundance of info out there that FOR NOW has me stumped with setting up my very first system.

Any tips, suggestions or specific instructions would be appreciated as I am learning all of this on the fly. 2-Channel system with the R-28Fs & a subwoofer? Receivers vs. amplifiers? Watts per channel @ 8 ohms that won't potentially damage the speakers by under or over-powering them? sigh....

Thanks a lot!!

Good advice from both Teaman and wvu80.  I won't over post, let's just say I am a receiver user with a Pioneer SC-91 ($1000).  You could spend little more than half that and get great sound out of a good Denon or Pioneer.  I have experience with both.  I also own the new and moderately large RP-280F's from Klipsch among other speakers.  My rated Watts per Channel is 130, which any company is at 2 channels driven, not the 7 my setup supports...and I use.  Teaman is right, Emotiva is great bang for buck.  wvu80 is right too, look at your budget, check used.  Although there are always some exceptions, home theater components should have a great life expectancy. 

It's one of those things where you should look at budget, and review your expectations.  The real lesson I have learned being a member of this awesome community is that ultimately, your ears and eyes are the real judge of what works for you. 

Many of the members in this community have helped shape my system by offering the best advice, but ultimately, I made it my own...on my own. 

 

At the risk of sounding like a hypocrite and sending a bit of science...when looking at power or watts per channel, higher number doesn't mean much of anything.  A low .0-something decimal THD or total harmonic distortion is a good number to look at.  Lower, the better.  However, this matters more if you are really looking to blast your source material and the quality of the original source material.  Clean power = better.

Have fun building a great system!!!

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Have I read right that you already have an Onkyo receiver? What is the model if you do indeed have it still? 

You have 2 subs so they will take the bass if crossed over correctly and you have relatively efficient speakers so any receiver should be fine depending on what you are expecting from your system. Generally you want to spend significantly more on speakers than you do on electronics. 

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Have I read right that you already have an Onkyo receiver? What is the model if you do indeed have it still?

You have 2 subs so they will take the bass if crossed over correctly and you have relatively efficient speakers so any receiver should be fine depending on what you are expecting from your system. Generally you want to spend significantly more on speakers than you do on electronics.

perfect advice! I meant to ask about the onkyo model but got so bent out of shape about someone telling him he needs a 300 wpc receiver that I forgot lol.

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Welcome.

As I said in email when you reached out, opinions will vary. I would closely align my flavor and thought with Tim and Dave.

A4L listings and Emotiva both are hard to beat.

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Most of us on this forum don't have avr's that match the RMS.  You are most likely fine.  Keep what you have and take a little time to learn some things and then decide if the upgrade path is for you.  Keep reading threads and learn a few things. :)  I had the VF Icon tower HT on a 110 watt Sony and had no complaints.  That's why I still have, lol.

Edited by derrickdj1
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I vote Emotiva also if you can. If not look at Yamaha, Used them for years before going to Emotiva.

Loved their natural sound stuff. Good power in a AVR and lot's of features. YAPO is pretty good but is not on the same level as Dirac IMO.

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Emotiva emulates the old Yamaha sound pretty darn well, IMO - perhaps even better than Yamaha itself does. I remember going from my 2500 to the 8100 terrified me because I had always been in the Yamaha chain - and after a bad flavor in my mouth from the latest RX-V line, and poor results with Denon (personally, I understand many here enjoy their Denon receivers). I am happier now with the 8100 that I ever was with my Yamaha's - but if I had to pick a receiver on the general consumer market - it would be a Yamaha Aventage receiver.

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Emotiva emulates the old Yamaha sound pretty darn well, IMO - perhaps even better than Yamaha itself does. I remember going from my 2500 to the 8100 terrified me because I had always been in the Yamaha chain - and after a bad flavor in my mouth from the latest RX-V line, and poor results with Denon (personally, I understand many here enjoy their Denon receivers). I am happier now with the 8100 that I ever was with my Yamaha's - but if I had to pick a receiver on the general consumer market - it would be a Yamaha Aventage receiver.

