Jim Naseum Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Precisely the point. They don't cost that much, and NOBODY has to buy them. That's what a free market is all about. Totally in favor of it. What I am NOT in favor of is a servant class. Cook up a pot of beans and cornbread if you don't want to pay a fair price for someone else to cook your meal. Works for me. Dave I'm sympathetic to your argument. It's part of the problem, where the other part is that since WWII, the national ethos has drifted to dog eat dog. There's just no unity of purpose left at all.Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyrc Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 While now the exception, they are still out there and I drive MILES to get to one to avoid the other. When I lived in the SF Bay area, I used to drive across Oakland and most of Berkeley to get a burger from a little joint I liked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilbert Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Oh, but it is! Try having some employees and see what happens to your profits. Been there, done that. Started one guy at 12.00 an hour and raised his pay to 35 an hour within a year without him asking. Dave That was pretty selfish and greedy of you not to give everyone an across the board $35 raise. By being selective and rewarding only a deserving person, you destroyed the motivation and drive of the others too succeed... or at least that's how I rationalize it.[emoji6] Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woofers and Tweeters Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Yeah, 50 years ago these we're jobs for kids saving for a car. Now that all the adult jobs have been shipped offshore, this is the crap job left for adults trying to live and raise a family. Have any of you actually seen these people or do you breeze by them like they are ghosts you can't even see. Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Shipped offshore because of LABOR RATES. It's now happening in China. They are offshoring to cheaper labor countries. You keep saying that greed is a new thing. THAT IS A FALSE STATEMENT. You saying it doesn't make it true. Business people have been down right ruthless, keep prices as high as the market will stand, labor as low as it will retain workers and try to put the competitors out of business. Companies are in business to make a profit. The larger the profit, the better for investors' retirements. Have you or Dave answered: WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WITH EVERYONE ELSE'S PAY WHO WAS MAKING ~ $15/HR? The ones who EARNED their way up from $7.50 to $12, the ones who EARNED the $16, are you going to bump their pay up by 100% or only give them a $7.50/hr raise? Several people have asked this. Please feel free to ignore this again. What about the tougher jobs where a factory already pays 15, then someone can quit to work at an easier job for the same pay? Sorry Dave's Burgers went out of business. They are great people. Sorry that they depleted their nest egg to keep people working while keeping cost down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 That's what a free market is all about. Totally in favor of it. ... says the minimum wage proponent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Started one guy at 12.00 an hour and raised his pay to 35 an hour within a year without him asking. Why? Because if you didn't someone else would have and you would have lost a good employee. You paid him what he was worth and didn't arbitrarily increase his pay "just because". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Naseum Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Yeah, 50 years ago these we're jobs for kids saving for a car. Now that all the adult jobs have been shipped offshore, this is the crap job left for adults trying to live and raise a family. Have any of you actually seen these people or do you breeze by them like they are ghosts you can't even see. Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Shipped offshore because of LABOR RATES. It's now happening in China. They are offshoring to cheaper labor countries. You keep saying that greed is a new thing. THAT IS A FALSE STATEMENT. You saying it doesn't make it true. Business people have been down right ruthless, keep prices as high as the market will stand, labor as low as it will retain workers and try to put the competitors out of business. Companies are in business to make a profit. The larger the profit, the better for investors' retirements. Have you or Dave answered: WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WITH EVERYONE ELSE'S PAY WHO WAS MAKING ~ $15/HR? The ones who EARNED their way up from $7.50 to $12, the ones who EARNED the $16, are you going to bump their pay up by 100% or only give them a $7.50/hr raise? Several people have asked this. Please feel free to ignore this again. What about the tougher jobs where a factory already pays 15, then someone can quit to work at an easier job for the same pay? Sorry Dave's Burgers went out of business. They are great people. Sorry that they depleted their nest egg to keep people working while keeping cost down. 1. I didn't say greed was a new thing. 2. I answered your question about the pay off others in post 771. I gave a direct, explicit, definitive answer. Read more carefully, please. 3. Now, I have a question for you. How do you inform yourself on economic issues? What are the sources of your information, and what do you study? Which economists do you follow? What business press do you follow? Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 What's wrong with a servant class if the servants are well cared for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Yeah, 50 years ago these we're jobs for kids saving for a car. Now that all the adult jobs have been shipped offshore, this is the crap job left for adults trying to live and raise a family. Have any of you actually seen these people or do you breeze by them like they are ghosts you can't even see. Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Shipped offshore because of LABOR RATES. It's now happening in China. They are offshoring to cheaper labor countries.You keep saying that greed is a new thing. THAT IS A FALSE STATEMENT. You saying it doesn't make it true. Business people have been down right ruthless, keep prices as high as the market will stand, labor as low as it will retain workers and try to put the competitors out of business. Companies are in business to make a profit. The larger the profit, the better for investors' retirements. Have you or Dave answered: WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WITH EVERYONE ELSE'S PAY WHO WAS MAKING ~ $15/HR? The ones who EARNED their way up from $7.50 to $12, the ones who EARNED the $16, are you going to bump their pay up by 100% or only give them a $7.50/hr raise? Several people have asked this. Please feel free to ignore this again. What about the tougher jobs where a factory already pays 15, then someone can quit to work at an easier job for the same pay? Sorry Dave's Burgers went out of business. They are great people. Sorry that they depleted their nest egg to keep people working while keeping cost down. 1. I didn't say greed was a new thing. 2. I answered your question about the pay off others in post 771. I gave a direct, explicit, definitive answer. Read more carefully, please. 3. Now, I have a question for you. How do you inform yourself on economic issues? What are the sources of your information, and what do you study? Which economists do you follow? What business press do you follow? Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk "Which economists do you follow?" What a joke of a question. What's this supposed to accomplish? Which economists have solved the problems we are debating? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 That was pretty selfish and greedy of you not to give everyone an across the board $35 raise I was already paying them 35.00 an hour. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 What's wrong with a servant class if the servants are well cared for? Good point. Actually, why pay them at all if they are well cared for. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 (edited) Because if you didn't someone else would have and you would have lost a good employee. You paid him what he was worth and didn't arbitrarily increase his pay "just because". Same thing either way. Actually, it shocked the bejeebers out of him and he became even more productive. Dave Edited November 16, 2015 by Mallette Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Even though you read it carefully, it still seems to me you missed the part above Maybe because it's BS. 9 to 15 dollars isn't 67% and the one percent company has to raise their prices as well. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Naseum Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Yeah, 50 years ago these we're jobs for kids saving for a car. Now that all the adult jobs have been shipped offshore, this is the crap job left for adults trying to live and raise a family. Have any of you actually seen these people or do you breeze by them like they are ghosts you can't even see. Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Shipped offshore because of LABOR RATES. It's now happening in China. They are offshoring to cheaper labor countries.You keep saying that greed is a new thing. THAT IS A FALSE STATEMENT. You saying it doesn't make it true. Business people have been down right ruthless, keep prices as high as the market will stand, labor as low as it will retain workers and try to put the competitors out of business. Companies are in business to make a profit. The larger the profit, the better for investors' retirements. Have you or Dave answered: WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WITH EVERYONE ELSE'S PAY WHO WAS MAKING ~ $15/HR? The ones who EARNED their way up from $7.50 to $12, the ones who EARNED the $16, are you going to bump their pay up by 100% or only give them a $7.50/hr raise? Several people have asked this. Please feel free to ignore this again. What about the tougher jobs where a factory already pays 15, then someone can quit to work at an easier job for the same pay? Sorry Dave's Burgers went out of business. They are great people. Sorry that they depleted their nest egg to keep people working while keeping cost down. 1. I didn't say greed was a new thing.2. I answered your question about the pay off others in post 771. I gave a direct, explicit, definitive answer. Read more carefully, please. 3. Now, I have a question for you. How do you inform yourself on economic issues? What are the sources of your information, and what do you study? Which economists do you follow? What business press do you follow? Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk "Which economists do you follow?" What a joke of a question. What's this supposed to accomplish? Which economists have solved the problems we are debating? It's a technical problem and a social problem. I can easily see by reading jwebers posts where he gets his social viewpoint. I can't see where he gets his technical understanding of the micro economics involved. I know of no economist who poses his questions. I made the assumption that everyone arguing the technical question here has some kind of technical guidance.Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted November 16, 2015 Moderators Share Posted November 16, 2015 Are you referring to the economy? That's what my comments were addressing. Banking, industry, trade, wages, taxes, hedge funds, corporations, investments, insurance, health care, welfare, farming, and all that. Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk That, too. Tainted dog food. Fraudulent knock-offs. Lead-painted children's toys. Much less regard for others than we show. But why is that? It isn't because of morality. Our legal system is what keeps things in check, especially in the area of products. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted November 16, 2015 Moderators Share Posted November 16, 2015 While now the exception, they are still out there and I drive MILES to get to one to avoid the other. When I lived in the SF Bay area, I used to drive across Oakland and most of Berkeley to get a burger from a little joint I liked. Which one? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Naseum Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Are you referring to the economy? That's what my comments were addressing. Banking, industry, trade, wages, taxes, hedge funds, corporations, investments, insurance, health care, welfare, farming, and all that. Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk That, too. Tainted dog food. Fraudulent knock-offs. Lead-painted children's toys. Much less regard for others than we show.But why is that? It isn't because of morality. Our legal system is what keeps things in check, especially in the area of products.And it's only mildly successful.Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilbert Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 (edited) Yeah, 50 years ago these we're jobs for kids saving for a car. Now that all the adult jobs have been shipped offshore, this is the crap job left for adults trying to live and raise a family. Have any of you actually seen these people or do you breeze by them like they are ghosts you can't even see. Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Shipped offshore because of LABOR RATES. It's now happening in China. They are offshoring to cheaper labor countries. You keep saying that greed is a new thing. THAT IS A FALSE STATEMENT. You saying it doesn't make it true. Business people have been down right ruthless, keep prices as high as the market will stand, labor as low as it will retain workers and try to put the competitors out of business. Companies are in business to make a profit. The larger the profit, the better for investors' retirements. Have you or Dave answered: WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WITH EVERYONE ELSE'S PAY WHO WAS MAKING ~ $15/HR? The ones who EARNED their way up from $7.50 to $12, the ones who EARNED the $16, are you going to bump their pay up by 100% or only give them a $7.50/hr raise? Several people have asked this. Please feel free to ignore this again. What about the tougher jobs where a factory already pays 15, then someone can quit to work at an easier job for the same pay? Sorry Dave's Burgers went out of business. They are great people. Sorry that they depleted their nest egg to keep people working while keeping cost down. 3. Now, I have a question for you. How do you inform yourself on economic issues? What are the sources of your information, and what do you study? Which economists do you follow? What business press do you follow? Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk That QA response is a load of crock. Why don't you quote the economist who believes raising min. wage is a solution, and don't forget to include their qualifications and political affiliation. As for me, I've lived it, and have seen it played out countless times during my life, and every time it's the same. It's like a big pile of dog poop, you don't have to get down on your knees to know it stinks. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk Edited November 16, 2015 by Gilbert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Are you referring to the economy? That's what my comments were addressing. Banking, industry, trade, wages, taxes, hedge funds, corporations, investments, insurance, health care, welfare, farming, and all that. Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk That, too. Tainted dog food. Fraudulent knock-offs. Lead-painted children's toys. Much less regard for others than we show.But why is that? It isn't because of morality. Our legal system is what keeps things in check, especially in the area of products.And it's only mildly successful.Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Mildly? Instead of thinking about what slips through,, think about what it would be like without it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Naseum Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 Resentment against workers earning a minimum wage should be contrasted against owners and investors getting "guaranteed profits" through the process of regulated prices, in commodities like electricity, water and communications. What's good for the choose is not good for the gander? Should we end utility regulation too? Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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