Fine Cutlery

[fuzzydog]

I know there are some foodies on here so I thought i'd poll the group on your cutlery preferences.

My two primary kitchen knives are a Zwilling J.A. Henckels "Professional S" series 7" Santoku and a Wusthof "Classic Ikon" 8" chef knife.

I find myself using the Henckels knife more than the Wusthof as I seem to prefer the tip heavy balance of the Santoku shape and the slimmer handle on the Henckels (i have an older one which has a slimmer handle than their current crop).

I've been doing a little research and found knives that range in hardness from 57 rockwell up to 63 rockwell. I imagine that it would hold its edge longer but be more difficult to sharpen and more brittle.

Is harder steel necessarily better?

I don't have any experience with Shun knives, but the outer damascus layer they put on them is attractive.

Anyone use a carbon steel knife instead of stainless steel?

[Brac]

I love a really good knife, so I keep Forschner's because when the wife cuts something on a plate it doesn't mean a divorce.

[mungkiman]

I have long been a fan of Henckels, but Wusthof makes excellent knives.

Top Japanese brands include Shun, and Kyocera. The latter are ceramic, which I have no personal experience with, but they are said to hold their edge at least 10 times longer than even high carbon steel.

[WMcD]

I bought some Wurstoff for the new condo and unfortunately don't use them too much because I'm not entertaining too much these days.

One of my thoughts comes from woodworking magazines. Woodworkers put a very fine edge on chisels to cut wood -- particularly going down from coarse to medium to fine and to a very fine and hard whitestone. This is to eliminate the saw-like teeth on the edge.

I think a razor needs this also to cut hair (reportedly the harness of un-alloyed copper) with a wedge of steel but not cut skin with ragged teeth.

The story goes that a woodworker was sharpening the wife's knives down to the pike / whitestone level, which would have been good for wood or a razor but she said the knives didn't work well. Then he tried again but stopping at the coarse stone. She said they were much better, just as good as her Ginzu knives.

My read is that kitchen knives need saw-like teeth you get from a coarse stone to saw though vegetables and meat. A round file can be helpful to them back into alignment. But what is "sharp" depends on what you are cutting.

WMcD

[oscarsear]

Get a good kitchen knife. Sharpen it before you use it. Wash it, dry and sharpen after you use it. Sharpen before and after each usage. Keep it where the blade does not touch any surfaces. It will always be plenty sharp for kitchen applications.

[fuzzydog]

I have long been a fan of Henckels, but Wusthof makes excellent knives.

Top Japanese brands include Shun, and Kyocera. The latter are ceramic, which I have no personal experience with, but they are said to hold their edge at least 10 times longer than even high carbon steel.

I own a ceramic folding knife made by Boker. The ceramic is very sharp and holds its edge, but can be prone to chipping if used improperly (by your college roommate). It is also very lightweight which can be a positive if you're carrying it in your pocket, but the light weight is also something of a drawback when it comes to the balance and handling of the tool.

[willland]

Either Wusthofs or Henckels are hard to beat but I use Sabatier Classic(made in France) which I found a bit cheaper at the time. My 8" chef's knife is used the most with the 5" serrated bagel/tomato knife used second most.

Is harder steel necessarily better?

Harder steel has more carbon and stays sharper longer but "stains" easier. Less carbon stainless steel like 304 is softer and practically rust resistant and will take an edge easily but does not remain sharp after only a few uses. As mentioned, knives should be sharpened/honed before use, hand washed/dried after use and sharpened/honed and wiped clean before storage in a wood block or case.

Bill

[JerolW]

I've got a nice 9" Messermeister. Holds an edge and has good balance.

jerol

[BigStewMan]

when did you folks get so dignified? Cutlery. I'm from Oakland … we call them knives, and my favorite is a switchblade.

[steve sells]

This seems like a typical thread from another forum I hang out at. As a bladesmith I have my own opinions about what blades should and should not be. Most of the brands mentioned I have experiance with, and they are fine blades. I disagree about 304 as a blade steel tho. 304 it is not used for any serious blades, only for the bolsters and other knife hardware.

As for the choice of stainless or high carbon steels... my experiance has caused me to feel that the material a maker uses is not as important as much as the heat treat being correct for that steel chosen, and the angle of the cutting edge. Personbally I prefer high carbon for most things, but that is due in part because I do my own heat treating and most stainless steels are a pain to heat treat, so I hire them to outside sources. A good blade should not need sharpening very often if cared for properly. As already covered, simply hand wash and dry, then place them in a good place, Not in a dishwasher then into a pile in a drawer to have the edges abused.

One brand not mentioned is Onterio. I have a few that have been in my kitchen many years, and they have served me well.

[runninshine]

Great topic, something the guys I used to cook with might talk about after a busy shift and having a few drinks. Wusthof knives have always felt great in my hand and having 10 years on them they have held up wonderfully.

[willland]

I disagree about 304 as a blade steel tho. 304 it is not used for any serious blades, only for the bolsters and other knife hardware.

Actually my dive knife was 304 SS(which makes sense) but it would not hold an edge for nothing.

Bill

[tigerwoodKhorns]

Our favorite knife by far is a cheap pairing knife that I got for free from a distributor of restaurant supplies almost 20 years ago. (Puratos). The knife is serrated with wide gentle serrations, but the thing that makes it so nice is that it is very thin. We almost never sharpen it and it goes through everything so nice and smooth.

Anyone know of a set of thin knives?

[Boxx]

we call them knives, and my favorite is a switchblade.

[oldtimer]

Apparently the Shun knives are thin. We have a set of Wustofs and a set of Henkels four star so we pretty much are good for life on kitchen knives. High carbon stainless steel seems a reasonable compromise for most uses. My wife likes the cheap ceramic blade for everyday cutting use, but they just aren't made for serious chef knife usage.

[Max2]

The problem with high dollar manufactured Kitchen knives is that no one wants to tend to them these days, so they call 440 steel with a tad of carbon "High carbon stainless" which is a marketing ploy. They do this so you can put them in a dishwasher and only get a speck or two of rust even though they act like, "don't dare do this!". A truly high content carbon blade needs to be cleaned, dried and lightly oiled (with cooking oil of course) after every use. The very high carbon content offers the sharpest edge, but the quicker the corrosion will start. The best kitchen knives I own are custom ground and cut from old crosscut saw blades, Im sure folks here have some. They don't make good pocket knives from all the maintenance, but it doesn't matter for the kitchen and you don't need 15 of these. 2-3 good kitchen knives and you can throw that littered chopping block away. However, you don't put these in the dishwasher or your edge will be gone and you will have a totally rusted blade. They're not for everyone, but if you cut a lot, especially meat and veggies, they will make a believer out of you AND you don't need a serrated blade shredding your meat as they are viciously sharp and will go through a light density loaf of bread like butter and without tearing.

[wstrickland1]

We bought a set of Cutco knives from one of my son's high school friends. We really like them but we're not very serious users. We were just being nice to the kid. It beat just giving her money for graduation...

[fuzzydog]

http://middletonmadeknives.com/index.htm

I've been trying to justify in my mind buying a new kitchen knife from this local guy.