TheEAR Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 A bit of extra horsepower under the hood never hurt anyone. I use amps rated at 1.5X to 3X the power handling of my speakers. Headroom and freedom from compression is a good thing to have. Just purchased Parasound's JC1 monoblocks to drive my RF7's and a A21 for RF5's plus a A23 for RB5's. Why not treat your speakers right and match them to some good amps? I relegated my ATI amps to driving Paradigm Sig. mini monitors. As for my various Dynaudio they are matched with Krell,SimAudio,Bryston and all I can say is it was totally worth it. Even for sub duty why not a nice Crown iTech or MacroTech or QSC PowerLight PL380. Its all good. Amps,speakers ...audio in general the more headroom. The better,not at all needed but.Why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWL Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 ......I'm still trying to imagine what those Mac's and LaScala's sound like. Sweet. [Y] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenderbender Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 I was actually just goofing with the car analogy......you know compulsion to stir the pot.... JWC those macs are to die for!!!!!! TheEAR....I agree with having the extra HP I've seriously been thinking of a Bryston 4b sst to run my Khorns with a tube front end.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artto Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Why not treat your speakers right and match them to some good amps? I relegated my ATI amps to driving Paradigm Sig. mini monitors. As for my various Dynaudio they are matched with Krell,SimAudio,Bryston and all I can say is it was totally worth it. Amps,speakers ...audio in general the more headroom. The better,not at all needed but.Why not? "Why not treat your speakers right and match them to some good amps?" ~~~~ Why don't you treat your amps to some good speakers instead of the oversized car speakers you love so much? More and more headroom is not better when its not needed. More and more components, and more and more power, make more distortion, not less. Oh yeah, I forgot, you've got those cheap over-priced car speakers (DynaAudio's forte) ~ you can't hear the additional distortion. Nevermind [N] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 A bit of extra horsepower under the hood never hurt anyone. I use amps rated at 1.5X to 3X the power handling of my speakers. Headroom and freedom from compression is a good thing to have. Just purchased Parasound's JC1 monoblocks to drive my RF7's and a A21 for RF5's plus a A23 for RB5's. Why not treat your speakers right and match them to some good amps? I relegated my ATI amps to driving Paradigm Sig. mini monitors. As for my various Dynaudio they are matched with Krell,SimAudio,Bryston and all I can say is it was totally worth it. Even for sub duty why not a nice Crown iTech or MacroTech or QSC PowerLight PL380. Its all good. Amps,speakers ...audio in general the more headroom. The better,not at all needed but.Why not? Because........... 1) You can brag that you are only running 2 or 4 or (insert other appropriate low amount) watts through your super-duper ultra high efficiency speakers as your friends stare on in amazement (slightly drooling as they do so); and/or 2) The midrange dammit. The wonderous effects of those amps on the magical midrange - where angels sing and no mortal amps dare to trend. Carl. P.S. Fender, you should really try a Bryston with a tube front end. Was great for my ears when I had a Bryston in my system........ P.S.2: The above comments do not necessarily apply if you have gone active. Different ballgame. Eight to ten watts per channel is more than enough to drive one small horn transducer a limited frequency range - and to ridiculous volumes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenderbender Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 "P.S. Fender, you should really try a Bryston with a tube front end. Was great for my ears when I had a Bryston in my system........" I've got my eye's open ....just restored a Au-111 (to the tune of $900 with tubes) and getting a thorens TD 124 needs work also ....short on $$$$......but I'm really thinking for my next system it will be a BBXII and a Bryston 4b SST.....I love the romance of tube power amps, but I keep coming back to SS..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 8 to 10 watts,,,, I was over to Carls last saturday,,, He shure made a believer out of me..... fantastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artto Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 OK, OK!!!! You guys have convinced me. More is more and more is better. So I went and did it. I tri-amped everything. I acquired three Crown MA10000 for the bass sections of of the Khorns and Belle, and bought three Tube Research Labs GTR800 for the midrange and tweeter of each. This gives me 10Kw on each bass section plus 800w on each of the other drivers for a total of nearly 15Kw in a 5000 cubic foot room. I also had a second dedicated 100amp line pulled to the house to power this just in case there wasn’t enough power from the single 100amp dedicated line which might cause clipping. I must admit, everything sounds so much better. Now I can’t hear my wife yelling at me, or the dog barking, and my ears have been ringing for days. My wife says I’m beginning to sound like Lil’ Jon. I’m not sure what she means. My hearing is fine now that I have all this headroom. I think it really cleaned my clock. [li] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 OK, OK!!!! You guys have convinced me. More is more and more is better. So I went and did it. I tri-amped everything. I acquired three Crown MA10000 for the bass sections of of the Khorns and Belle, and bought three Tube Research Labs GTR800 for the midrange and tweeter of each. This gives me 10Kw on each bass section plus 800w on each of the other drivers for a total of nearly 15Kw in a 5000 cubic foot room. I also had a second dedicated 100amp line pulled to the house to power this just in case there wasn’t enough power from the single 100amp dedicated line which might cause clipping. I must admit, everything sounds so much better. Now I can’t hear my wife yelling at me, or the dog barking, and my ears have been ringing for days. My wife says I’m beginning to sound like Lil’ Jon. I’m not sure what she means. My hearing is fine now that I have all this headroom. I think it really cleaned my clock. Well...I guess someone needs to tell you...may as well be me... You're only halfway there now.... NOW you need to chuck your Khorns & swap them out for some Jubilees... [6] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWL Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 You forgot the 24" subs........put one in each corner. he he he [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenderbender Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 too much[][][][][][][][][][][] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artto Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Well...I guess someone needs to tell you...may as well be me... You're only halfway there now.... NOW you need to chuck your Khorns & swap them out for some Jubilees... That's already under consideration [] Although it won't add anything to the sound level capability. WWWWWWWWHAT? