Jump to content

Cornwall IV's in a Great Room


Recommended Posts

18 hours ago, ODS123 said:

 

Our great room system is highly biased toward 2-channel.  ..My center speaker and surrounds are Paradigm and Polk Audio, respectively - so, they don't match.  I bought them when my F/R speakers were Paradigm S8v2s.  But when it comes to movies, no one in my family is bothered by the slightly timbral/tonal mis-match - we're too focused on the story, etc..  And we don't have a subwoofer.  ..Don't really miss it.

 

Definitely food for thought.  Be easier than trying to find an old heresy to fit up front.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd stick with a simple two channel setup (with the Cornwalls), and for ease of use get a nice integrated amplifier. It might not be the pinnacle of performance but everyone in the family gets to enjoy it and its not complicated or difficult to use. They will fill that room with sound easily, no need for surround speakers and subwoofers IMO.

 

You have the opportunity to sow the seeds of audio enjoyment with the entire family, that way if someday you end up wanting a dedicated listening room they'll understand. I really enjoy it when my four year old is dancing in the living room and can walk over to turn up her favorite song on the "big stereo".

 

 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, Zack R said:

I'd stick with a simple two channel setup (with the Cornwalls), and for ease of use get a nice integrated amplifier. It might not be the pinnacle of performance but everyone in the family gets to enjoy it and its not complicated or difficult to use. They will fill that room with sound easily, no need for surround speakers and subwoofers IMO.

 

You have the opportunity to sow the seeds of audio enjoyment with the entire family, that way if someday you end up wanting a dedicated listening room they'll understand. I really enjoy it when my four year old is dancing in the living room and can walk over to turn up her favorite song on the "big stereo".

 

 


Well IMHO, adding channels and processing gizmos will be the opposite of the “pinnacle of performance”. Which is why no system can be optimized for movies AND music. We always have to pick which one is most important to us and let the chips fall where they may for the other.

 

I say set it up for music. The rest is just gimmickry.

 

Shakey

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, Zack R said:

I'd stick with a simple two channel setup (with the Cornwalls), and for ease of use get a nice integrated amplifier. It might not be the pinnacle of performance but everyone in the family gets to enjoy it and its not complicated or difficult to use. .."

 

 

 

This is our approach.  ..While I do have an AVR (Onkyo), Center and Surround speakers, nowadays we nearly always just play movies through the McIntosh Integrated and Cornwalls with Apple TV Audio set to Stereo.  Our days of watching Jurassic Park and other bombastic big special-effect movies are largely behind us.  Our last four movies were: Nomad Land, Sound Of Metal, Hillbilly Elegy, and The Trial of the Chicago 7.  ..None of which is improved by 5.1 or 7.1 audio.  Sound Of Metal, coincidentally, is a cautionary tale about a musician who destroys his hearing playing in a heavy metal band without wearing ear-protection....  After watching that, I've been playing music at (slightly) lower levels. :)  All four were great movies BTW.

 

But to each their own.  ..Sounds like Mayo is at a different life-stage.  ..Young kids love watching movies with big booms, and special effects (think Incredibles, Star Wars, etc..) I've been there, so I definitely get the desire to integrate 5.1 - 7.1 into the setup.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/21/2021 at 4:16 AM, ODS123 said:

 

This is our approach.  ..While I do have an AVR (Onkyo), Center and Surround speakers, nowadays we nearly always just play movies through the McIntosh Integrated and Cornwalls with Apple TV Audio set to Stereo.  Our days of watching Jurassic Park and other bombastic big special-effect movies are largely behind us.

 

So you get a good enough of a phantom center in stereo with movies and TV?  Do you keep it 2.0 (or 2.x) versus a 3.x because of the Mac quality and to keep the inferior AVR amp out of your front?  Asking because my wife is notoriously challenged with understanding dialogue (ESL and partially deaf).  

 

We are somewhat done with "popcorn" entertainment, though not sure my youngest (7 y.o.) is ready for Citizen Kane or 12 Angry Men.  Loved Sound of Metal and all its nuance and human messiness.

 

So while I am not having any regrets about turning away from HT in this room, I really think I should track down a used Academy for center channel and 1 or 2 subs for movies.  As far as powering such a system, my desire for something like a First Watt (e.g., F7 or F8) is dampened by this possible need to power a center and connect a sub.  I guess I could pick up a cheapish AVR (maybe use two extra channels to bi-amp the CW's) or just go with a three-channel amp.  If I'm able to score that Rose Hi-Fi streamer, it's preamp should be more than satisfactory.  But maybe added a tube preamp would be worth the investment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, mayo said:

So you get a good enough of a phantom center in stereo with movies and TV? 

