gravy Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 I am pretty decked out with my 5.1 Home Theater system. Reference speakers RF-7s, RC7 and RS7s with Rotel 1098 preamp, 1095 and 1090 amps and two subs. I currently use a RB 1090 for 2 channel listening and 1095 for center channel (passively bi-amped) and other 2 channels for rears (I have an extra channel and no room for more speakers =) Anyway, I was thinking of trying a tube amp for some 2 channel listening. I would like to disturb my neighbors once in a while, but also enjoy listening at moderate levels. Can anyone suggest an amp that will not only sound really sweet, but will drive my RF7s effectively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 Check out this 12 watt per channel Dared VP-16 integrated amp with lots of spare vintage and new tubes...With your efficient RF-7s, 12 watts is all you need (I know for a fact, since I used this very amp with my 98.5dB Cornwalls for a few days before receiving my 8 watt 300B SET amp)! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3280&item=5738429717&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 Man don't you ever get tired of promoting these Chinese amps ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebes Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 Gravy, the handle suites you well running such great speakers! You could go classic (Scott, Fisher et al) or you could go brand new. Give the experts a price range, listening tastes etc. and they can give you more guidance. I've got a tube amp now and use it much more then my SS amps. Advice-wise, I don't qualify and am only here for various commedic interludes. They usually start with: A bear walks into a bar... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynnm Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 " Man don't you ever get tired of promoting these Chinese amps ? " I don't but then again I don't get tired of promoting quality audio equipment regardless of its country of origin. I have never subscribed to the notion that electrons have ever modified their actual behaviour on the basis of the political beliefs of their purchasers. An amp,speaker,personal vibrator will work as well as its components and design allow regardless of where it is designed or built. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 Amen, lynnm! Honestly Craig, don't you ever get tired of promoting Scotts and EICOs? Seriously, the only reason I'm "promoting" the Dared is because my brother is auctioning it on eBay...not because there's anything wrong with it, but because he's more into his HT setup and hardly ever listens to 2-channel stereo anymore. If he wasn't actually selling his amp, I most likely wouldn't have even responded to this thread...well, maybe I would have promoted my Chinese BEZ (heh)! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwc Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 Hey gravy Train, I was considering an upgrade option of tube integraded with my HOME THEATER SETUP. However, i couldn't figure out how to make the system switch from say surround coming through the front to 2 channel stereo. I'm interested on you plan here. Would your existing preamp run your tube or would you want integrated jc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 J.C.: It is always challenging for those of us who must run quality 5.1 HT and a nice two-channel setup in the same space, but it can be done. Versatility is the key. He could use a Niles DPS-1 switchbox to run two different amps to the RF-7s (Rotel and tube) and switch back and forth between the two. Some forum members use these Niles with great success and they are not that expensive ($60-$100). After I get my Dynaco Mark III tube monoblocs rebuilt, I plan on using a Niles to switch back and forth between that amp and my Marantz 8B for my Belles. If you want added versatility, he could also pick up a tube pre that has a HT bypass (like my Peach - which I love). Since I've acquired a variety of tube stuff recently, I have tried various solid state and tube combinations. Running a solid state pre (with a tube amp) can be ok, but usually it is not as nice as running a tube pre with a tube amp since your pre usually has more control over the sound. Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 ---------------- On 12/16/2004 9:43:51 PM lynnm wrote: " Man don't you ever get tired of promoting these Chinese amps ? " I don't but then again I don't get tired of promoting quality audio equipment regardless of its country of origin. I have never subscribed to the notion that electrons have ever modified their actual behaviour on the basis of the political beliefs of their purchasers. An amp,speaker,personal vibrator will work as well as its components and design allow regardless of where it is designed or built. ---------------- Lynnm, It has nothing to do with country of origin for the most part. It does have something to do with promoting these budget jobs as being the greatest option and then we find out it's his brothers auction. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 ---------------- On 12/16/2004 10:08:04 PM jt1stcav wrote: Amen, lynnm! Honestly Craig, don't you ever get tired of promoting Scotts and EICOs? Seriously, the only reason I'm "promoting" the Dared is because my brother is auctioning it on eBay...not because there's anything wrong with it, but because he's more into his HT setup and hardly ever listens to 2-channel stereo anymore. If he wasn't actually selling his amp, I most likely wouldn't have even responded to this thread...well, maybe I would have promoted my Chinese BEZ (heh)! ---------------- I suggest you do a search on the forum for the last year on how many times you pimped your Bez 300B I bet there are nearly a 100 photo's of it posted. I rarely suggest anything around here anymore. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 "I suggest you do a search on the forum for the last year on how many times you pimped your Bez 300B " About 1/3rd of the number of times I pimped Tsakiridis I guess.... Course it would be a great way to drive those RF7's.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Think new, or good condition modern used tube gear. Think saving lots of money, you'll have as much or more invested in the vintage gear that is not reliable and requires lots of maintainence (quoting Audio Flynn). As far as using tube gear with RF-7's goes, if you're happy with the speakers using solid state why would you waste money on tube gear. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviserated Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 ---------------- As far as using tube gear with RF-7's goes, if you're happy with the speakers using solid state why would you waste money on tube gear. Keith ---------------- Because if the speakers are set up properly from the rear wall, "the tube amp will most allways sound better". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audio Flynn Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Keith you are so silly. Right now I am listening to a 40 year old completely stock Eico preamp in my system. It is quite musical. Awesome electiric guitar attack and sustain on power chords! I never said "lots". Refrain from quoting me in the future. I type just fine on my own. And for me "maintaining" a fine performing vintage tube amp is a much better investment than buying some mass market SS receiver or amp (which prove themselves all the time not to be musical with horns) that once it goes out cannot be repaired and has zero value due to propriatary components or crappy design. I work with a great tech. My system makes great music. It is a pleasure to maintain vintage equipment. Like waxing a fully restored 1962 T Bird on a sunny day. Although I do buy new Klipsch... Someday I would like to have K Horns nearly as old as my amps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipsch RF7 Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Definatly get those RF-7's some quality Tube amplification ASAP!!!! Your ears and your speakers will love you for it My brother has a completely rebuilt Scott 299-C done by NOSValves and it sounds very very nice, clean low end bass, smooth highs, good soundstage from his KG 5.5 speakers with Dean G's modified crossovers. I use a pair of Rebuilt Dynaco Mark III's rebuilt also by NOSValves with my RF-7's that sport Dean G's Modified crossovers and they sound superb, I run a Klipsch RSW-15 sub for the low notes and I have a RC-7 for the center being fed by a NOSValve's rebuilt Scott 99-D mono tube amp for movies and concert DVD's that utilize a center channel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Gravy: In my last answer, I forgot to weigh in on your main question - which is "what tube amp is best for my RF-7s?" That's a tough call because driving the RF-7s with tube amps can be very tricky because the RF-7s are somewhat demanding speakers. In the past six months, I have run different tube amps with RC-7s, RB-75s, RF-7s, Belles, and my Cornwall. The one thing I learned is that all the above speakers except for RF-7s do well at all volumes with just about any tube amp. I am not sure why the RF-7s are so "picky," whether it is that they periodically dip so low (some have said as low as 4 ohms at times) or the way the twin 10 inch woofers attempt to work in unison with the single tractix horn. Whatever the dynamic is, either the woofer become distorted at higher volumes or the tractix horn does not like the load - even with nicer amps such as my rebuilt Mark III or my Marantz 8B. So - what's the point? If you plan on listening to your RF-7s at low to moderate volume levels with your tube amp (as your post indicated), all of my above comments are irrelevant, and you could experiment with a variety of amps including SET. With some of the lesser powered amps, you may not get the bass response you are used to with the Rotel, but the speakers will sound real nice. Tubes are a different world. However, if you are going to periodically push it with your RF-7s with your tube amp, then you need a tube amp that can handle their unique demands. Craig's VRDs would be ideal or another stout monobloc with at least 40 watts per channel. As it stands, my Mark IIIs are going to have to be rebuilt much better before I think about putting them again with my RF-7s. In comparison, as is, the Mark IIIs drive my Belles somewhat nicely. I still want to have Craig redo them so that they are available for my RF-7s if so desired. As Klipsch RF-7 just noted, he had Craig thoroughly redo his Mark IIIs and the results speak for themselves. Spectacular. The above is not to discourage your adventure into tube amps. I think it is worthwhile, and tubes will always remain a large part of my system. However, I just wanted to caution you a bit and go into this with your eyes open - because in my opinion, some of the traditional analysis of "this tube amp works great for my Klipsch speaker (insert model)" may not necessarily apply, at all volumes, with respect to RF-7s. Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwc Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 If my preamp is solid state and has the external inputs, Wouldn't all the processing be bypassed. This is what my manual says. For instance, let's say I purchased a Mcintosh MC 275 and connected this tube amp to my preamp. Lets also say, I purchased a Tube cd/sacd 2 channel player and hooked these in to external inputs on my preamp (front only). Would I then have essentially all "tube" sound running to my front speakers? ie: Shanling tube sacd to......external input MC MX119 (SS) preamp to ...Mac MC275 (tube) amp to ....La scalas jc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal Blacksmith Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 In my humble opinion, a tube pre-amp has more effect on the sound than the tube main amp would. That is what happened to me anyway. The last thing I upgraded was the pre-amp and it had the biggest effect of all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shade Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Gravy, I was in the same situation a few months back. I was happy with my HT, but was curious about tubes & getting a bit more out of 2-channel. I ended up purchasing a Scott 299a from another forum member that had already been worked on by NOSvalves. I'm running RF-7s as well, and have loved the sound I get with the Scott. They're great amps for the money, and if you don't like it or decide to upgrade later, you can always sell it for around what you paid. Also, whatever you purchase, the Niles amp switcher mentioned earlier is pretty good. While it would be better to have less equipment in the path, I haven't noticed any negative impact to the sound. It's nice if you don't want to crawl behind the the equipment rack and swap cables every time you want to listen to your tubes. There are many on the forum who have experience with a wider variety of tube amps than I. Just sharing my experience/opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwc Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 If my preamp is solid state and has the external inputs, Wouldn't all the processing be bypassed. This is what my manual says. For instance, let's say I purchased a Mcintosh MC 275 and connected this tube amp to my preamp. Lets also say, I purchased a Tube cd/sacd 2 channel player and hooked these in to external inputs on my preamp (front only). Would I then have essentially all "tube" sound running to my front speakers? ie: Shanling tube sacd to......external input MC MX119 (SS) preamp to ...Mac MC275 (tube) amp to ....La scalas I repeated the above description to further my inquiry. Some of the CD/sacd players claim they can hook straight into a tube amp w/o the need of a preamp. Therefore the cd players are somewnhat of a "preamp". One example is the AH! Tjeob 4000. jc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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