Jim Naseum Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 I still don't understand these people dying from Hydrocodone. Is the cause of death liver failure? All of the Hydrocodone prescriptions I have had and have seen all have Acetaminophen in it like 5/325. You can only have 1000-1200mg of acetaminophen in one dose which is only 3-4 pills Vicodens (4*325=1300). Simple math again here tells me 4*5=20 or 20mg of hydrocodone is killing people? I doubt it. If you were to take enough Vicodens for respritory to shut down it would have to be like 10 Vicodens (50mg of hydrocodone) which would be 3250mg of acetaminophen!!!!! I just don't see the correlation here? This most recent year is the only year hydrocodone was the number one prescribed drug? And because of that fact more people are dying from them? And specifically they are dying from the hydrocodone compound and not the acetaminophen compound? I smell BS. I still don't understand these people dying from Hydrocodone. Is the cause of death liver failure? All of the Hydrocodone prescriptions I have had and have seen all have Acetaminophen in it like 5/325. You can only have 1000-1200mg of acetaminophen in one dose which is only 3-4 pills Vicodens (4*325=1300). Simple math again here tells me 4*5=20 or 20mg of hydrocodone is killing people? I doubt it. If you were to take enough Vicodens for respritory to shut down it would have to be like 10 Vicodens (50mg of hydrocodone) which would be 3250mg of acetaminophen!!!!! I just don't see the correlation here? This most recent year is the only year hydrocodone was the number one prescribed drug? And because of that fact more people are dying from them? And specifically they are dying from the hydrocodone compound and not the acetaminophen compound? I smell BS. toxic for acetaminophen is 150mg/kg Roger. I'm sorry for your Friend's passing. I won't ask your beliefs, but I hope He is in a better place and Pain Free. john In conversation with Pharmacists I have been told it is not the Oxycodone in Percocet, or Hydrocodone in Vicodin that is the real danger. But the Acetaminophen (Tylenol) that burns out the liver. Alcohol and Tylenol just makes it happen faster. That's why they have reduced the tylenol in the compounds. I have used controlled Pain medications for over 35 years now. Been a productive member of society. Employed until my Dr. told me I could not be expected to hold any job any more. I disagreed and kept hoping to go back to work. Well finally I did not have a job to go back to. If I were to take a Nursing Job and anything went wrong while I was working against Dr.'s orders it would not be good. So I give up. I will try to live life as comfortable as I can. Deal with the BS that I will have to go through to get the pain medications that help. At least I know enough to be able to advocate for family members and advise as I see fit. Man, that is rough. I have spent many years on pain meds and held dopwn all jobs with never a single complaint from anyone. I relize medicine field may be more sensitive, but it still sucks for you. I hope life works out good for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mungkiman Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 I take a total of 45mg of OxyContin a day. I'm approaching the end of my second month. I'm not noticing any tolerance issues yet, fyi...i have taken 45mg/day for 5 years wit absolutly no changes......no issues....works grate!! Except your spelling and grammer are a little f*cked up LOL Mark agreed,,,,im as dumb as a rock, my pappy use to say!! LOL!!! Im just gald I was just bearly smart enuff to know that oxyconton is medicine and booze is for recreation! LOL you had a qwite a story their!! musta been painfull. u no the drill then! LOL!!! If nothing else, you're addicted to LOL's. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 I still don't understand these people dying from Hydrocodone. Is the cause of death liver failure? All of the Hydrocodone prescriptions I have had and have seen all have Acetaminophen in it like 5/325. You can only have 1000-1200mg of acetaminophen in one dose which is only 3-4 pills Vicodens (4*325=1300). Simple math again here tells me 4*5=20 or 20mg of hydrocodone is killing people? I doubt it. If you were to take enough Vicodens for respritory to shut down it would have to be like 10 Vicodens (50mg of hydrocodone) which would be 3250mg of acetaminophen!!!!! I just don't see the correlation here? This most recent year is the only year hydrocodone was the number one prescribed drug? And because of that fact more people are dying from them? And specifically they are dying from the hydrocodone compound and not the acetaminophen compound? I smell BS. I still don't understand these people dying from Hydrocodone. Is the cause of death liver failure? All of the Hydrocodone prescriptions I have had and have seen all have Acetaminophen in it like 5/325. You can only have 1000-1200mg of acetaminophen in one dose which is only 3-4 pills Vicodens (4*325=1300). Simple math again here tells me 4*5=20 or 20mg of hydrocodone is killing people? I doubt it. If you were to take enough Vicodens for respritory to shut down it would have to be like 10 Vicodens (50mg of hydrocodone) which would be 3250mg of acetaminophen!!!!! I just don't see the correlation here? This most recent year is the only year hydrocodone was the number one prescribed drug? And because of that fact more people are dying from them? And specifically they are dying from the hydrocodone compound and not the acetaminophen compound? I smell BS. toxic for acetaminophen is 150mg/kg