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John Warren

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You should put it back. John earned the use of that response.

Made me LOL

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Gents, I didn't go through the entire thread.  Just cleaned up the elementary school stuff in the last page or so.  I don't like locking threads but will do so if it goes south again or if the OP requests it.  No more post hiding.  Warning points next, and don't laugh.  I don't do "1."  I do nine to start, and one more from that gets all your posts moderated before being seen until the individual has acting like an adult for long enough to satisfy the moderators. 

 

Dave

Edited by Mallette
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This was John's thread, and Al had no business trolling in it. Though subtle and veiled, the personal attacks on John started almost immediately. There was a reason Amy banned Al, and it doesn't look like he learned anything during his absence.

 

 

 Yep, that's why I got banned!   I will be happy to be banned again.  Then I will be needing another sock puppet.  Are you up for the job again Dean?  You did a real good job on the Eliptrac HF thread a while ago!  There was always a need on this forum for somebody to identify the snake-oil. It always seems to get interpreted as a personal attack, no matter how carefully the critique is crafted. I might as well go for it!  An another thing, I don't need this forum to sell my stuff!  I got all the work I can handle and then some. That's why I foolishly let you build my Universal! NEVER AGAIN!

 

Al K.

 

Edit: 

 I forgot to mention: Dean, you shouldn't feal slighted. There's lots if insults scattered around this thread for you too! :D

Edited by Al Klappenberger

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This was John's thread, and Al had no business trolling in it. Though subtle and veiled, the personal attacks on John started almost immediately. There was a reason Amy banned Al, and it doesn't look like he learned anything during his absence.

 

 

 Yep, that's why I got banned!   I will be happy to be banned again.  Then I will be needing another sock puppet.  Are you up for the job again Dean?  You did a real good job on the Eliptrac HF thread a while ago!  There was always a need on this forum for somebody to identify the snake-oil. It always seems to get interpreted as a personal attack, no matter how carefully the critique is crafted. I might as well go for it!  An another thing, I don't need this forum to sell my stuff!  I got all the work I can handle and then some. That's why I foolishly let you build my Universal! NEVER AGAIN!

 

Al K.

 

Edit: 

 I forgot to mention: Dean, you shouldn't feal slighted. There's lots if insults scattered around this thread for you too! :D

 

Well then Al, why don't you just go away, and stop wasting everyone's time, and server storage space.  If you don't really care, and you think we're all just a bunch of morons, what's the point?  If it will make you feel any better, I sold the networks I mistakenly purchased from you a couple of years ago, when I realized how cheaply they were built, so we don't have any connection, other than this forum, which you are about to leave, again, because, you don't care....

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Gents, I didn't go through the entire thread.  Just cleaned up the elementary school stuff in the last page or so.  I don't like locking threads but will do so if it goes south again or if the OP requests it.  No more post hiding.  Warning points next, and don't laugh.  I don't do "1."  I do nine to start, and one more from that gets all your posts moderated before being seen until the individual has acting like an adult for long enough to satisfy the moderators. 

 

Dave

 

Hi Dave-

 

Fair enough. Needless to say, You know that it did make you snicker a bit didn't it?  C'mon, you can admit it, it WAS funny?

 

jw

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C'mon, you can admit it, it WAS funny?

 

Really didn't look at context, just the images.  I'm  good with a laugh, especially at myself.  However, what I noted was simply juvenile behavior.  I came here as a result of a Forum member reporting this thread, "on patrol," which is something I really don't do as I find this forum generally takes care of itself. 

 

While I don't moderate for this I find anyone claiming to know what someone else hears as arrogance of the worst order.  I don't like Schoenberg, but I don't call it crap as there are far greater minds than mine who find extraordinary qualities in him.  I think pricey speaker wire is a waste of MY money, but don't look down my nose at those who spend more and hear a difference...the issue may well be my hearing. 

 

It's fine to have opinions about music and audio.  It isn't fine to ridicule others because they have a different POV.  They're here, they're queer, so get used to it.  Diversity is a GOOD thing.  And I used that word in it's classic, now rehabilitated sense.  Glad it's back.

 

Dave

Edited by Mallette

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Comedy, and education, sounds like a recipe for a great thread. That was one of the funniest images I have ever seen posted.

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I'd like to make t-shirts with that particular plot...

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This was John's thread, and Al had no business trolling in it. Though subtle and veiled, the personal attacks on John started almost immediately. There was a reason Amy banned Al, and it doesn't look like he learned anything during his absence.

Yep, that's why I got banned! I will be happy to be banned again. Then I will be needing another sock puppet. Are you up for the job again Dean? You did a real good job on the Eliptrac HF thread a while ago! There was always a need on this forum for somebody to identify the snake-oil. It always seems to get interpreted as a personal attack, no matter how carefully the critique is crafted. I might as well go for it! An another thing, I don't need this forum to sell my stuff! I got all the work I can handle and then some. That's why I foolishly let you build my Universal! NEVER AGAIN!

Al K.

Edit:

I forgot to mention: Dean, you shouldn't feal slighted. There's lots if insults scattered around this thread for you too! :D

You were banned and we were working together, so posting on your behalf made sense. This situation is obviously a bit different, since you are no longer banned. Having Lee post for you while you followed along with emoticons had to be one of the stupidest things I'd ever seen.

