Do I need to replace my diaphragms in all my horns for my 1980 LaScala's?

[bsacco1]

I recently acquired some vintage 1980 LaScala's. I immediately called Klipsch to order a pair of fresh K33 woofers. 

 

The crossovers were tired and I think leaking so I upgraded the x-overs. 

 

After listening to the speakers they seemed too bright and a bit shrill with a tab bit of distortion.

 

Is the answer as simple as Do I replacing my diaphragms in all my horns or is it a problem with the x-over?

 

Please advise.

[Bacek]

What do you meant by upgraded x-over? What you exactly did.

 

Why did you replaced woofers?

 

Before "immediately" anything I would first listen to them to learn how they sound.

[CWOReilly]

26 minutes ago, bsacco1 said:

I recently acquired some vintage 1980 LaScala's. I immediately called Klipsch to order a pair of fresh K33 woofers. 

 

The crossovers were tired and I think leaking so I upgraded the x-overs. 

 

After listening to the speakers they seemed too bright and a bit shrill with a tab bit of distortion.

 

Is the answer as simple as Do I replacing my diaphragms in all my horns or is it a problem with the x-over?

 

Please advise.

I’d double check the crossovers. 

[OO1]

- what network version is it  AA .,  AL    are the networks and capacitors   klipsch or not klipsch 

- are the mids drivers  and Tweeters  klipsch  or somethin  else 

[Deang]

Nothing was purchased from me. So I guess another faux “upgrade” from you know who. 

[Peter P.]

8 hours ago, bsacco1 said:

I recently acquired some vintage 1980 LaScala's. I immediately called Klipsch to order a pair of fresh K33 woofers. 

 

The crossovers were tired and I think leaking so I upgraded the x-overs. 

 

After listening to the speakers they seemed too bright and a bit shrill with a tab bit of distortion.

 

Is the answer as simple as Do I replacing my diaphragms in all my horns or is it a problem with the x-over?

 

Please advise.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

If you weren't experiencing a problem; if you didn't test the capacitors with an ESR meter or test for an out of range capacitance value

I see no reason to replace them.

 

I'm with Bacek on this.

[jjptkd]

9 hours ago, bsacco1 said:

I recently acquired some vintage 1980 LaScala's. I immediately called Klipsch to order a pair of fresh K33 woofers. The crossovers were tired and I think leaking so I upgraded the x-overs. After listening to the speakers they seemed too bright and a bit shrill with a tab bit of distortion. Is the answer as simple as Do I replacing my diaphragms in all my horns or is it a problem with the x-over?

 

Please advise.

 

 Woofers take some time to break in that could be a contributing factor plus depending on which capacitors are in the new crossovers they could lean towards the brighter side. Diaphragms do wear out so replacing them should improve distortion but probably not the brightness. 

 

 Lots of things can contribute to the sound you're hearing equipment matching and room acoustics are a couple of big ones also speaker placement and listening position can alter the sound. Hard to know for sure what's going on without more information. 

[Deang]

2 hours ago, Peter P. said:

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

If you weren't experiencing a problem; if you didn't test the capacitors with an ESR meter or test for an out of range capacitance value

I see no reason to replace them.

 

I'm with Bacek on this.

Sometimes there is a thin layer of oil on the surface of the can. You can feel it on your hands after handling. They should be replaced at that point. No reason to wait until it’s leaking on the board. I’ve measured a lot of these over the last year and ESR is typically twice that of a new Mylar - around .80

 

To the OP. A low ESR polypropylene will tip the balance forward. The speaker will be too bright, almost painfully so at live listening levels. 

[Deang]

Bob never called his networks “upgrades”. He never wavered on this.
 

I am very much on the record of not liking the sound of any of the Heritage networks built with the Sonicap. Bob was very well aware of this and mostly just found it amusing.

[KT88]

On 11/1/2023 at 3:39 PM, bsacco1 said:

I recently acquired some vintage 1980 LaScala's. I immediately called Klipsch to order a pair of fresh K33 woofers. 

 

The crossovers were tired and I think leaking so I upgraded the x-overs. 

 

After listening to the speakers they seemed too bright and a bit shrill with a tab bit of distortion.

 

Is the answer as simple as Do I replacing my diaphragms in all my horns or is it a problem with the x-over?

 

Please advise.

I have the impression that many new owners of old vintage Klipsch speakers always act much too fast and are much too impatient. Replacing the bass chassis would be the least sensible thing to do. My 1977 bass chassis in my Lascala play like the first day. You should innovate a little more systematically. As DeanG says, first swap the caps for polyester types if the original Aerovox are damp. Later change the rubber rings between K55V and K400, they are mostly crumbled but very important for good sound. The diaphragms of the K55V could...later then maybe also be exchanged. The K77M tweeter should be completely ok if they are still original. You can remove one of the diodes in the tweeter circuit to open this circuit. There is not much more to do. Maybe you can reseal the bottom plate with insulating tape to be able to drive the K33 full bass. Many new owners are not only impatient but they are doing way too much. Worst if you do everything at the same time.

[KT88]

29 minutes ago, soundbound said:

 

You’re correct, Bob never called his crossovers upgrades, but Michael is entitled to his opinion.

 

I agree with what Bob thought. I find your opinion amusing too. I have Crites Sonicap capacitors crossovers in my Klipschorns and they sound great and everyone who listens to them agrees and many who have Sonicap capacitors in their Heritage likes them.