I agree both of mine were the Aventage line. I thought long and hard before making the switch to Emotiva

and in the end am happy with my choice.

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Is this a vote, I thought the election was in November?  If the OP really wants another avr, save up some money and buy last years model or the year before for a bargin.

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Thanks for the welcome & advice....the Onkyo receiver was an 805W model that I was told by Klipsch would be way too weak for the speakers I bought so I've been on the hunt since returning it...the whole minimum of 150w/channel @ 8 ohms has me frustrated b/c it requires too expensive of an AVR & I feel if I don't feed them the power Klipsch says is required, I will underpower the R-28Fs and possibly damage them...somewhere on Klipsch's website, it actually says that the R-28Fs ideally require 150-300w RMS to "ideally" drive them but I've come to learn that I can get by with less.....just don't know how much less. I saw a Yahama AVR that pushed 150w/ x 7 channels @8 ohms but its THD was listed at 10%....wasn't sure if that was a typo or not.

To answer some of the questions, I'm in Jamestown, NC....my budget isn't as large as I wish it was ($1000 max)...I'd prefer new but if somewhere is reputable with their pre-owned gear, I'm not above going that route.... thx again for all the helpful info!

Sent from my SGH-T999L using Tapatalk

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I have powered RF 7 an a RC 64  with a 140 watt avr  they are rated 250/1000 amd 200/800 RMS/Peak.  Check out most of the signatures in this thread and see what some of us are using.  Set the speakers to small and you will not have a problem.

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Welcome.

 

You are getting some good direction here and I don't want to add much. It's just my personal preference to go in the direction of good sound quality with plenty of power. The result for me was purchasing Marantz separates (rather than an avr) on close-out deals (last year's models). Marantz and Klipsch go well together so the sound is very good and a definite improvement from our old Denon avr. The power amp puts out 140 wpc separately driven and is quite sufficient. A really good avr would likely get you there too.

 

Best of luck.

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OP, do not take the Klipsch website nor the Klipsch reps word as gospel. It is not. Just keep saying that to yourself.

I powered a bigger system than you've got on an 85 watt Yamaha for years and it sounded great. Those speakers were also never in danger of being ruined. Right now I'm powering an even larger system on a Denon 4520 which also does not put out 150 watts.

You don't need huge watt numbers to safely drive your speakers. Huge watts are nice...don't get me wrong, but you aren't going to ruin your speakers without them. A good 100-125 watt receiver will be fine for what you're needing to power. All the brands above will work fine. We all prefer what we prefer but none of those listed above will let you down.

Accessories 4 less will save you money and is a good reputable company that many of us use.

Good luck in your choice.

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I powered a 25,000$ 4ohm palladium setup on a freakin bottom of the line denon 1713 for a couple weeks whil I waited on a new receiver. Didn't hurt anything at all! Klipsch reps have no idea what they are talking about.

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Klipsch reps have no idea what they are talking about.

I guess I'm just curious as to why people call the 800 number so much. I lost a sale on some RP-280FA's due to weird and conflicting advice of this very sort being given to a customer of mine.

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I dont know if these ?s have been asked but...... Is ease of use important (even good low cost setups may be difficult to totally control)? Is sound quality the most important thing (great setups dont have to cost 4 digits)? Is networking important (I consider it very important, but there are work arounds if you look)? Do you want easy and done or are you willing to work to find the best set for you.

 

That said, all those things and more together do cost more. It dont have to be 10x more but its more. The power issue.....I've had 35 real watts kick butt on every Klipsch I've owned, 200 is fine too, just not required for great ,loud ,sound.

 

For example...Onkyo at acc4less is hard to beat for ease and networking, gives up some musicality to my ears. Yamaha Adventage is also a deal there but sound wise barely better than Onkyo 6xx series. Harman Kardon usually has less features but musical sound/power is undeniable (just search HK musicality). This is my opnion on just a few popular potentials. There are jems and junkers in every line. I have owned some really bad $2k+ avrs/pres, and some great under $500 units, and visa versa.

 

If you have the time and inclination to audition units then you will know and be more satisfied. All just an opinion.....

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