Gaseous subject

[Gilbert]

If the thread goes long enough, maybe someone will understand my reference...

 

Mr. Buffett I presume?

[oldtimer]

If the thread goes long enough, maybe someone will understand my reference...

Which one?

[dtel]

 

Okay, so as the % or partial pressure of CO2 rises which atmospheric gase(s) does it displace?

 

Those would be the "Flatus" gases.

 

Then It's the dinosaurs fault, and a few cavemen for leaving those gas bubbles under the ice.

[Sancho Panza]

If the thread goes long enough, maybe someone will understand my reference...

Mr. Buffett I presume?

Everybody's got they ;-) cousin in Miami.

[Sancho Panza]

I'd like to be a jellyfish,

'Cause jellyfish don't pay rent...

[oldtimer]

Trillions or millions of years of data not available? Or the cousin thing?  Data not available means nothing.  How old things are means nothing.  What matters is how the changes will affect us.  Some are predictable, like the swamping of crappy east coast cities.  The real impact is where will we be able to grow food for all the greedy gut humans out there.  And how less or more habitable certain places will become.  Immigration will seem like nothing compared to basic migration of masses of humans.

[oldtimer]

I'd like to be a jellyfish,

'Cause jellyfish don't pay rent...

They don't have a lot of things we like.

[oldtimer]

I like the Zappa-ness of your posts however.

[Sancho Panza]

^^^ no doubt I won't be able to sleep for the foreseeable future...

[T2K]

move somewhere 216' above sea level.

Keith

edit> make that current sea level

Edited May 7, 2015 by T2K

[MORE KLIPSCH PLEASE]

move somewhere 216' above sea level.

Keith

edit> make that current sea level

Damn my house is 215' 

MKP :-)

[oldtimer]

Easy enough fix.

[Travis In Austin]

Atmospheric measures of carbon dioxide (CO2) show a steady increase at a now alarming rate. CO2 atmospheric levels are at a mean high not seen in purportedly millions of years and in direct correlation with human activity. Okay, so as the % or partial pressure of CO2 rises which atmospheric gase(s) does it displace?

It is a trick question right? CO2 in the atmosphere does not stay there, about 1/3 of it is absorbed by the oceans, turning into carbonic acid and lowering the ph level (more acedic) of the ocean, which is probably a greater concern since it is a major source of O2.

The oceans have become 30% more acidic since the 1700s.

As to who would know the answer, this guy would, he, like his father before him, studies the CO2 levels in the ocean and atmosphere.

http://scrippsco2.ucsd.edu/personnel/ralph_keeling

He has published papers that when you factor in carbon absorbtion by the oceans, O2 is being depleted, but not because of displacement if I recall, but because of consumption. To burn one carbon atom, takes on average, three O2 atoms.

[babadono]

Does it really make any difference at all really, we probably won't be around to know what happens ?

 

I would think the odds of people directly ending civilization as we know it is much higher, or earthquakes, meteors, aliens, zombies................But I'd put my money on people doing themselves in, there's the real problem, greed, money and power.

 

Anyway how do they know what any levels were before people, so it's all just a big guess so lets just blame it on people, seems global warming is not living up to it's hype either, unless you just listen to a few scientist.  

Are you saying the problem is the human heart? Hmmmmmmm, I've heard that somewhere.

[oldtimer]

Feck.

[Travis In Austin]

Trillions or millions of years of data not available? Or the cousin thing? Data not available means nothing. How old things are means nothing. What matters is how the changes will affect us. Some are predictable, like the swamping of crappy east coast cities. The real impact is where will we be able to grow food for all the greedy gut humans out there. And how less or more habitable certain places will become. Immigration will seem like nothing compared to basic migration of masses of humans.

Here is one effect they no right now, today, the oceans, which are our heat buffer have risen in mean temperature, thus has increased the metabolism of little fish, so they eat more, and the stuff they eat has mercury in it (from coal burning), so their mercury levels are higher, and that multiplies all the way up the food chain.

Pregnant women are advised to consome no fish and is generally the reccomendation for small children.

Here is the best site I have found on mercury in fish.

http://www.seafoodwatch.org/consumers/seafood-and-your-health

[oscarsear]

 

Atmospheric measures of carbon dioxide (CO2) show a steady increase at a now alarming rate. CO2 atmospheric levels are at a mean high not seen in purportedly millions of years and in direct correlation with human activity. Okay, so as the % or partial pressure of CO2 rises which atmospheric gase(s) does it displace?

It is a trick question right? CO2 in the atmosphere does not stay there, about 1/3 of it is absorbed by the oceans, turning into carbonic acid and lowering the ph level (more acedic) of the ocean, which is probably a greater concern since it is a major source of O2.