Roger. I'm sorry for your Friend's passing. I won't ask your beliefs, but I hope He is in a better place and Pain Free. john In conversation with Pharmacists I have been told it is not the Oxycodone in Percocet, or Hydrocodone in Vicodin that is the real danger. But the Acetaminophen (Tylenol) that burns out the liver. Alcohol and Tylenol just makes it happen faster. That's why they have reduced the tylenol in the compounds. I have used controlled Pain medications for over 35 years now. Been a productive member of society. Employed until my Dr. told me I could not be expected to hold any job any more. I disagreed and kept hoping to go back to work. Well finally I did not have a job to go back to. If I were to take a Nursing Job and anything went wrong while I was working against Dr.'s orders it would not be good. So I give up. I will try to live life as comfortable as I can. Deal with the BS that I will have to go through to get the pain medications that help. At least I know enough to be able to advocate for family members and advise as I see fit. Man, that is rough. I have spent many years on pain meds and held dopwn all jobs with never a single complaint from anyone. I relize medicine field may be more sensitive, but it still sucks for you. I hope life works out good for you. Not to worry. Bills are all getting paid. No Financial worry's. Do miss working though. Worked since I was in grade school. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twistedcrankcammer Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 I still don't understand these people dying from Hydrocodone. Is the cause of death liver failure? All of the Hydrocodone prescriptions I have had and have seen all have Acetaminophen in it like 5/325. You can only have 1000-1200mg of acetaminophen in one dose which is only 3-4 pills Vicodens (4*325=1300). Simple math again here tells me 4*5=20 or 20mg of hydrocodone is killing people? I doubt it. If you were to take enough Vicodens for respritory to shut down it would have to be like 10 Vicodens (50mg of hydrocodone) which would be 3250mg of acetaminophen!!!!! I just don't see the correlation here? This most recent year is the only year hydrocodone was the number one prescribed drug? And because of that fact more people are dying from them? And specifically they are dying from the hydrocodone compound and not the acetaminophen compound? I smell BS. I still don't understand these people dying from Hydrocodone. Is the cause of death liver failure? All of the Hydrocodone prescriptions I have had and have seen all have Acetaminophen in it like 5/325. You can only have 1000-1200mg of acetaminophen in one dose which is only 3-4 pills Vicodens (4*325=1300). Simple math again here tells me 4*5=20 or 20mg of hydrocodone is killing people? I doubt it. If you were to take enough Vicodens for respritory to shut down it would have to be like 10 Vicodens (50mg of hydrocodone) which would be 3250mg of acetaminophen!!!!! I just don't see the correlation here? This most recent year is the only year hydrocodone was the number one prescribed drug? And because of that fact more people are dying from them? And specifically they are dying from the hydrocodone compound and not the acetaminophen compound? I smell BS. toxic for acetaminophen is 150mg/kg Roger. I'm sorry for your Friend's passing. I won't ask your beliefs, but I hope He is in a better place and Pain Free. john In conversation with Pharmacists I have been told it is not the Oxycodone in Percocet, or Hydrocodone in Vicodin that is the real danger. But the Acetaminophen (Tylenol) that burns out the liver. Alcohol and Tylenol just makes it happen faster. That's why they have reduced the tylenol in the compounds. I have used controlled Pain medications for over 35 years now. Been a productive member of society. Employed until my Dr. told me I could not be expected to hold any job any more. I disagreed and kept hoping to go back to work. Well finally I did not have a job to go back to. If I were to take a Nursing Job and anything went wrong while I was working against Dr.'s orders it would not be good. So I give up. I will try to live life as comfortable as I can. Deal with the BS that I will have to go through to get the pain medications that help. At least I know enough to be able to advocate for family members and advise as I see fit. Man, that is rough. I have spent many years on pain meds and held dopwn all jobs with never a single complaint from anyone. I relize medicine field may be more sensitive, but it still sucks for you. I hope life works out good for you. Not to worry. Bills are all getting paid. No Financial worry's. Do miss working though. Worked since I was in grade school. Thanks John! I hope the best for you, but I am sure you will not miss some of the A-hole Docs, or any of "The Entitled" patients that think it is there right to treat you like you are beneath them. Good Luck Buddy! Roger 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornman Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 She does have a gun in the nightstand beside the bed. Doesn't do much good if you don't know someone is there though. Yes they caught him. It's a second degree felony. Thanks guys. I know sometimes ppl here disagree but i find most times we can talk and debate like adults and i appreciate that. Btw they won't give another prescription even under these circumstances. I'll live of course just have to hurt for the next 2 weeks. Done it before and i can do it again. Won't be in a very good mood though. So sorry for your situation, the response & lack of replacement did