Believe me when I say this, I have no interest in building anything off of that bloated menu of yours. I'm glad you have a lot of work, but I feel sorry for you, knowing how sick you are of building that "entry level, obsolete" network.

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Fair enough. Needless to say, You know that it did make you snicker a bit didn't it? C'mon, you can admit it, it WAS funny?

 

It was only funny to me!  To the general public is was juvenile and obscne!  :emotion-41:

 

AL K.

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Dean,

 

You wrote: Using a 100 watt amplifier, a tweeter with an 18dB/octave slope, crossed over at 5000Hz, will receive 1.6 watts from the amplifier. That same tweeter, crossed over at the same 5000Hz with a first order or 6dB/octave filter, will get hit with 25 watts.

 

I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and express your statement in terms of what you probably meant to say. Otherwise it is meaningless.

 

For a 1st order HP filter with a crossover frequency, Fc of 5 kHz, power is reduced by 6.02 dB at each octave frequency below Fc. For example, at 2.5 kHz, power will be -6.02 dB (1/4th or 25 w); at 1.25 kHz, power will be -12.04 dB and so on. For each higher order filter, the power reduction will increase an additional -6.02 dB per octave.

 

Lee

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Dean,

 

You wrote: Using a 100 watt amplifier, a tweeter with an 18dB/octave slope, crossed over at 5000Hz, will receive 1.6 watts from the amplifier. That same tweeter, crossed over at the same 5000Hz with a first order or 6dB/octave filter, will get hit with 25 watts.

 

I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and express your statement in terms of what you probably meant to say. Otherwise it is meaningless.

 

For a 1st order HP filter with a crossover frequency, Fc of 5 kHz, power is reduced by 6.02 dB at each octave frequency below Fc. For example, at 2.5 kHz, power will be -6.02 dB (1/4th or 25 w); at 1.25 kHz, power will be -12.04 dB and so on. For each higher order filter, the power reduction will increase an additional -6.02 dB per octave.

 

Lee

 

I didn't even need my glasses for that.

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I didn't even need my glasses for that.

 

Had mine.  Didn't help. 

 

Dave

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This was John's thread, and Al had no business trolling in it. Though subtle and veiled, the personal attacks on John started almost immediately. There was a reason Amy banned Al, and it doesn't look like he learned anything during his absence.

 

 

 Yep, that's why I got banned!   I will be happy to be banned again.  Then I will be needing another sock puppet.  Are you up for the job again Dean?  You did a real good job on the Eliptrac HF thread a while ago!  There was always a need on this forum for somebody to identify the snake-oil. It always seems to get interpreted as a personal attack, no matter how carefully the critique is crafted. I might as well go for it!  An another thing, I don't need this forum to sell my stuff!  I got all the work I can handle and then some. That's why I foolishly let you build my Universal! NEVER AGAIN!

 

Al K.

 

Edit: 

 I forgot to mention: Dean, you shouldn't feal slighted. There's lots if insults scattered around this thread for you too! :D

Al it sounds like you are asking to get banned and I would hate to see you not participate on this forum. You would be missed my me and many others for your knowledge and experience with Klipsch speakers. It would be the forums loss if it happens. I have took your advice many times with my Klipsch speakers for a better sound. Please tone it down and stay to the benefit of the members here.

Hopeful, but not likely. What's the Over/Under?

post-13028-0-09820000-1445786935_thumb.p

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Lee. That works too.

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I think I'm officially bowing out of this thing and taking a very long break. It's been real.

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Don't leave Dean, we just got started!

 

Ok, let's look at the ALK so-called "universal" loaded with the Klipsch K401+PD5VH and the Klipschorn folded bass unit.

Super-imposed over that plot is the network I designed for the Selenium + B&C driver, MODIFED a wee bit for the K401+PD5VH (let's call it the NRE-net for purposes of this thread).

 

For those of you not aware, the PD5VH is the K55 Klipsch midrange compression driver

 

This first plot is the Impedance and phase plotted using the typical non-microwave engineer approach.  As is shown in the plot, a few points to consider: 

 

1.  The NRE-net has a very large reactance associated with the autotransformer, horn reflections, etc.  The reactance is highlighted by our little mountain climber (let’s call her Belle).

 

2.  Below about 500Hz, the two plots meld together as the K-horn Z dominates at lower frequencies.

 

3.  The BULK of amplifier power is delivered to the Klipschorn bass unit so amp loading, if altered in anyway why the speaker loading, is going to be the result of this reactance.

 

4.  Now, the midrange on the ALK is sort-of constant Z but it's over a region where the amp really doesn't care.

post-864-0-58940000-1445791698_thumb.png

Edited by John Warren

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Now, this  second plot is Z-complex of the ALK so-called “universal”.  The little pink tail is the reactance of the midrange region of the Z-plot.  The large blue is the Klipschorn Z, (not a silly box to “replicate”, it’s the real thing).  Again, the Plot shows all sorts of reactance that the amp has to deal with.

 

No constant Z anywhere to be seen either.

post-864-0-41020000-1445791771_thumb.png

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This third plot is the Z-complex of both the ALK so-called “universal” super-imposed over the NRE-net.  The large blue “loop” is the reactance peak that Belle was hiking in the first plot.   Compare it to the red tail on the ALK, that’s the difference-it is substantial.

post-864-0-89300000-1445791830_thumb.png

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