The oceans have become 30% more acidic since the 1700s.

As to who would know the answer, this guy would, he, like his father before him, studies the CO2 levels in the ocean and atmosphere.

http://scrippsco2.ucsd.edu/personnel/ralph_keeling

He has published papers that when you factor in carbon absorbtion by the oceans, O2 is being depleted, but not because of displacement if I recall, but because of consumption. To burn one carbon atom, takes on average, three O2 atoms.

 

Well, I dunno any specific answer but methinx it is along these lines too.  There are natural CO2 gas sinks and reservoirs and biota that does convert CO2 into other gases.  There are deposits of methane in the oceans, etc.  Plants thrive in high CO2 environs and commercial growers will feed closed green houses with CO2 to super charge plant growth.  

 

But it just dawned on me that the historical measures (ice samples) indicate that we're in this CO2 man made cycle.  And I do not know which gas is being changed as CO2 increases nor where it goes.  Do we lose it into space?  The inert gases do not combine.  Is it O2?  N2?  Is it another gaseous greenhouse gas?  Does it matter??  

[Gilbert]

The real impact is where will we be able to grow food for all the greedy gut humans out there. And how less or more habitable certain places will become.

 

 

 

 

_{Man, 500,000 Years Aog.....}

 

_{Enjoy..... I THINK}

 

 

So there's your data, 500,000 years worth.

Edited May 8, 2015 by Gilbert

[garyrc]

Okay, so as the % or partial pressure of CO2 rises which atmospheric gase(s) does it displace?

 

I would think it would displace any and all gasses lighter than CO2, including O2.

[Travis In Austin]

Atmospheric measures of carbon dioxide (CO2) show a steady increase at a now alarming rate. CO2 atmospheric levels are at a mean high not seen in purportedly millions of years and in direct correlation with human activity. Okay, so as the % or partial pressure of CO2 rises which atmospheric gase(s) does it displace?

It is a trick question right? CO2 in the atmosphere does not stay there, about 1/3 of it is absorbed by the oceans, turning into carbonic acid and lowering the ph level (more acedic) of the ocean, which is probably a greater concern since it is a major source of O2.

The oceans have become 30% more acidic since the 1700s.

As to who would know the answer, this guy would, he, like his father before him, studies the CO2 levels in the ocean and atmosphere.

http://scrippsco2.ucsd.edu/personnel/ralph_keeling

He has published papers that when you factor in carbon absorbtion by the oceans, O2 is being depleted, but not because of displacement if I recall, but because of consumption. To burn one carbon atom, takes on average, three O2 atoms.

Well, I dunno any specific answer but methinx it is along these lines too. There are natural CO2 gas sinks and reservoirs and biota that does convert CO2 into other gases. There are deposits of methane in the oceans, etc. Plants thrive in high CO2 environs and commercial growers will feed closed green houses with CO2 to super charge plant growth.

But it just dawned on me that the historical measures (ice samples) indicate that we're in this CO2 man made cycle. And I do not know which gas is being changed as CO2 increases nor where it goes. Do we lose it into space? The inert gases do not combine. Is it O2? N2? Is it another gaseous greenhouse gas? Does it matter??

None of the gases escape, and their percentages remain constant all through the atmosphere. Any net increase in percentage of one particular gas will decrease the percentage all the other gases in a proportional amount. The 02 doesnt go anywhere, as the quote below points out, neither does the Nitrogen, Argon and all the other constituents.

Methane is a whole different issue as far as the ocean is concerned, it is trapped inder sediment, but leaks out in various ways like at the plates.

They factor in photosynthesis when looking at atmospheric O2 and CO2, and include it in their formula..

From Scripps, http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/oxygen/modern_records.html

"Trends

Oxygen concentrations are currently declining at roughly 19 per meg per year, or about 4 ppm per year. One "per meg" indicates one molecule out of 1,000,000 oxygen molecules, or roughly one molecule in 4.8 million molecules of air.

Oxygen Depletion

We are occasionally reminded that fossil fuel burning is depleting atmospheric oxygen at a rate of almost 1000 tons per second. There are about 32 million seconds in a year, so that somewhere around 30 billion tons of O2 are being converted to CO2 annually. There are about 1,200,000 billion metric tons of O2 in the atmosphere, so we can keep burning fossil fuels at the present rate for 40,000 years before we run out of oxygen. By then, all of the world's fossil fuel supply will have long since been exhausted. For a more complete, but less detailed, discussion of this topic see Et tu 02 by Wallace Broecker."