not surprise me at all. So perverse, but thats the way things are rolling. ugh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 "The Entitled" patients that think it is there right to treat you like you are beneath them. No one has that right in any situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twistedcrankcammer Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 "The Entitled" patients that think it is there right to treat you like you are beneath them. No one has that right in any situation. Happens ALL the time, especially in the ER. ER was my least favorite rotation and this is exactly the reason I refuse to do it. People on government assistance come in because they want an excuse to get off welfare labor because they have back pain (kinda hard to prove someone is faking) or their little Johnny has the sniffles. I can't afford to take my kid to the ER for the sniffles! Some even ride the squad in because they don't have to pay for it! They get there, and 12 relatives show up. They know all the ins and outs and all want free snacks, heated banket.... always! They waste all of your time so you can't see the people who are actually sick, and treat you as if they are entitled and your sole job is to personally wait on them, all the while you are thinking, "I am the one working to pay for them to be here!" I HATE ER!!! Roger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted July 24, 2015 Moderators Share Posted July 24, 2015 I still don't understand these people dying from Hydrocodone. Is the cause of death liver failure? All of the Hydrocodone prescriptions I have had and have seen all have Acetaminophen in it like 5/325. You can only have 1000-1200mg of acetaminophen in one dose which is only 3-4 pills Vicodens (4*325=1300). Simple math again here tells me 4*5=20 or 20mg of hydrocodone is killing people? I doubt it. If you were to take enough Vicodens for respritory to shut down it would have to be like 10 Vicodens (50mg of hydrocodone) which would be 3250mg of acetaminophen!!!!! I just don't see the correlation here? This most recent year is the only year hydrocodone was the number one prescribed drug? And because of that fact more people are dying from them? And specifically they are dying from the hydrocodone compound and not the acetaminophen compound? I smell BS. Article by Forbes that speakes a little about liver toxicity with acetaminophen. But no ddtail on deaths. http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidkroll/2014/08/22/what-you-need-to-know-about-new-restrictions-on-hydrocodone-combinations/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted July 24, 2015 Moderators Share Posted July 24, 2015 In 2009 therenwas apparently a pill junket between Kentucky and Florida, n with overdoses happening backnin Kentucky. http://www.kentucky.com/2009/04/12/758845_ky-sees-rise-in-overdose-deaths.html?rh=1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted July 24, 2015 Moderators Share Posted July 24, 2015 Drug overdoses in Utah http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/51689248-78/prescription-drugs-drug-watson.html.csp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted July 24, 2015 Moderators Share Posted July 24, 2015 Journal of American Medical Association on overdose deaths. http://jama.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=1653518 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 This has got to be one of the most depressing threads I've ever been a part of. I have a very long story about my wife, but no longer have time to tell it. The short version is that after two years of watching her not be able to move around and do anything, and so miserable I used to hold her hand while she cried in her sleep - we finally have a diagnosis of Vasculitis and IBD. She is currently on steroids for Microscopic Colitis, and after she finishes (three months), she will begin the Methotrexate. Neither of us are much pleased about any of this. But I would imagine that at some point she's going to have to be put on something to help with the pain. Cymbalta has been doing an amazing job, but if it ever starts to fail to do its job, I will probably push for Tramadol. I'm still reeling from some of these stories, especially Cornman's. I think that one struck just a little too close to home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Naseum Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 Whats not documented here are the many millions of sucess stories of people helped by these very pain meds. The ending of untold suffering and pain, the increased life goals, the improvements in families. It would be wrong to see this as just so many overdose deaths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest thesloth Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 (edited) Once agian the numbers are flawed, or at the very least misleading. The correlation between death and opiate based pills is rubbish. A quote from that JAMA article: "Among overdose deaths involving opioid analgesics, the pharmaceuticals most often also involved in these deaths were benzodiazepines (5017; 30.1%), antidepressants (2239; 13.4%), antiepileptic and antiparkinsonism drugs (1125; 6.8%), and antipsychotics and neuroleptics (783; 4.7%)." If used correctly and NOT mixed with other drugs that potentiate it, opiate based pain medication is very safe and hardly toxic to our bodies. Not to mention it works very well. It's when people want to get high and chase that high into larger and larger doses, this is misuse of medication of course you can die. Also people are mixing