Super MWM

[glens]

Where's the visual on your splitter?

[Dave A]

If you look at the picture of the two plenums standing up by themselves on page 13 you will see them on the top of the right hand plenum.

[Khornukopia]

On ‎4‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 6:59 PM, Dave A said:

 

 

13 hours ago, Dave A said:

 

 

 

 

The cabinets are looking good. Your fabrication and assembly methods are excellent.

[ClaudeJ1]

If you want a "new improved" woofer for this Super MWM, I ran curves of the Acoustic Elegance TD M15-4. It a highly optimized driver that works well with bass horns (expensive too, but what's money?). It's a Super Driver vs. the K43 in the gray curve below. BTW, you will never need more than 8.4 Watts for this woofer section.

 

[babadono]

And you're NOT bringing them to the pilgrimage

[ClaudeJ1]

12 hours ago, babadono said:

And you're NOT bringing them to the pilgrimage

I'm thinking the Klipsch staff may not appreciate a DIY product, even though it's an extapolation of a product they no longer make.

[babadono]

1 hour ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

I'm thinking the Klipsch staff may not appreciate a DIY product, even though it's an extapolation of a product they no longer make.

We talked about this in another thread and Dave was going to bring but only to Rodney's not to the factory of course.

[ClaudeJ1]

18 minutes ago, babadono said:

We talked about this in another thread and Dave was going to bring but only to Rodney's not to the factory of course.

Well, there's still time!! But it's not up to me. However, I can twist an arm or two. LOL.

[ClaudeJ1]

Here's the Super MWM output with K-43 driver and 8.4 Watts of input!! Frequency of LEAST woofer excursion is at 40 Hz. so a 3db boost in the PEQ should smooth that right out, along with the one at about 120 Hz. However the ROOM will be the determinant more so that the ripples in the horn response. Those exist because of the relatively small horn mouth. As you can see it's about 3 db down at 28 Hz. which is pretty amazing. It will need a high pass filter there since the max excursion occurs at about that frequency, but this can do without a high pass as long as DaveA doesn't get "stupid loud" with it, which will be TEMPTING, I know.

 

But most "normal" listening at 85 db should not require more than 1/10th of a watt, so Paul Klipsch's famous "5 Watt Amplifier" comment would be applicable and can be had with a Tripath chip amplifier running 8 AA batteries, like the one sold by Parts Express for about $14 plus 12 v Wall wart power supply!

 

https://www.parts-express.com/t-amp-tripath-ta2024-2-x-15w-audio-digital-amplifier-board--320-600

 

So, by now, all of you should understand why all of the USA Movie Theaters, before World War II, were running on  4 Watt tube amps with those big Western Electric Horns!!

 

[Dave A]

It is not Klipsch that discourages this but rather it is the number of people who will be there. I have been advised against bringing them and that is what will happen. However anyone who happens to be in the area is welcome to stop in just contact me ahead of time. Give me a call and I will turn the volume up so you won't have to rely on your phone GPS. We have very spotty coverage out here.

[glens]

Perform any sonic "testing" yet?

[Dave A]

Well I fired the first one up today using a KPT456 split crossover. No fancy stuff no EQ no bi-amp just a crossover not really meant to.cope with this beast. This bass bin so completely overwhelms the 402 that it is ridiculous.  Won't have time to do more than get the second one up and running before I go to Hope but let me tell you that you are sitting inside the bass drum and large organ pipe with this monster. I don't believe I will be looking any further unless I add another horn for a three way.

[Jim Gregory]

That is truly remarkable Dave. I know how you love pipe organ music. Congratulations and I hope you enjoy the experience that only this type of setup can offer you. Job well done Sir. 

[jwc]

Well done Dave.  How big will you go next time?

[glens]

6 hours ago, Dave A said:

This bass bin so completely overwhelms the 402 that it is ridiculous.  