No...you don't.  Turning off the center loudspeaker in my setup results in at least a 50% reduction in speech intelligibility (subjective assessment). 

 

10 minutes ago, mayo said:

So while I am not having any regrets about turning away from HT in this room, I really think I should track down a used Academy for center channel and 1 or 2 subs for movies.

Personally, I don't recommend the Academy unless it's a choice of last resort.  Bass response and horizontal coverage issues (sitting anywhere off the exact center sweet spot) for the "horizontal centers" is always an issue.  Most that acquire them (the Academy) seem to end up selling them, or not using them.  Perhaps you should ask those that have owned them on this forum why they don't use them any more.

 

Subs do help a great deal--the bigger the diaphragm area/horn mouth area, the better, especially into a room volume that you have.  Small, direct radiating subs can work in smaller rooms, but in a room the size you have, you'll probably end up killing them with too much power into in order to faithfully keep up with the Cornwalls.

 

Chris

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Looks like the perfect room for Cornwalls to me. Your sitting area should be pretty sweet and you will be able to listen to everything whilst cooking at the far end.

A nice large speaker for a large room always seems to work best in my experience.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, YK Thom said:

Looks like the perfect room for Cornwalls to me. Your sitting area should be pretty sweet and you will be able to listen to everything whilst cooking at the far end.

A nice large speaker for a large room always seems to work best in my experience.

I'm with this guy :biggrin:

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Chris A said:

No...you don't.  Turning off the center loudspeaker in my setup results in at least a 50% reduction in speech intelligibility (subjective assessment). 

 

Personally, I don't recommend the Academy unless it's a choice of last resort.  Bass response and horizontal coverage issues (sitting anywhere off the exact center sweet spot) for the "horizontal centers" is always an issue.  Most that acquire them (the Academy) seem to end up selling them, or not using them.

 

Anything you might recommend for a center channel that isn't a Heresy or something impossible to have conspicuous on/around media console?  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The "media console" is the problem...in my experience.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Chris A said:

The "media console" is the problem...in my experience.

 

Bummerooski because no way is the wife going to go for a rack or electronics on the floor.  Ugg.  Never thought running a 3.1 with CW's would be so challenging.  Also, would hate to go stereo and have my wife still not picking up dialogue clearly.  [dejectedly looks back at RP8000's] 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Unless a person has a room built specifically for audio, I would imagine a large (ok, huge) majority of normal people aren't going to have a perfect room and setup.  Back when I was a manufacturers rep for multiple home A/V companies (and 15 years retail before that) and had dealers that were doing crazy expensive systems, sure, you saw them. This doesn't come from pulling a guess out of my rear, it's from having been in the industry. And amongst that same majority, most would never notice anything bouncing off the media center.  We aren't all that lucky to have rooms like that unless we're rich, single and nothing else to do and many spare rooms for huge speakers, or a combo of both.  

 

Just an outside observation.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, mayo said:

 

So you get a good enough of a phantom center in stereo with movies and TV?  Do you keep it 2.0 (or 2.x) versus a 3.x because of the Mac quality and to keep the inferior AVR amp out of your front?  Asking because my wife is notoriously challenged with understanding dialogue (ESL and partially deaf).  

 

We are somewhat done with "popcorn" entertainment, though not sure my youngest (7 y.o.) is ready for Citizen Kane or 12 Angry Men.  Loved Sound of Metal and all its nuance and human messiness.

 

So while I am not having any regrets about turning away from HT in this room, I really think I should track down a used Academy for center channel and 1 or 2 subs for movies.  As far as powering such a system, my desire for something like a First Watt (e.g., F7 or F8) is dampened by this possible need to power a center and connect a sub.  I guess I could pick up a cheapish AVR (maybe use two extra channels to bi-amp the CW's) or just go with a three-channel amp.  If I'm able to score that Rose Hi-Fi streamer, it's preamp should be more than satisfactory.  But maybe added a tube preamp would be worth the investment.

