Moderators dtel's wife Posted May 15, 2015 Moderators Share Posted May 15, 2015 Why isn't the coach being held accountable, just as Sean Payton was? I don't understand why he is above punishment? The NFL ruled that because Payton was the coach he should have known? Why is the Patriot's coach being held to a lower standard?The Saints and the Patriots are actually two different animals. Patriots - playing with nerf balls.....Saints - placing monetary contracts on players for injuries or putting one out of the game. This can permanently damage a person for life or worse. Money was also the incentive for doing these actions. The two cases are apples and oranges. I'm aware of the differences in the allegations. However, the NFL suspended Payton because "he should have known" because he was the coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 (edited) What I don't understand is why the team was punished for something that Tom Brady took it upon himself to do. We need our resident expert Mr. dwi Lawyer to give us a definitive answer, but I don't think Brady is accused of "doing" anything. He is not accused of letting or ordering the balls deflated. I think he is being accused of "he knew what was going on but didn't say anything." Please correct me if I am wrong. Edit: I just re-read, so also correct me if your point was why is the PATRIOT ORGANIZATION being punished. +++ I nominate Mr. DWI Lawyer to be the Official Klipsch Forum Expert on this because he has taken the time to read the entire 200+ page NFL report on this and he seems to have some pretty solid reasoning behind his opinions. I have no interest except it is a topic we discuss here, so here and ESPN segments is where I get most of my information. Edited May 15, 2015 by wvu80 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted May 15, 2015 Moderators Share Posted May 15, 2015 Well I think there are a number of issues that are going on here. One goes back to Godell's mishandling of the Ray Rice incident. A 2 game suspension for spousal abuse. Then the video goes public. NFL tries to say they weren unaware of video which hotel and/or police vehemently deny. NFL gets women across the country majorly pissed off, they are going to pull their kids out of football, not allow them to attend NFL games. Godell then gives Rice and indefinite suspension. He appeals to an arbitrator and wins. NFL starts to run PSAs about spousal abuse. The next issue is there are allegations brought to NFL about the inflation if the NE footballs long before this playoff game. The NFL does nothing. No investigation, no inquiry. The NFL looks like they are covering up for one of their most powerful owners, Kraft, who was a supporter of Godell when people said he should be fired over Ray Rice affair. The NFL now has the playoff game where other team tests an intercepted ball and informs refs. They test all NE footballs, only have time to test 3 Indy footballs. They reinflate them and game proceeds, but media has it now. There are allegations that one of the footballs cannot be located because one of the officials has taken one and sold it, it caught and fired. This looks like it has no truth whatsoever. Godell hires lawyer and firm that has been doing NFL work to do an "independent" investigation. and they spend "millions" on investigation. It all comes down to which gauge the ref used to test the footballs before the game. The ref says he canmot remember. One reads higher than the other by .3 to .4 psi. If they were tested with the higher reading gauge then all of the balls were under inflated. If they used the lower reading pregame, 9 of the 12 balls are where the NFL's expert would expect them to be by halftime if they were at 12.5 lbs psi pregame according to the Ideal Gas Law. The report does not mention this fact, but mentions the raw data, mor does the report explain how they reached the conclusion that the ref must have used the higher reading gauge even though the official says he canmot remember which one he used. The Report says that Brady was "generally aware." This was because his name was mentioned in texts. There is nothing that I saw in the report that shows the coach had any knowledge, general or specific. I believe they had more of a link in the Saints case, but I have not looked at all. I have not read the explanation on why the penalty on the team, but it came from 3rd in command and not Godell. That is best I can do for now while I am on the road. Travis 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Great summation Travis. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Next will be the trial where Roger will be the judge and witness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted May 15, 2015 Moderators Share Posted May 15, 2015 (edited) Well it is a long road they have to go, but it seems to me that there are problems right within the report itself. But with Godell deciding to take this on himself, like Detel's wife said, it may all fall on deaf ears. It is very difficult to overturn an arbitration decision, so whatever he decides will probably stick, but it has happened recently to the NFL In the Adrian Peterson case. Edited May 18, 2015 by dwilawyer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 I can't wait to see him cross examine himself. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel's wife Posted May 15, 2015 Moderators Share Posted May 15, 2015 I could be entirely wrong. I think Goodell is just too egotistical to admit he or anyone associated with his organization is wrong. Not to mention, he would have to reverse the findings of the million dollar investigation. On the other hand, Kraft does have a lot of influence on his buddy, Goodell. Will definitely be interesting. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted May 16, 2015 Moderators Share Posted May 16, 2015 (edited) I think you are right, very hard to reverse himself. However if he thinks he might be out of a 35M dollar a year job, he might just reconsider. I really think it is going to depend on just how strong a case they can make, I think it is going to have to be strong enough to really convince a majority of owners. Edited for dictation errors, typos and etc. Edited May 18, 2015 by dwilawyer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 This one has ugly written all over. Super sized egos on both sides and money is no object. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Next will be the trial where Roger will be the judge and witness. So...if Goodell gets on the stand, asks himself if he is a liar, and he says "yes" does this mean he is telling the truth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 That all depends on what your definition of is is. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators dtel Posted May 18, 2015 Moderators Share Posted May 18, 2015 I think most people kind expect a little more at 35m a year ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie dave Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 Kraft accepts the Pats punishment, possibly to have goodell recuse himself from arbitrating Brady's case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Richard Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 The Saints and the Patriots are actually two different animals. Patriots - playing with nerf balls.....Saints - placing monetary contracts on players for injuries or putting one out of the game. Not the point... Goodell has gone on record saying Peyton should have known what was going on within his team, ignorance is no excuse. Now it is an excuse? Especially in light of the Pat's head coach's history of cheating? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 Pats said they will accept the punishment and want the talk to go away. I wonder if Brady will follow suit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DizRotus Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 Go away or accept the punishment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 Go away or accept the punishment? That's the question. What will he decide? He can act independently of the organization if he chooses. Guess he'll have to ask Gisele what to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonzo Posted May 20, 2015 Author Share Posted May 20, 2015 Pro sports is an interesting phenomena from a business stand point. The workers, or players, tend to make lots more money than their supervisors/managers. I can't think of any other business where that's the case. So, a head coach/manager is supposed to be able to discipline, or at least hold accountable, his/her players for his or her actions. Often times, the player suffers little consequence from "middle management" due to the massive compensation they receive. However, lower paid managers can be gone when one of the stars has an issue because the franchises ability to win more games can be determined by the stars lack of production. Ergo, the lower paid management is held to a much higher standard for lower compensation in most cases. Can you imagine a Vince Lombardi, Tom Landry, Don Shula etc. taking crap from a player and not putting them in their place for fear of getting fired because the prima donna multi-millionaire athlete might get their feefee's hurt and wine to the owners and the press? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 The workers, or players, tend to make lots more money than their supervisors/managers. I can't think of any other business where that's the case. Lot's of commissioned sales people make more than their managers in various fields. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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