Mallette Posted January 24, 2018 Author Share Posted January 24, 2018 1 minute ago, richieb said: And so long as idiots remain systems will be overridden. Precisely why the steering wheel should go away ASAP. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 3 minutes ago, Jeff Matthews said: Seems like information that important ought to at least be on the window sticker. It's interesting that this is a known issue, and still, it's allowed on the road. I guess you gotta test, but sounds a bit dangerous if that parked car was full of kids. You're gonna have to idiot proof these things or corporations are going to go broke fielding law suits. If you have to put disclaimers on coffee cups what kind of precautions will you need on AVs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 2 minutes ago, Mallette said: I know you are in the business...but fact is that some of us DO read the manual. Futurist fantasizer as I may be, fact is I am a realist. I ain't sucking a bong and having a whisky for a while in an AV until the owners manual says it's OK. So do you think you're the exception or the rule? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richieb Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 35 minutes ago, Mallette said: Precisely why the steering wheel should go away ASAP. Dave Aw come on now, Dave. My car still has a steering wheel and I have never, I swear never, steered it into a Big Red siren screamin' fire truck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted January 24, 2018 Author Share Posted January 24, 2018 1 hour ago, richieb said: Aw come on now, Dave. My car still has a steering wheel and I have never, I swear never, steered it into a Big Red siren screamin' fire truck. Precisely my point. Machines don't think like we do. Actually, as of the moment they don't think at all. That's what makes them reliable. Once they're told to not drive into a "Big Red siren screamin' fire truck" neither they, nor any that come after, will ever do so. Works for me... Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasubandu Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 I cannot believe that you guys are still at it. This is going to happen, and like everything else in human history, we will make a mess of it at first, and then things will get better until we make the next mess. And people will fight change because they always do. But you guys are all focused on this like it is the only automation coming, and everything else is going to change too. My questions are what work will people have to earn the money to use autonomous cars and where are they going to go in a world where life exists on a flat screen? Take commuting and shopping out of your life and why do you need a car at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muel Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 Funny... what does NEED have to do with anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJkizak Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 8 hours ago, vasubandu said: I cannot believe that you guys are still at it. This is going to happen, and like everything else in human history, we will make a mess of it at first, and then things will get better until we make the next mess. And people will fight change because they always do. But you guys are all focused on this like it is the only automation coming, and everything else is going to change too. My questions are what work will people have to earn the money to use autonomous cars and where are they going to go in a world where life exists on a flat screen? Take commuting and shopping out of your life and why do you need a car at all? Just think when Quantum Teleportation hits the market and in the beginning you lose an arm and a leg and maybe something else dear to your well being. JJK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted January 24, 2018 Author Share Posted January 24, 2018 1 hour ago, JJkizak said: Just think when Quantum Teleportation hits the market and in the beginning you lose an arm and a leg and maybe something else dear to your well being. Already sounds safer than the current system... Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richieb Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 10 hours ago, vasubandu said: I cannot believe that you guys are still at it. This is going to happen, and like everything else in human history, we will make a mess of it at first, and then things will get better until we make the next mess. And people will fight change because they always do. But you guys are all focused on this like it is the only automation coming, and everything else is going to change too. My questions are what work will people have to earn the money to use autonomous cars and where are they going to go in a world where life exists on a flat screen? Take commuting and shopping out of your life and why do you need a car at all? Aw, come on now. This coming from someone who joined in Dec/2017 and already with nearly 600 posts?! Seems quite a number of those would fall under your "are you still at this"? Just sayin' - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDBRbuilder Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 When cars start "driving themselves", our taxes will go up...WAY UP! Can you imagine how much money the court systems and the police will lose over all the tickets they CURRENTLY issue related to driving?? How can they fine somebody if that somebody is NOT the driver?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted January 24, 2018 Author Share Posted January 24, 2018 3 hours ago, HDBRbuilder said: When cars start "driving themselves", our taxes will go up...WAY UP! Taxes will change, but the savings in unnecessary infrastructure will be trillions. OTOH, I know a few towns that pay for themselves with speed traps that will need to find another revenue source. Also, don't forget the huge savings in insurance, legal, and medical that stem from the death, injury, and property damage from human drivers. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 What of motorcycles Dave? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted January 24, 2018 Author Share Posted January 24, 2018 13 minutes ago, CECAA850 said: What of motorcycles Dave? No interest in them. AVs will avoid them nicely compared to humans. They will still have speed limits when AVs don't...so they may be banned from freeways. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 3 minutes ago, Mallette said: No interest in them Somehow I can't picture you on a bike but I don't see bikes going AV. It will be interesting to watch this paradigm shift unfold but for now, I need to get a sports car and enjoy it while I can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted January 24, 2018 Moderators Share Posted January 24, 2018 On 1/22/2018 at 8:21 PM, DrWho said: How many of them are car enthusiasts? I'd imagine the car enthusiasts just don't end up buying them.... I consider Top Gear (the old Top Gear with Clarkson) to be one of the best representations for the car enthusiast. They have nothing but railed on Tesla from the very beginning. But it's not just Top Gear - I've not read a single review from anyone that enjoys driving for the sake of driving talk about it as being an excellent driving experience (yes I know, you can find car magazines that speak highly, but they're motivated by other things). The suspension rides horribly and makes you feel disconnected from the road, the brakes feel weak because the car ways a million pounds, the car rolls a ton despite its low CG (the much higher mass has the same effect as moving the CG higher when comparing against a lighter car). The seats are uncomfortable, most of the interior doesn't follow any ergonomic standard. You just feel disconnected from the road, but not in a comfortable luxurious way. Ya sure, it accelerates quick from a stop, but that gets boring after a while. It's just not confidence inspiring and you spend all your time analyzing if you have enough energy to arrive to your destination. It's just an incredibly unrelaxing experience....always making me nervous about everything. And if you do any spirited driving, then you gotta watch out for the braking system just deciding to turn off as you fight with all your might to keep the car from flying off the corner. The Model S can't even do one lap around a track like VIR before going into limp mode. Now compare that to the Chevy Bolt....which is an incredibly fun car to drive, despite being slower and having way less features. The thing is, a car enthusiast doesn't car about the tech or engineering details. Car enthusiasts just enjoy the process of driving. Sure, I might follow the tech to understand what I might like, but at the end of the day the Bolt is such a joy to drive. It's comfortable, puts you in touch with the road, inspires confidence, doesn't fight against you, etc.... and I've never worried about the braking system turning off on me. I have no idea if it could do a lap at VIR, but it certainly didn't complain when I drove the snot out of one just a few months ago. Trail braking in a Bolt? Heck ya. I wouldn't feel confident attempting that in a Model S. I know the pure car enthusiast is a minority, and Dave thinks they're all going away once AV's take over, but dang it I love driving. I just don't get pleasure from the Model S....and I went into it thinking it was one of the coolest things ever. I was even skeptical of Clarkson until driving one - and then it all made sense what he was saying. I'm surprised companies don't hire him to do consulting. Anyways, just one ignorant man's opinion....please don't be annoyed if you love the Model S. It's just not a sports or luxury car in my book. At that price point you could be in an Evora, or DB9, Porsche 911, or have three Bolts! Haha. You got spoiled driving my Jag @DrWho Your standards for luxury cars are way too high now.😀 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted January 24, 2018 Moderators Share Posted January 24, 2018 14 hours ago, vasubandu said: I cannot believe that you guys are still at it Because we are still waiting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasubandu Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 4 hours ago, richieb said: Seems quite a number of those would fall under your "are you still at this"? Nope, this is the first, and I hope you understood that I meant it tongue in cheek. I was laughing, not being critical. And this thing has been entertaining, both in the sense of sharing actual information, and for sport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDBRbuilder Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 3 hours ago, Mallette said: Taxes will change, but the savings in unnecessary infrastructure will be trillions. OTOH, I know a few towns that pay for themselves with speed traps that will need to find another revenue source. Also, don't forget the huge savings in insurance, legal, and medical that stem from the death, injury, and property damage from human drivers. Dave There will be no savings whatsoever until EVERYBODY is letting their mode of transportation drive itself...so that savings will be a VERY LONG TIME in arriving. It very well could cause a COSTLY INCREASE in infrastructure before it is all over and done with, because you cannot FORCE people to own self-drive transportation...which could very well lead to separate lanes for HUMAN vehicle drivers, ONLY! Keep in mind that classic cars don't drive themselves...therefore classic car runs will end up in other dedicated lanes or routes. I can just see the Amish in self-driven horse buggies...ROFLMAO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Richard Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 And where do motorcycles fit in with all of this half baked "technology"? I don't want one of these experiments anywhere around me when I'm on the BMW and one of these things doesn't "see" me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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