 

Well, if you've read many of my posts here you'll understand that I'm not a big believer in amplifiers sounding different from one another.  Indeed, my view is that modern day amps that are engineered to be linear (this would exclude low watt tube amps but include just about all others) will not sound different if not driven to distortion.  So my view is that you shouldn't spend lavishly on your amp in the belief that it will make your system sound better to you or your family.   While it is true I have a rather expensive integrated amp  (McIntosh MA6600), I do not find it to sound any  better than my AVR.  ..I bought it and love it b/c I love the look, the feel, the history of the McIntosh brand AND b/c it has tone controls (bass/treble) AND a mono switch - all of which I find essential to my enjoyment of music, especially older recordings that date back to the days when Stereo recording/ mixing was crude and often did more to harm than help the music.

 

As for Phantom center... YES, my Cornwalls do a great job of creating a center image.  As for subwoofers....  they're not for me.  I find the depth and impact of the CWIII's to be more than enough and as I've already stated, we rarely watch movies with deep special effects.

 

As I said earlier, in our view music is best when enjoyed as a group.  We rarely have disputes about what to listen to.  ..When the whole family is around, we simply take turns at picking songs.  I use ROON as the curator software of my 1000+ CD's (ripped) and it links to TIDAL to access songs that are not in my collection.

 

Rather than having a dedicated listening room, I'd sooner just buy a nice pair of headphones.  ..Just MHO. :)

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Save yourself about 10k. Hunt down a pair of good condition Cornwall 2 or later and replace the crossovers. Pair it with a Denon integrated amp and that’s all you need..Sure it might not be audiophile quality to some but for my family life it is perfect..Movies sound great and  cornwalls just plain rock. Satisfies the SO in terms of cable clutter and is easy to use for everyone..For critical listening a pair of great headphones does the trick.Save the cash for a future dedicated room in the future. Just my 2 cents.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Jem02jr said:

Save yourself about 10k. Hunt down a pair of good condition Cornwall 2 or later and replace the crossovers. Pair it with a Denon integrated amp and that’s all you need..Sure it might not be audiophile quality to some but for my family life it is perfect..Movies sound great and  cornwalls just plain rock. Satisfies the SO in terms of cable clutter and is easy to use for everyone..For critical listening a pair of great headphones does the trick.Save the cash for a future dedicated room in the future. Just my 2 cents.

 

Yeah he would save some dough. But Cornwall IIs with upgraded xovers aren't in the same area code as a stock CW IV. And I'd neve pair a Denon integrated with either of them, but YMMV.

 

Shakey

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, Shakeydeal said:

And I'd neve pair a Denon integrated with either of them

I know all things are subjective here but I have owned a few Denon integrated amps(PMA-1080R, PMA-700V, PMA-750, PMA-757, etc.) from the 80's/90's and they totally rocked with Quartets, Fortes, and Heresys).  Great tonal quality with punchy fast bass.  Super reliable.

 

https://audio-database.com/DENON-COLUMBIA/amp/pma-750-e.html

 

https://audio-database.com/DENON-COLUMBIA/amp/pma-700v-e.html

 

 

 

https://audio-database.com/DENON-COLUMBIA/amp/index.html

 

 

Bill

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, Shakeydeal said:

 

Yeah he would save some dough. But Cornwall IIs with upgraded xovers aren't in the same area code as a stock CW IV. And I'd neve pair a Denon integrated with either of them, but YMMV.

 

Shakey

 

 

 

 

 

I think it's proper and accurate to say that there are a lot of aspects of brand new, latest engineered Cornwall IV's that are very much desirable. But the statement/idea that refreshed Cornwall I or II aren't "In the same area code" is WAYYYYYYYYYYY over the top, and is an engagement of sales puffery that belies evidence. 

 

If you want the latest, new offering from Klipsch in Cornwall, there's the Cornwall IV. If you want to save some money, this forum is loaded with people and records of how we improve these or simply refresh these speakers for long term ownership and use. One can do that very effectively (it is a longer road, and to some, time is money), and for a much reduced cost, if one is willing to travel the road to do it.

 

I've been traveling that road for two decades, from back when Klipsch didn't even build Cornwalls (they were on that well known hiatus in production) and can say that there's certainly more than one way to get from point A to point B. It's still the same area code, in fact, same church even - just down the same pew a few seats. You just might travel a different road to get there.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well I’ve owned both so not a lot of “puffery”. The earlier Cornwalls had a boxy resonance that once you heard it, you couldn’t unhear it. That is completely absent in the latest version. And as much fun as a pair of Cornwall IIs are, they don’t have the resolution and inner detail f the CW IV.

 

So for me, there is a wide delta in the performance of the two speakers. And I just call it like I hear it. You pays your money and you takes what you get. You get a good speaker with original Cornwalls and you get a much better one with the Cornwall IV. 
 

Shakey

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...