joessportster Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 People keep saying there is a science argument. Really? I know of no scientist in the world who doesn't believe the laws of thermodynamics. None. Never heard of an argument there. Not one. The Sun will grow into a red giant, consume the earth and explode, following the ever increasing entropy of the universe. If you want to kill yourself, or stop using plastic bags before then, yippee! I shall not be bothered trying to defy the Universe. Fill, 'er up, please! let;s hope there will be some fossel fuel left to power the spaceships - when you move the whole planet - you\d be better to have a few spare quarts -and another spare planet -ooops - can I please take my Cornwalls with me to Mars So you advocate man F#%$ing up another poor un-suspecting planet ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OO1 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 (edited) People keep saying there is a science argument. Really? I know of no scientist in the world who doesn't believe the laws of thermodynamics. None. Never heard of an argument there. Not one. The Sun will grow into a red giant, consume the earth and explode, following the ever increasing entropy of the universe. If you want to kill yourself, or stop using plastic bags before then, yippee! I shall not be bothered trying to defy the Universe. Fill, 'er up, please! let;s hope there will be some fossel fuel left to power the spaceships - when you move the whole planet - you\d be better to have a few spare quarts -and another spare planet -ooops - can I please take my Cornwalls with me to Mars So you advocate man F#%$ing up another poor un-suspecting planet ?? we are human after all Edited February 9, 2015 by Randyh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I like the way common sense has mostly ruled this thread, very encouraging. Of course none of us "know" but in the big scheme of all it is mostly insignificant at this point, as Mark said. We're probably not going to last near as long as the last rulers of the planet, cause they didn't have cars ?? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joessportster Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 And you seemed so upset that man has caused so much global warming, Now "we are just Human after all" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The History Kid Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I like the way common sense has mostly ruled this thread, very encouraging. Of course none of us "know" but in the big scheme of all it is mostly insignificant at this point, as Mark said. Could not agree more. There are facts out there, but in general it's just one side bullying the other for not seeing things the same way. The best practice IMO is to remain indifferent. However, as some others have said - that does not mean you shouldn't try and be green. It doesn't mean having a gas guzzling Hummer when you just drive to and from work everyday at a retail store is okay. But be sensible in what you use and how you use it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I agree, certainly a good idea to do all we reasonably can. I recycle and do the few things I can just for community and my own conscience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JL Sargent Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 It seems there are always consequences and compromises! You know, kinda like the time I went green and quit using condoms. Oh boy, diapers take up a lot more landfill space than those things for sure. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Steven1963 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I've been skeptical of the global warming believers since the start. Especially those proclaiming it is man-made. It seems now the news media is starting to cool (no pun intended) to the assertions. Which is good. I think we need more sanity brought into this debate. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/environment/globalwarming/11395516/The-fiddling-with-temperature-data-is-the-biggest-science-scandal-ever.html in NY , you cant see the sky on smog days , the air has a kinda of a nice odor -like the smell of a car's muffler - you need a mask to filter the nasty dust particles that burn the eyes but again that is not man made ,yep , just natural You are using a micro example to explain a macro phenomena. Does man create smog in New York? Of course he does. Does it change the temperature in Africa? I'm not convinced. the planet turns every 24 hours - next time you use your washing machine - take a close look , did you notice that your clothes got cleaner as they spun around , now add a bit of dirt and spin it , I betcha that your clothes are dirty - same things with a planet -one huge washing machine -instead that the gases interact -it is called global warming - My washing machine doesn't have the best scrubbers nature can make: Trees and plants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Good thread. As to the "mess up another planet" concern...have you heard about infinity? There is an infinite supply of planets and no matter how hard we try we cannot even in a tiny way "pollute" infinity. We are pretty much formed in our thoughts by our confinement to this finite, and tiny space. We've just about worn out our welcome and the time is coming to leave...or stay and die in our own waste. Either way, the planet will go on and take care of itself. It's beauty and balance will return. It's how things work. Dave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerwoodKhorns Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I give up - help Be honest, you don't know why you believe man causes global warming. Do you? Give us something more than smog in New York or your washing machine theory. Umm, how about Venus: http://www.universetoday.com/22577/venus-greenhouse-effect/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerwoodKhorns Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 My name is Mark, and I am a reformed Global Warming Advocate. Yes, I was once an aggressive ambassador for the idea of man made GW being a disaster for mankind. One day, I woke up. Man is but a temporary infection upon the earth. Nothing he does in his brief couple million year reign is going to stop the history of the universe from unfolding. And when you get right down to it, who cares? Our lives are so short and meaningless to the universe that it just doesn't matter. Use the oil, make all the plastic you please. Dig up the diamonds and coal if it amuses you. It's silly and doesn't matter. The 5 billion year old earth is on a course that has nothing to do with man. What does matter is your specific, actual, personal, life of compassion for your fellow occupiers of the space - human and animal. The rest of the argument about "earth" is pointless. It's a rock in an infinite universe of rocks. Do something that matters. This is just plain wreckless. We see this in nature all of the time. A species has abundant food, overpopulates and destroys its habitat and dies off. We are no different except that we are smart and should have the ability to avoid this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eth2 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, The courage to change the things I can, And the wisdom to know the difference. Clearly, opinions on this issue cannot be changed. "And the wisdom to know the difference." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JL Sargent Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Yeah TWK, I agree that does have some merit to it. I remember several years ago this subject was a very hot topic. As I recall there was a hole in the ozone but it shrunk or similar? Can you expound on what happened? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Steven1963 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Every time someone mentions global warning, I immediately think of the movie The Day After Tomorrow! Iunderground mines use scrubbers on their combustion engines - and it works - they will come soon or later to all gas engines to reduce pollution -it is just a question of time - I work for a Class 8 truck manufacturer - the big rigs on the road. The federal regulations regarding the exhaust coming out of those trucks makes the it cleaner than most automobiles. We are already there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OO1 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Every time someone mentions global warning, I immediately think of the movie The Day After Tomorrow! Iunderground mines use scrubbers on their combustion engines - and it works - they will come soon or later to all gas engines to reduce pollution -it is just a question of time - I work for a Class 8 truck manufacturer - the big rigs on the road. The federal regulations regarding the exhaust coming out of those trucks makes the it cleaner than most automobiles. We are already there. they use the urea liquid solutions from Germany -through the cat - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mungkiman Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Yeah TWK, I agree that does have some merit to it. I remember several years ago this subject was a very hot topic. As I recall there was a hole in the ozone but it shrunk or similar? Can you expound on what happened? The Montreal Protocol happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joessportster Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I am going to use the balance of my allotted fossil fuel for the day to listen to music, A fruitless pursuit of self indulgence 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Steven1963 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 This is a blatantly partisan political thread and should be closed. Take it to Fox News sites, this BS is beneath the Klipsch forum standards (and against forum policy if I'm not mistaken). This is far from a blatant partisan political thread. Although you seem to be trying to turn it into that. Why can't we have a conversation about a scientific 'problem' that supposedly will be affecting all of us? Perhaps there have been a couple shots taken in this thread but I would submit you are being too sensitive to those and should focus on the bigger subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OO1 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 My name is Mark, and I am a reformed Global Warming Advocate. Yes, I was once an aggressive ambassador for the idea of man made GW being a disaster for mankind. One day, I woke up. Man is but a temporary infection upon the earth. Nothing he does in his brief couple million year reign is going to stop the history of the universe from unfolding. And when you get right down to it, who cares? Our lives are so short and meaningless to the universe that it just doesn't matter. Use the oil, make all the plastic you please. Dig up the diamonds and coal if it amuses you. It's silly and doesn't matter. The 5 billion year old earth is on a course that has nothing to do with man. What does matter is your specific, actual, personal, life of compassion for your fellow occupiers of the space - human and animal. The rest of the argument about "earth" is pointless. It's a rock in an infinite universe of rocks. Do something that matters. This is just plain wreckless. We see this in nature all of the time. A species has abundant food, overpopulates and destroys its habitat and dies off. We are no different except that we are smart and should have the ability to avoid this. Should have? Let me stop laughing, first. Go ahead, spell out the rules. Who gets what kind of car? How much gas are they allowed? Who gets to fly? Who gets to keep their home at 72F year round? How big should our house be? How often can we get a new car? A new suit? Unless you can cite the specifics, there are none. And if they're are no specifics, there is no way to avoid limits on anything. It might sound good, it might feel good, but it's pointless preaching. Consumption is mechanistic. If you can't describe the machine, you can't control the consumption. the analogy is very real when you consider a country like Venezuela - that sells their fuel to the people for 18 cents a gallon -and nonetheless - they cant buy anything else - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerwoodKhorns Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 My name is Mark, and I am a reformed Global Warming Advocate. Yes, I was once an aggressive ambassador for the idea of man made GW being a disaster for mankind. One day, I woke up. Man is but a temporary infection upon the earth. Nothing he does in his brief couple million year reign is going to stop the history of the universe from unfolding. And when you get right down to it, who cares? Our lives are so short and meaningless to the universe that it just doesn't matter. Use the oil, make all the plastic you please. Dig up the diamonds and coal if it amuses you. It's silly and doesn't matter. The 5 billion year old earth is on a course that has nothing to do with man. What does matter is your specific, actual, personal, life of compassion for your fellow occupiers of the space - human and animal. The rest of the argument about "earth" is pointless. It's a rock in an infinite universe of rocks. Do something that matters. This is just plain wreckless. We see this in nature all of the time. A species has abundant food, overpopulates and destroys its habitat and dies off. We are no different except that we are smart and should have the ability to avoid this. Should have? Let me stop laughing, first. Go ahead, spell out the rules. Who gets what kind of car? How much gas are they allowed? Who gets to fly? Who gets to keep their home at 72F year round? How big should our house be? How often can we get a new car? A new suit? Unless you can cite the specifics, there are none. And if they're are no specifics, there is no way to avoid limits on anything. It might sound good, it might feel good, but it's pointless preaching. Consumption is mechanistic. If you can't describe the machine, you can't control the consumption. You have had the experience of being around the groups of environmentalists that will bicker and have pissing contests about "mother" and "Father" earth and such as per your previous post, so you do bring perspective to this. My wife and I discuss this and the end always seems to be that there is nothing that can be done, for the reason that you state, havign nations agree is impossible. The only hope is to somehow change attitudes. When I was a kid I remember that people use to throw their trash out of their car windows as they were driving down the street. That has changed. Maybe this can too. We need a sense of responsibility, not entitlement. I realize that I have not addressed your demand for specifics because I do not have an answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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