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artto Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Oh, I've had a quad of Hartley 24" subs stuffed under the stairs for years. They're passive radiators. [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artto Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 You seemed angry in yoru first thread and now even more angry. Your other comments seem like person attacks. Here, how about a joke to cheer you up. I learned this when I was getting my engineering degree (graduated number one). "What do you call a person who flunked out of engineering school? An architect." It was a person attack. BFD. Get over it. Yes, I was angry. I woke up, took the dog outside, went around to the front, only to find my new $200 mail box which I paid my brother-in-law to install last Sunday, smashed to the ground. GRRRRRR nEVERMIND Its back up and repaired, moved to the other side of the drive (snow plow issues) and so far everything is fine. KNOCK-ON-WOOD. That's funny, because I'll give you one guess what we used to call a person who flunked out of architecture. And not only that, you guys dress funny. [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 And not only that, you guys dress funny I too, am jealous of their pocket protectors...... [A] [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 8 to 10 watts,,,, I was over to Carls last saturday,,, He shure made a believer out of me..... fantastic. Yup I miss my 300B. 8WPC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 8 to 10 watts,,,, I was over to Carls last saturday,,, He shure made a believer out of me..... fantastic. Yup I miss my 300B. 8WPC Awwww, thanks, Maron. I've been waiting for you to come down, and it was an honor to have you and Joe over to my place to see what you guys thought. Guess I am done now, huh? [:$] Truly thanks for the compliment. BTW, just to clarify Maron's comments, my eight watts only run a pair of Altec 902 drivers - with the amp directly coupled to the drivers without a passive crossover. In comparison, there is some other "stuff" on the mid-bass, bass, and remainder of the drivers in the system. Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 artto, Dynaudio makes cheap and overpriced speakers...for cars! Who told you these lies? Dynaudio makes some of the finest speakers ,that they do not suit your taste is another thing. SimAudio MOON W5 drivers Contour S5.4's and makes them sing.It is all in the match and you know it, take K-Horns andmatch them with a zippy japanese Technics amp...you will be running to mute it and fast. FYI The Dynaudio Esotec component speakers are the finest speakers designed for car use,you would have to use Audiotechnology coupled with ribbon tweeters(RAAL for example) to surpass the "cheap" Dynes. [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClaudeJ1 Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 Funny, not ONE of you guys took my point seriously about rating amplifiers in dbWatts. The difference between a 5 and 10 watt amp, a 50 and 100 watt amp, and a 500 and a 1,000 watt amp is EXACLY the same...............only 3 dbW. JC's monster amps are only 3.8 dbW more power than the original 500 Watt amplifier that started this thread. Care to figure out how much more $$$ that extra 3.8 db costs? I think JC put them next to the LS II's just for scale. I can't imagnie him wanting to use those amps on those speakers. So if you want it DYNAMIC and louder, you can only get it with higher efficiency, and that means horns if you want to get db/Watt speaker efficiency out of the 90's and into the 100's. At 98 db efficiency, you need a 20 dbW amps (100 Watts), if you are going to be able to hit 118 db peaks.With 108 db efficiency speakersyou will only need 10 dbW (10 Watts) to do the same job.So the 98 db guy (Cornwalls come to mind) will need that 100 W amp, The all horn guy will need only 1/10th that amount of power, but he will also get about 1/30th the distortion according to PWK. With my 4 way all horn stack, I have a level of clarity and detail I never had, even with modified Khorns and LaScalas. I find myself at about 80-85 db at my listening position, with a measured 0.1 Watts input and I DO have 100 Watts per channel (only because it's what came with my receiver), so it even meets Dr. Who's 30 db headroom criteria, but I doubt if I ever even came close to that. This is the lowest distortion setup I have ever had and the micro detail I get is better than headphones. Rating amps in dbWatts would be an easier way to deal with the power requirement issues, but as long as Marketing has more clout than Engineering, it will never happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerwoodKhorns Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 You seemed angry in yoru first thread and now even more angry. Your other comments seem like person attacks. Here, how about a joke to cheer you up. I learned this when I was getting my engineering degree (graduated number one). "What do you call a person who flunked out of engineering school? An architect." It was a person attack. BFD. Get over it. Yes, I was angry. I woke up, took the dog outside, went around to the front, only to find my new $200 mail box which I paid my brother-in-law to install last Sunday, smashed to the ground. GRRRRRR nEVERMIND Its back up and repaired, moved to the other side of the drive (snow plow issues) and so far everything is fine. KNOCK-ON-WOOD. That's funny, because I'll give you one guess what we used to call a person who flunked out of architecture. And not only that, you guys dress funny. No problem. I thought that you were going to say "an attorney" is someone who flunked out of architecture school. [*-)] Fender, I just got done packaging up a pair of Bryston 7B St monoblocks to be shipped out Friday. 500/800 wpc. They only got warm driving my S800's, I can see why they have a 20 year warranty. A 4B should drive any Klipsch with ease and authority. Before you get a 4B, check out Classe amps. They make soem 100, 200 and 300 wpc mmodels. I switched to a pair of Classe CAM 350 monoblocks (350/700 wpc) and they are a little warmer. Just a little but very nice and so nicwe to look at. A good friend just bought a pair to replace his 300 wpc VTL tube monoblocks. He has Thiels, planars and B&W's, all very inefficient. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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