pain medication with other medication where the physiological effects for each individual person is just to unclear to be safe. I do understand people need to be on several medications at once but educating yourself on drug interactions is key. DO NOT EXPECT DOCTORS TO DO THIS FOR YOU. YOU NEED TO DO IT YOURSELF. I have had a doctor give me tramadol and cyclobenzaprine because he "didn't want people getting hooked on dope". So I guess he would rather have me suffer a siezure from mixing the two drugs he prescribed. I don't see that doctor anymore. Edited July 24, 2015 by thesloth 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Naseum Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 The baseline analysis is: How effective is this for medical use? Not, how many criminals are using this? How many crazy drug addicts are using this? Imagine if that was the main analysis for guns! Baseline: these opiates are highly effective for pain, and are very easy on the liver and kidneys compared to all other anelgesics. Better than NSAIDS, better than aspirin, better than acetaminophen, and for god sake way better than psychotropic drugs like cymbalta. Downsides: yes, you can become dependent and in some case addicted, but responsible people - like actual medical patients - can be weaned off thisd drug with a minimum of fuss using Suboxone. etc. If my problem disappear tomorrow, I will go to doc and say, "time to get me off opiates." She will send me right to the Suboxone doc, and in 3 weeks or so, I will be off. Big deal. I hatee that the main discussion is always shifted from legit medical patients and their doctors to crazy drug addicts and criminals. Would we ban money because criminals are using it in the drug trade? Make every money user sign a "money contract" and be subject to intrusive banking searches? mostly, "very healthy people" who never have experienced serious chronic pain or disease resent people on opiates - lets face it. And, cops and dea and pols and lawyers are endlessly looking for more pie to stick their fingers into. more ways to arrest and hassle and criminalize people. . 25000 people a year die in car wrecks. sad, but true. some people die from abusing opiattes, sad but true. Leave the sick people to deal with their disease and their doctors, and stop trying to push them around to make your egos feel better. focus on pill factories if you like. I, and others with sickness, have nothing to do with them. this whole fiasco reminds me of: 2002 TSA agents looking up 90 yr old grannies skirt, and feelin up her boobs for bombs. looking dipers of 3 yr old girls for bombs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest thesloth Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 How about two administrations (Bush/Obama) compiling large troves of information that they got from "wire tapping" the good citizens of America and lying to them telling them they were not. Then saying it's for out protection. Our government lies through it's teeth on a daily basis until the evidence piles up, then they make excuses for their actions. ALL of it is greed and power driven. Don't think for one minute this coutry wants to help each and every person, they don't. If you are sick they don't want to take care of you, they want you to die. It's sad but true. The real people in power are some of the wealthiest and most influential people in the world, they have more than enough money to pay for their own healthcare from their pick of top tier doctors. The rest of us get what is still better then in most countries so I don't want to get to whiney. I just read some stories from folks on here and what they are suffering through due to the government witholding proper healthcare. It's ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel's wife Posted July 24, 2015 Moderators Share Posted July 24, 2015 Please stay on topic. No politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted July 24, 2015 Moderators Share Posted July 24, 2015 Apparently, this guy started it all. A Physican from Syracuse, New York who first petitioned the FDA to upschedule HCPs back in 1999. A pain specialist who also specialized in addiction. He was probably was on loan from the CIA to the NSA at the time. Travis http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2013/10/syracuse_doctor_paved_the_way_for_tighter_controls_on_highly_addictive_painkille.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Naseum Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 paste operated a family practice in his native Brewerton for 47 years until he retired in 2007. He started a clinic at the former St. Mary's Hospital on Court Street in Syracuse in 1968 to treat military veterans returning from the Vietnam War addicted to heroin ================= doesn't sound that much like a pain management specialist to me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted July 25, 2015 Moderators Share Posted July 25, 2015 paste operated a family practice in his native Brewerton for 47 years until he retired in 2007. He started a clinic at the former St. Mary's Hospital on Court Street in Syracuse in 1968 to treat military veterans returning from the Vietnam War addicted to heroin ================= doesn't sound that much like a pain management specialist to me. That was all clearly a front set up by the DEA, NSA and the CIA. http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/10/28/business/fda-shift-on-painkillers-was-years-in-the-making.html?referrer= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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