 

That may be some to do with the network you used wherein (if) the high horn was attenuated.  If there's a series resistor bypass it, or if an autoformer try another tap.  I know, it's just an interim, but at least it'll give you tunes for work on the other bin (which you'd do well to paint the innards while they're readily available, it seems).

 

I'd like to get down there some time this summer.

[Dave A]

8 hours ago, Jim Gregory said:

That is truly remarkable Dave. I know how you love pipe organ music. Congratulations and I hope you enjoy the experience that only this type of setup can offer you. Job well done Sir. 

I only had one running yesterday and places were rattling in the shop I had not heard before. Not that the volume was all that loud but the notes were that low. Today see's #2 done and in place so stereo earthquake.  My wife said she could feel it in the house. Stop in when you are in town. Say you don't happen to have a good rocket or jet engine or helicopter recording do you? Wonder what artillery would sound like heh heh.

 

6 hours ago, jwc said:

Well done Dave.  How big will you go next time?

You helped it happen!. This is iit and a  significant improvement over the MWM and all I want. I am not a fan of super deep bass since I don't watch movies. I had a set of EV-TL440's here which were rated at 20hz and they just hurt to listen to. These seem to go almost as low but are not painful and the definition is much better. The kind of surprising thing is the amount of bass I was missing out on with music I had no idea had notes that low in it. I mean the same songs sounded good with the MWM's but the bass is deeper and more defined and even the bass notes the MWM would play this S-MWM does so with more feeling. It is a space hog though.

  I had finished a set of 1" Baltic bass bins for a set of LSI's and had stuck one of my larger tweeters in there in the separate horn bin. I was really liking them until last night.  With the S-MWM on one channel and the beefy LSI on the other it was pretty shocking how thin and puny that poor LSI book shelf speaker sounded.

6 hours ago, glens said:

 

That may be some to do with the network you used wherein (if) the high horn was attenuated.  If there's a series resistor bypass it, or if an autoformer try another tap.  I know, it's just an interim, but at least it'll give you tunes for work on the other bin (which you'd do well to paint the innards while they're readily available, it seems).

 

I'd like to get down there some time this summer.

It has everything to do with that. I knew I would have to dial this thing in and have the Xilica and REW   ready to go to bi-amp and  set crossover points and EQ when I get back from Hope. I just cobbled something that would let me hear it. Now that KPT HF crossover was designed for the 1132 driver but a much smaller horn and the LF side crosses over higher than the final setup will. But I got to hear it. Anyone who wants to stop in is welcome just call or PM me first.

  This is not a passive crossover system with a 106" effective horn depth and will need to be time aligned in addition to the rest.

 

  I have to get an extension handle for my paint roller to finish the inside before one of you asks why I did not paint it all.  I reached in as far as I could.

[babadono]

14 hours ago, Dave A said:

This bass bin so completely overwhelms the 402 that it is ridiculous. 

Wow really? Sounds like it definitely needs an active crossover and bi amping. Which I know you going to do

[Dave A]

On 4/16/2019 at 1:55 AM, glens said:

Where's the visual on your splitter?

Here is a picture down the throat.

 

 

 

   Next here it is with woofer in place and wired ready to close up.

 

 

 

 Here is a side view and for those of you without a 402 my hi-tech modular support milk crate gives a size.

[glens]

6 hours ago, Dave A said:

Say you don't happen to have a good rocket or jet engine or helicopter recording do you? Wonder what artillery would sound like heh heh.

 

I still have a copy of a Telarc LP of Tchaikosvky's 1812 Overture from the late '70s (a photo) with the cannon shots.

 

7 hours ago, Dave A said:

I have to get an extension handle for my paint roller to finish the inside before one of you asks why I did not paint it all.  I reached in as far as I could.

 

Should have crawled inside and painted your way out.

[glens]

Dave, in case you're unfamiliar with that recording I mentioned, I found this.  Speaking of the CD pressing, they say "And if anyone can assemble a system that will reproduce those sounds cleanly, and without attenuating their low end, I would not at all be surprised to hear about broken windows."