 

 

Most of them may never have listened to the „right“ capacitors to have a fair comparison against the Sonicap sound They just think it is good but it is not.. I can say that I had a BC AA xover as a replacement of my original AA bought in 2009 because the original caps were leaking. At that time I was not in DIY but now I am. That purchase was a big mistake. Not only that the original great sound is back since I replaced the Sonicaps against the right capacitors, also the autoformer was completely wrong in the BC xover, no comparison with the original T2A.

[OO1]

Heintz is entitled to his opinion     

[OO1]

17 minutes ago, soundbound said:

 but it doesn’t make them right.  

well , you're not fair at all    ,   Heintz  used an aftermarket  as a replacement for years  , come to find out  the original 45 year old parts that were put away    performed better , this confirms what klipsch  said all along  

[Bubo]

On 11/1/2023 at 9:39 AM, bsacco1 said:

I recently acquired some vintage 1980 LaScala's. I immediately called Klipsch to order a pair of fresh K33 woofers. 

 

The crossovers were tired and I think leaking so I upgraded the x-overs. 

 

After listening to the speakers they seemed too bright and a bit shrill with a tab bit of distortion.

 

Is the answer as simple as Do I replacing my diaphragms in all my horns or is it a problem with the x-over?

 

Please advise.

 

Probably not

I had the same question a few weeks ago

my concern was degradation of the phynolic sp material

the answer was unless they were used wide open and hot

then they were probably just fine.

 

Intelligibility on mine is excellent, so I left them alone.

[KT88]

1 hour ago, soundbound said:

 

Again, it’s only his opinions. He’s happier after he soldered in a few new capacitors which proves nothing to anyone else. He’s not done any actual research and do you even now what that requires? It’s apparent you don’t. 

This „few new caps“ were not soldered in by trial and error, I strictly followed the recommendation which were given officially here in the Forum by Roy Delgado. He did long term testing of different caps to replace worn out Aerovox caps and his final result one can purchase at JEM in the US or I bought equal Polyester types in Europe adding for the same values. I only followed this path and I am happy with the result. 

From this point of view, you are assuming the wrong things, I am not posting any "listening impressions" of any randomly purchased capacitors in this high-class forum. The same is absolutely true for the only choice of the really correct T2A autotransformer. If your tone was a little less derogatory this planet would be a better place.

 

[KT88]

18 minutes ago, soundbound said:

 

Recommendations are not enough proof. I don’t go on just someone’s words. Post the documents of those testing research results.

 

 

 

You didn’t even buy the recommended brand, that’s not good.

 

 

That’s good for you, but you can’t make a blank statement saying everyone will be happy with, or even get your results.

 

 

Your listening impressions are your only verification without research documentation by you proving your bettered results.

 

 

 

Post the documentations of proof.

 

 

That’s your opinion, but doesn’t make it true. Questioning someone’s statements is part of how we learn more and move forward. If we just take anyone’s words as facts we’d still be living in the past. Your not happy about my postings asking for your actual research documentation proof and not agreeing with your blank opinions statements stating you’re right and others just don’t know enough to know they’re wrong. To me your tone needs to a little less derogatory for this planet to be a better place and now does my opinion of you demonstrate how opinions operate and vary from individuals perspectives?

 

Thank you for going to so much trouble for me, a complete text analysis, what have I done to deserve this. I'm just an average sound and music lover, but maybe I should buy some very professional measuring equipment, an anechoic chamber and a lot of other things I should have before I post anything here about electronic parts which have been proved by authorities.. But I'm not quite sure if it would give you enough comfort. Frankly, I don't think arguing about different brands of polyester caps is a good idea, and it also seems a bit obsessively neurotic to me...supposedly in the service of science and absolute accuracy.

[billybob]

17 hours ago, KT88 said:

18 hours ago, soundbound said:

Expand  

Most of them may never have listened to the „right“ capacitors to have a fair comparison against the Sonicap sound They just think it is good but it is not.. I can

Likely just your last sentence above that set off this. Other words maybe less offensive.

Understand the meaning since consider you are not a native speaker.

Could be wrong of course.

As to the anecdotal, I consider it correct with no need for evidence. Personal taste in music and sound more often than not, can and will differ. Measuring is just a tool.

Thanks for your opinion.

[KT88]

10 minutes ago, soundbound said:

 

You’re welcome.

 

 

You’re a good forum member and I’m helping you learn somethings. Sometimes you can learn things from those who disagrees with you. I’ve learned a lot from those who’ve disagreed with me once I’ve thought it out and changed my mind toward their points of views.

 

 

You should and post their proof too.

 

 

 It would.

 

 

Me either, but you brought it up in this thread and Klipsch only recommends one type and ( brand ), so they are the only correct ones to use from their recommendations.

soundbound, I think it's about time we had a cold beer together and listened to some good music. I mean that wholeheartedly, honestly and not sarcastically. @billybob it wasn't meant to offend anyone, sorry if it came across that way.

[henry4841]

Capacitor talk in a thread on this forum seldom ends well. 

[billybob]

3 minutes ago, henry4841 said:

Capacitor talk in a thread on this forum seldom ends well. 

Lol, yes about like trying to convince someone of a point of view... cool.